Community Forums

Dave from MN · 04-14-2010, 04:54 PM

I'm now a true believe in Fram oil filters being junk! I was on my last time of using Fram oil filters anyway. I read the post where everyone who had a oil pressure problems was using a Fram at the time. I have to admit I was in doubt if it was the problem. There should have been some serious engine damage! I first had a "No oil pressure" problem about 5 years ago? The engine was still under warranty & I had used an AC oil filter for the first oil change or 2, I switched to Fram because it was easier to find & I had been using them for years. So I'm not sure what brand of filter I had in when the alarm went on. I called Workhorse the next day & was told it must of been "a fluke"! The oil pressure seemed lower then I remembered. Maybe 20 at an idle & just under 40 at higher RPMs. I happen to be at a Workhorse service center & I asked the mechanic about it. He said it was within limits. I had read a Tech report from Workhorse after the first alarm that this was a red line alarm. This was also verified with the Workhorse Tech. at the time!
I went the next few years without a problem using Fram filters until this spring coming home. It came on climbing a grade in NM. I backed off the throttle & it went away. I continue to climb the grade with no more alarms.
Today I changed the oil & filter after 4400 miles. I started the engine & let it warm up. 30 pounds of oil pressure at an idle with old oil & Fram filter. I changed the oil putting in a Napa Gold 1 quart filter & 5-30 Valvoline oil. 44 pounds of oil pressure at an idle after warm up.
It could be the old oil & dirty filter? But regardless, I am done with Fram!
I can't believe they haven't gotten some serious complaints. Do a search on Fram oil filter problems.

Chuck 1935 · 04-14-2010, 05:30 PM

There is a website that evaluates oil filters, and Fram is not so good.

Oil Filters Revealed - MiniMopar Resourceshttp://www.knizefamily.net/minimopar/oilfilters/opinions.html

gonzo · 04-14-2010, 06:42 PM

I can tell you a story with my former empoyer. We had a number of 2002 Chevy Blazers. We did our own oil changes once per month and our purchasing person would get us Fram Filters becasu they were $1.50 less. The first Blazer needed a new engine at 25,000 miles. GM refused warranty because the dealer sent the filter to GM and GM determined that the filter failed. Next engine went at 33,000 miles. Same explaination. We finally changed to Baldwin Filters. Never had an engine problem again. And the those filter were only 54 cents more after I took care of the price with my supplier.

One thing I know from taking a Fram appart is the the end caps on a Fram are made of CARDBOARD. While all the other companies use a metal cap. Look at the picture of a Fram Filter on the link for Chuck above and see the thin endcap of the FRAM. WHAT A JOKE. The bad part is Fram is selling these filters also as Quaker State, Pensoil and others.

max49 · 04-14-2010, 08:36 PM

44 PSI @ idle, with a warm engine, is better (or close) than I have ever gotten at 3 or 4000 RPM with Fram, Super Tech, AC Delco , Napa or Balwin filters.

If you run no filter at all, will this increase the oil pressure or decrease it? If it would make any significant difference at all.

I don't really care, I have no stock in them, but it seems people love to bash Fram. I've used them all my life with no problems, but since I have joined here, I often , but not always buy a different brand, Wal Marts own SuperTech sometimes. But they don't have the 2 qt filter.

gonzo · 04-15-2010, 04:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by max49

If you run no filter at all, will this increase the oil pressure or decrease it? If it would make any significant difference at all.
.

I guess it would decrease the pressure to the point you don't have any oil left in the crankcase.

My local Napa does not carry a 2 quart either. They have to order them in. The 2 quart is a commercial filter and only Napa's commercial division will carry that.

Once you look at the difference in construction (check link above) you will know why FRAM is beeing trashed! First of all the cardboard end caps and second if you compare filter medium, FRAM got a lot less square inches if filter material compare to others. IMHO that is nuf!

max49 · 04-15-2010, 07:00 AM

Of course you have to bypass the filter so you don't pump the oil out but obviously a filter will reduce the speed the oil flows, but does this increase or decrease the pressure?

RustyJC · 04-15-2010, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by max49

If you run no filter at all, will this increase the oil pressure or decrease it? If it would make any significant difference at all.

All else being equal, it would decrease the pressure ahead of the oil filter location and increase the pressure downstream of the oil filter location. How significant the difference would be depends on the pressure drop across the filter.

Rusty

Dave from MN · 04-15-2010, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by max49

44 PSI @ idle, with a warm engine, is better (or close) than I have ever gotten at 3 or 4000 RPM with Fram, Super Tech, AC Delco , Napa or Balwin filters.

If you run no filter at all, will this increase the oil pressure or decrease it? If it would make any significant difference at all.

I don't really care, I have no stock in them, but it seems people love to bash Fram. I've used them all my life with no problems, but since I have joined here, I often , but not always buy a different brand, Wal Marts own SuperTech sometimes. But they don't have the 2 qt filter.

I thought people were bashing Fram filters because they were thinking too much. A local fleet store carries nothing but Fram filters. It must be the cost factor to these stores. I just thought they had to be changed more often. But this motor in our coaches has to go over 4000 RPMs to get max torque going up passes. Bad time to have a worthless oil filter!

DriVer · 04-15-2010, 07:32 AM

WIX, NAPA, Baldwin, Hastings, Champ, AC, M1 ... lot's of excellent filters out there ...

Tom N · 04-16-2010, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave from MN

But this motor in our coaches has to go over 4000 RPMs to get max torque going up passes.

Your post contains miss-information. Take a good look at the 8.1 torque curve below!

-Tom

CJBROWN · 04-18-2010, 08:53 PM

I would suspect your improved pressure after an oil change is due to the oil, not the filter. Although I'm not a big fan of their filters, especially not the cheap ones. But there is nothing wrong with their premium filters.

Mine has consistently run 40-43lbs, all speeds, amsoil 10/30 symthetic, wix or amsoil nano filters (Donaldson). It does not use any oil either. 2000miles on the current change, not down a spec on the stick. I change once a year or at 5K miles.

BTW, I never run mine over 3400 climbing any grade. I back off and let 'er run there or below. 3rd gear at 3200-3400 gets 50mph, that's plenty. Usually can run in 4th, 55 till it gets really steep. Same going down grade, and stay off the brakes.

dezertcamper · 04-20-2010, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave from MN

The oil pressure seemed lower then I remembered. Maybe 20 at an idle & just under 40 at higher RPMs. I happen to be at a Workhorse service center & I asked the mechanic about it. He said it was within limits. Today I changed the oil & filter after 4400 miles. I started the engine & let it warm up. 30 pounds of oil pressure at an idle with old oil & Fram filter. I changed the oil putting in a Napa Gold 1 quart filter & 5-30 Valvoline oil. 44 pounds of oil pressure at an idle after warm up.

I use Wix Filters and my 8.1 on the Atica display, I show between 19-21 PSI at idle when warm and when under throttle 40-45 PSI.

Dave you mentioned a buzzer going off in the dash which was an RPM limit buzzer? Maybe your Atica gauge cluster is acting up? Because I would think 44 PSI at idle would too high. This would then assume you PSI would double under load and I cant imagine running 70-80 PSI would be accurate. You would blow the oil filter off running that kind of pressure. Many have had problems with the Atica gauge cluster, maybe yours is not reading correctly? If it was me I would have a mechanical put on to test the oil system and find out how accurate your gauges are and to make sure your oil pressure is in the right range. Especially since you have such dramatic PSI changes.