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Old 02-13-2020, 06:18 PM   #1
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1997 F53 Chassis Air Filter Mod

Okay folks, here we go.
I've done a search here on IRV2 and found a few post about what I'm hoping to do, but one goes back to 2014 and since it's 2038 days old it won't let me post there.

Any of you folks who have the older F53 chassis you KNOW how difficult it is to change or clean the air filter. I want to modify where it sits so I have easier access to clean it. (I have the K&N filter)

OLFART posted his fix back in 2014 in this post:f53-chassis-change-air-filter.

What he did was "I removed the air filter element [from the filter box] and installed a 4 inch rain gutter flex hose from Home Depot in the front intake hose attachment. I then ran it to the pass side of the fire wall and installed a K&N type filter."

If you go to his post and on the 2nd page of that thread you can see the pictures he included (I'll show them at the bottom). (I did send him a private IM but he hasn't posted anything in a while so in case he's not using IRV2 anymore I thought I'd post this as well.)

I like that fix, but I was thinking I would prefer to use the existing filter box, but push it out in front of the firewall, find someway to mount it securely, and then just add extra dryer hose between the gap of the back of the filter box to the hoses inside the firewall.

Either way would work, but I'm concerned it might change the fuel air mixture and cause issues using it long term.

Has anyone done something like this and had good success?

BTW: I have the Banks system where there's a 4" hose attached to the front of the grill and then into the filter.

Here's those pics from OlFart's mod: (Great job by the way!)
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Old 02-14-2020, 01:28 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMoot View Post
What he did was "I removed the air filter element [from the filter box] and installed a 4 inch rain gutter flex hose from Home Depot in the front intake hose attachment. I then ran it to the pass side of the fire wall and installed a K&N type filter."
Opinions vary on this, but it's worth mentioning: Some folks think the corrugated sides of these kinds of flex pipes create extra resistance for the air flowing through. Others believe it's not a significant difference. Still others believe that any major impact would be related to the shape of the corrugations (sharp versus rounded etc). I'm bringing this up here as the main reason to go to a K&N-type filter is for airflow, so it's worth considering.

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Originally Posted by TriMoot View Post
just add extra dryer hose
I'm concerned that this dryer hose you mention is metal and not plastic. If something chips or cracks in a plastic hose, and that part gets ingested, it will probably cause no damage. Same thing with a metal hose would go badly.

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I'm concerned it might change the fuel air mixture and cause issues using it long term.
As long as all of the air is going through the MAF and the MAF is located about where it was at the factory then it's fine.
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Old 02-14-2020, 02:15 AM   #3
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Try to keep your 4" hose length to a minimum but with no sharp turns, kinks or elbows. Also when deciding where your intake and filter are to be located, try to imagine driving 60 mph during a hard rain storm when the truck in front of you will hit some deep water and send buckets of water heading toward your grill. You will want to account for how the tubing handles all of that water. I routed my gutter hose down and back up again sort of like the trap under a sink to collect all of that water, then placed holes and slots at the lowest point to allow the water to escape. This has worked well for about a year for me but only in moderately heavy rain so far.
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Old 02-14-2020, 06:09 AM   #4
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Great idea,
I would want to use a tube that does not have ripples in it.
Auto parts stores sell kits for this purpose.
It will provide better air flow for the engine.
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Old 02-14-2020, 11:01 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CathedralCub View Post
....
As long as all of the air is going through the MAF and the MAF is located about where it was at the factory then it's fine.
What's the chance my old '97 F53 chassis doesn't have a MAF? I've looked at a few auto parts store web sites and I'm not seeing one. Although I did see that Rock Auto says I have one, although looks more like a carburetor part.

Here's the VIN: 3FCMF53G3VJA07665.

*Note: When you look at the Rock Auto part there's a description of what the symptoms are of a bad MAF...which actually sums up my spring RV repair list almost exactly:

Common Symptoms of a Bad Mass Air Flow Sensor:
The engine is hard to start or turn over (Not this)
The engine stalls shortly after starting (THIS!)
The vehicle experiences hesitation and jerking while accelerating(Not this)
The engine runs rich while idling or lean while running(THIS!)
There is excessive exhaust smoke, abnormal engine noises, or noticeable fuel odors(Only when Idling)
The Check Engine Light is illuminated(Not this)
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Old 02-15-2020, 01:05 PM   #6
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NO 460 F53 MH chassis have MAF. The only MAF 460 was PU & van built for CA. sales.

There is just enough room to remove the air filter bolts from the front, using a ľ" ratchet, extension & socket. Once you learn how, it not that big of a deal.

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Old 02-15-2020, 10:33 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by House Husband View Post
NO 460 F53 MH chassis have MAF. The only MAF 460 was PU & van built for CA. sales.

There is just enough room to remove the air filter bolts from the front, using a ľ" ratchet, extension & socket. Once you learn how, it not that big of a deal.

Richard
Eh...But I think it's not a bad idea to make it more accessible AND much easy to remove and clean. I would (am) disinclined to clean it as often as I should now, but if it were right up front and easy to access I would probably clean it much more often, and at the very least, open it up and check it.

I did remove it last spring as part of the project I did in removing and adding sound suppressing material on the dog house and I was "THIS IS STUPID!" Why in the HECK would you put this half in and half out of the firewall?

As I was accessing it I recalled what the mechanic said when I picked up the RV for my previous spring maintenance. He said, "MAN! That filter is a PAIN IN THE..."...well, you know..arm, I think he said.
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Old 02-16-2020, 10:22 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMoot View Post
Eh...But I think it's not a bad idea to make it more accessible AND much easy to remove and clean. I would (am) disinclined to clean it as often as I should now, but if it were right up front and easy to access I would probably clean it much more often, and at the very least, open it up and check it.

I did remove it last spring as part of the project I did in removing and adding sound suppressing material on the dog house and I was "THIS IS STUPID!" Why in the HECK would you put this half in and half out of the firewall?

As I was accessing it I recalled what the mechanic said when I picked up the RV for my previous spring maintenance. He said, "MAN! That filter is a PAIN IN THE..."...well, you know..arm, I think he said.
While we're on the subject of filters, would you like another K&N filter for your F53, for the price of freight? New, still in the package and a recharge kit. I wouldn't use an oiled filter for anything street driven. Tests have proven that oiled filters do not remove fine particles like a paper filter does. Oiled filters are great for racing but my lap times, on my MH, don't justify an oiled filter. If you want the filter and kit, PM me with an address.

Richard
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Old 02-16-2020, 01:11 PM   #9
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I wouldn't want it for free. Some actual flow testing on one of the few machines in the world (K&N doesn't own one) capable of doing accurate airflow measurements of air filters showed that almost any stock style "paper" air filter outflowed a K&N filter when dirty or clean. For some reason AC Delco replacement filters took top honors. K&N is all advertising hype.
My filter is difficult to access too. But since I put a proper OEM filter in it, it will be a few years before I need to fool with it again so no big deal.

I used to use K&N style filters on off road motorcycles because they were pretty easy to clean but after getting access to a bike dyno I found that regular replacement oiled foam filters did better for us.
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Old 02-17-2020, 12:52 PM   #10
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While we're on the subject of filters, would you like another K&N filter for your F53, for the price of freight? New, still in the package and a recharge kit. I wouldn't use an oiled filter for anything street driven. Tests have proven that oiled filters do not remove fine particles like a paper filter does. Oiled filters are great for racing but my lap times, on my MH, don't justify an oiled filter. If you want the filter and kit, PM me with an address.

Richard
Woh...this is new territory for me (oil vs dry filter). According you and GypsyR a dry filter is better. I have no idea.

Prior to this I've never done any research, and just now did a cursory google search but didn't come up with any conclusive info.

One thing I saw was an article talking about flow measurements and that the wet filter (Oiled) has better flow due to the openings in the material are larger... Hmm, well logic would dictate perhaps more small particles might be able to get through..BUT the flow is greater which might allow for better performance? And yes, I agree, I don't take my MH to the track either.

But another site mentioned just using whatever came with your rig. Since the PO installed a BANKS system, maybe I should just stick with a wet filter....

Hmm, no idea.

And that's the thing...if I do what "Olfart" did, then maybe having a spare K&N filter around might not be a bad thing, or actually...I just thought of this, see if I can find a paper filter that fits the filter body and swap them out as a test. Better or worse performance and or gas mileage? Might be an interesting test.

Hmm, going to mull this over a bit and I'll PM you if I decide to have a spare. Thanks for the offer, I very much appreciate that. Although now I have to decide about wet vs dry..sigh...why can't RVing be simple?!!! (Kidding!)

Thanks!
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Old 02-17-2020, 01:41 PM   #11
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The filter info is secondhand information from a service seminar. There's a company that specializes in industrial air filters, think "clean rooms", space station air recirculation, stuff like that. Somebody talked them into running a big batch of as wide a variety of automotive air filters as possible through their test equipment during some down time. Apparently the actual tester was also a "car guy". The results are out there somewhere, I wasn't the only person at the seminar. Key points being K&N consistently scored the lowest or almost the lowest on the most sophisticated testing equipment on the planet. I never liked "Delco" anything but this sold me on their air filters. Motorcraft did OK, just not quite as well as Delco. The big point of this is that the company had nothing at all to do with any manufacturer and could care less what the results were. Whereas folks like K&N like to do their own comparison testing. I tested my own barbecued ribs one time and can attest they were the very best on the planet. Period. Because I say so. Get the idea?
In actual use I'm pretty sure hardly anyone here has performance monitoring equipment to get viable data from real world comparisons and time/energy for the thousands upon thousands of miles it would take to even START getting some kind of results that would stand some scientific analysis.
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Old 02-17-2020, 06:37 PM   #12
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As far as performance gains on your 460, the best intake mod is the banks air filter lid. Look at your OEM filter lid and you will see where the 2 holes for the exit hoses are partially blocked at the top. The Banks lid fixes that issue. But it's all a moot point unless the exhaust is opened up. Our old 460s have some of the worst exhaust ports in the world. Ya want to make a 460 move, add headers.
If you like tinkering, here are a couple of tricks.
Punch out the bushings in you TPS and adjust it to 0.9-0.92 volts out, key on engine off.
Extend the shaft on the EGR position sensor to achieve 0.85 volts out, key on engine off. Drill a short piece of brass 5/32", crimp slightly and tap on shaft. Start with 3/16"extension and trim as needed. This will give more timing at part throttle.
Both mods will help with the early downshifts when you coach sees a hill.

Or you could do as I did and install a stroker kit, Banks Power Pack, RV cam & raise the compression. GRIN

Just found this filter report.
https://www.nicoclub.com/archives/kn-vs-oem-filter.html

Richard
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Old 02-22-2020, 11:29 PM   #13
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Be careful-be very careful

I learned a savage lesson on using flex hose on a 12hp electric air compressor. To bring cleaner air to it (it was located in a very dusty shop) I used a flex hose. In less than 2 weeks the constant 24 hr a day use and the pulsation of the huge compressor pistons sucking caused the hose to flex and start to disintegrate. The pieces found their way into the compressor cylinders. Overhaul compressor time.
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Old 02-23-2020, 09:50 PM   #14
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I learned a savage lesson on using flex hose on a 12hp electric air compressor. To bring cleaner air to it (it was located in a very dusty shop) I used a flex hose. In less than 2 weeks the constant 24 hr a day use and the pulsation of the huge compressor pistons sucking caused the hose to flex and start to disintegrate. The pieces found their way into the compressor cylinders. Overhaul compressor time.
Yikes..that's not good. Yeah..not sure if I'll do something like what I've said or not...still looking and listening to all the input. I will keep in mind what you said. I haven't done enough research yet to decide on what or how I'll do anything. Plus I need to be standing in front of it for a while before a plan might come to mind, but since we're hold up in a rental house while the winter months pass, I'm about 30 minutes a way from the RV so can't stand and ponder things when looking at it. Perhaps there's a way I won't have to use flexible hose, perhaps I can find a solid length hose that will work...still pondering...Thanks for the help.
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