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Old 05-05-2018, 07:12 PM   #15
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No, not a flatbed. I swear all of these towing insurance companies are incompetent by design. Knowing the rear caliper already started a fire and blew the inside tire, they sent a wrecker that was unable to change a tire... knowing that I had a spare ON A RIM.....what the?

I dont like being on the shoulder of an interstate. So we limped it three miles to the next exit and went to a truck stop with no brakes and me using the emergency brake to stop us. That was fun!
I take it the fire melted the brake line? Any damage to the RV from the fire?
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Old 05-05-2018, 07:12 PM   #16
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I would also look into replacing the brake line at the caliper. I had the same issue and it turned out being the brake line at that caliper had collapsed internally. I replaced all 4 myself.
Great add to the discussion and worth checking.
I had the same issue after many successful yrs after the Bosch recall was done.
One Front caliper was hanging & creating a pull to one side.
Turned out to be an internally collapsed brake line.
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Old 05-05-2018, 08:18 PM   #17
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No, not a flatbed. I swear all of these towing insurance companies are incompetent by design. Knowing the rear caliper already started a fire and blew the inside tire, they sent a wrecker that was unable to change a tire... knowing that I had a spare ON A RIM.....what the?

I dont like being on the shoulder of an interstate. So we limped it three miles to the next exit and went to a truck stop with no brakes and me using the emergency brake to stop us. That was fun!
Wow now I know why you said it was a real Charlie Foxtrot. We had driven ours for 100 miles without it locking up after my mechanic cleaned it. I was behind in the car and caught it happening again because I could smell it. It never got blazing hot had it gone on I'm sure it could have ended like yours.

Because of this, part of my investment in all this is a TPMS. I had been waffling because I couldn't pick a model. Looks like the TST 507 color. Too bad there aren't ever any deals on them.
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Old 05-06-2018, 05:26 AM   #18
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Yep, the color 507 was/is in the 'Que', but I went the rear track bar first.....shoulda just bought both. Between tires and suspension upgrades, I am well over $5k.

The CF just gathered more energy. Waited about 3 hrs for wrecker that could not tow because he was not equipped to change the tire and remove caliper.

Before FMCA dispatched a service truck, I got the guys at Loves shop to do it for $45. Then it was too late to get the tow truck back and get to the Workhorse dealership before they locked the gates at 8pm. Blowout happened around noon.

So spent the night at Loves

I think a regular hyd arm HD tow truck is ok, or is a flat tow really needed for my 33 footer?
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Old 05-06-2018, 05:42 AM   #19
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Here is a more detailed thread along with real color fo-toes:

http://www.irv2.com/forums/f107/2004...ml#post4174208
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Old 05-06-2018, 06:42 AM   #20
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Well. It is expensive.. Ther was a recall on brake calipers for Workhorse, I do not know the status of Workhorse so do not know the status of the recall. the brakes are "3rd party" so it may be the recall is still in effect only with the brake manufacturer, not worknorse who basically bolted it on.. OR NOT. as I said. I DO NOT KNOW.. (I'd like to however)

your question in teh subject line translates to is 120/hr excessive?
Well. TO answer that I'd need to know how much the mechanic actually makes. Let's see 25/hr yes it is excessive 48/hr about right, in fact just right.. But how many sops pay the technicians 48/hr

(The proper charge is 2.5 what they pay the Technician not counting bendfits if the SHOP provides the tools. Less if the mechanic uses his own tools).
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Old 05-06-2018, 07:48 AM   #21
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disc brake stainless steel shims and brake caliper lock up

I've been working on coaches (moho's) since 1980. Here is my 2 cents worth. first, some brake pads come with anti-squeal stainless steel shims built onto the pads. They will be at least $100 for a set for both rear wheels. These pads are what keep the brakes from locking up. With no stainless shims you should use a coat of silicon on the back of the pad to allow the caliper to "release" after it has been applied. Silicon will work in a pinch but wears out fast!!!! You must have one or the other or you will end up with what you have now. I've seen mechanics throw away the stainless shims, they can be reused over and over again until they are damaged and no longer will stay in place. I prefer the shims because I believe they work better.

When a caliper fails to retract you end up with glazed pads. The surface on the pad gets hard, kind of like a glazed candy. It reduces the braking ability of the pad and causes very hot rotors. Some times you can sand the glaze off the pad if it isn't very deep and save the pad. I also sand the rotor a little. Most of the time it is better to replace the pad and turn the rotor or replace the rotor.

You have to bleed the brakes on all 4 wheels when you replace one caliper or open they hydraulic brake system. No way to get around that. usually at least 3 hours work on a moho.

When the rotor has become blue from the heat it needs to be replaced because it has become "tempered" like a hard knife blade. This means that it will just eat the brake pad and will brake at a different rate than the other side putting stress on the vehicle axle. Which eventually will cause all sorts of other problems, especially with anti-lock brakes.

I would suggest you replace both rear calipers so they brake at the same rate, replace both rear rotors and both rear sets of pads, making sure that they have stainless steel anti-squeal shims. Not doing this will mean that you or someone else will have to revisit the problem in a short time.

Caliper frames.... the thing that the caliper fits into.... can become rusted and PITTED so bad that the caliper just will not release after braking. No amount of sanding or surfacing will make them better, you just have to replace them. When it is time for that, hang on to your billfold, it will hurt worse that a wasp sting....

Axle seals....yes on the new seals, and douple big yes on the RTV sealant on new seals!!!

Towing, moho's can be towed from the front or back, it depends on the size of the tow truck. However, a good driver will use the "hammer" technique to get the caliper to release. Did that for while too....

Lastly, cost..... Warranty companies have caused most mechanic shops to use the flat rate book because they know that the warranty company will want to negotiate down their prices. Your can do the same thing...... each shop has different overheads. Some own their own the property they sit on, others must rent. Some owners Lease all of their equipment, others buy and maintain it themselves...... Some owners feel that they must make the same $$$$ as the president of the united states, other don't. The fella doing the work , is just an hourly employee.... so it is all about the overhead....

Ok, so it ended up 4 cents worth....(overhead)
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Old 05-06-2018, 08:17 AM   #22
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Lonfu, informative post...thanks. Question, if the caliper is not fully releasing( for whatever reason, deteriorated rubber brake line/bad carrier/bad pins/etc) and you start out with a healthy brake pad. Wont the friction generated be enough to ruin things long before the pad wears down to the ss shims & make contact and stop further caliper piston compression?
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Old 05-06-2018, 08:21 AM   #23
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Here is a pic of my liquid hot magma....not sure any anti squeal tabs could have prevented this. You would have thought the nut behind the wheel (me) would have felt or smelled something, so I blame that guy the most.



" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350">
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Old 05-06-2018, 12:44 PM   #24
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@ Motor7

My pads were new, never made any sound as they dragged. What happens is the phenolic caliper piston swells and gets stuck. There appears to be some question if Bosch ever put metal pistons in or just changed the grade of phenolic material.

I emailed Dale aka Oemy about the rotors he has listed on his site because they show phenolic pistons and got some additional advice about how we got here in the first place.

Basically the system absorbs moisture through the brake lines, the pistons absorb the moisture and swell and stick. The way to avoid this is not park it over winter and let it sit. At the very least to avoid it, Dale provided this advice "The key is to flush your system every couple of years to get rid of any moisture in the system. I used Spec Bleaders and it only takes about 45 mins to flush all 4_corners. You can get the from Speed Bleeders.. SB71624"

I knew about the moisture issue leading to the recall but I found it after having my caliper lock up. Bosch provided a letter with an explanation. I found a really old post with all the recall info here. http://www.irv2.com/forums/f22/offic...1-c-75575.html

I found the letter from Bosch very informative. Everyone with recalled systems needs to be aware that this can happen at any time if you aren't flushing the fluid every 2 yrs or driving regularly while in storage. It is a problem that is always looming in the background. I also recommend anyone on a recalled chassis run a temperature monitoring TPMS.

FWIW this same thing happened to my Outlander. I work from home and have 3 trucks and the Outlander SUV. All of them sit for some time. For some reason the calipers in the Outlander are susceptible to the same thing, I have never had any problem with my Chevys. The outlanders calipers only drag if I get on the brakes real hard and when cooled they pop back. It actually took me a while to figure out the issue because it was so intermittent. That has not been my experience with the workhorse. My MH stuck caliper is stuck and will only come lose if forced apart.
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Old 05-06-2018, 01:02 PM   #25
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I would also look into replacing the brake line at the caliper. I had the same issue and it turned out being the brake line at that caliper had collapsed internally. I replaced all 4 myself.
I strongly second this recommendation. I had been fighting seemingly random brake lockups for several years before I replaced the lines. Fabricating new lines isn't all that expensive compared to everything else you are having done. Given the age of your MH, I think this would be a worthwhile expenditure.
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Old 05-06-2018, 01:30 PM   #26
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I strongly second this recommendation. I had been fighting seemingly random brake lockups for several years before I replaced the lines. Fabricating new lines isn't all that expensive compared to everything else you are having done. Given the age of your MH, I think this would be a worthwhile expenditure.
Yeah I've decided to replace the line as well even though that is the only thing the stealer told me didn't need to be replaced. lol

They are available without having to be fabricated. Id hate to see what they would charge me to do that.
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Old 05-06-2018, 01:40 PM   #27
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@ Motor7

My pads were new, never made any sound as they dragged. What happens is the phenolic caliper piston swells and gets stuck. There appears to be some question if Bosch ever put metal pistons in or just changed the grade of phenolic material.

I emailed Dale aka Oemy about the rotors he has listed on his site because they show phenolic pistons and got some additional advice about how we got here in the first place.

Basically the system absorbs moisture through the brake lines, the pistons absorb the moisture and swell and stick. The way to avoid this is not park it over winter and let it sit. At the very least to avoid it, Dale provided this advice "The key is to flush your system every couple of years to get rid of any moisture in the system. I used Spec Bleaders and it only takes about 45 mins to flush all 4_corners. You can get the from Speed Bleeders.. SB71624"

I knew about the moisture issue leading to the recall but I found it after having my caliper lock up. Bosch provided a letter with an explanation. I found a really old post with all the recall info here. http://www.irv2.com/forums/f22/offic...1-c-75575.html

I found the letter from Bosch very informative. Everyone with recalled systems needs to be aware that this can happen at any time if you aren't flushing the fluid every 2 yrs or driving regularly while in storage. It is a problem that is always looming in the background. I also recommend anyone on a recalled chassis run a temperature monitoring TPMS.

FWIW this same thing happened to my Outlander. I work from home and have 3 trucks and the Outlander SUV. All of them sit for some time. For some reason the calipers in the Outlander are susceptible to the same thing, I have never had any problem with my Chevys. The outlanders calipers only drag if I get on the brakes real hard and when cooled they pop back. It actually took me a while to figure out the issue because it was so intermittent. That has not been my experience with the workhorse. My MH stuck caliper is stuck and will only come lose if forced apart.
Interesting. But it tells me the design is bad from the get go. I have a 2003 Duramax Dually with disc brakes all the way around. It's kinda a farm truck so it sits for weeks at a time and more during winter. I gets neglected, and only last year got a brake fluid flush and as far as I know that was the first one. So a D-max can go 15 years on oem fluid and not suffer a caliper failure, but a Workhorse can't make it 2

I think we have settled for substandard calipers even after he recall. Knowing this, I think I will change fluid every spring(Speedbleeders are already on the way) and grease the pins/clean carrier. It's going to be a ton of labor, but at least this type of failure is not going to happen again to me.
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Old 05-06-2018, 01:43 PM   #28
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Now, have you priced calipers? They are all over the map, from $300+ to under $100 depending on new or re-built....is there $200 worth of quality there....I dunno. And yes, all my rubber brake lines are getting replaced. I have to worry about the bearings now....was that heat enough to damage them?
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