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subford · 05-04-2021, 11:23 AM

I have no idea what the MAP/BP tester is or how it works that Ford is using in this pinpoint.
But the scanner may be doing the same thing and out putting the voltage like the MAP/BP tester does but it is putting the decimal point in the wrong place.
So a HG of 15.5 is more than likely 1.55 volts for the MAP sensor voltage test. Using the chart below 1.55 volts would be about 500 feet elevation with key on and the engine not running.

A page from the 1994 Ford shop manual:

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mpaton · 05-04-2021, 02:25 PM

Hmm, yes, I have a couple of responses. The Ford extract below is really a crude go/no go test for a parts replacer mechanic who doesn't have a frequency meter. None of it is wrong, but it's far from as helpful as it could be. (there could be more in the manual that we don't see here).

I don't know what Actron/Bosch actually did to get it wrong, but I know it has nothing to do with a voltage, because the MAP voltage is not presented to the OBD-1 connector, and that's all the scanner is connected to. But I do know precisely and accurately what Ford intended them to do, and I know they got it wrong for a gas engine MAP sensor.

I'm now wondering how I can convince them to fix it. I have logged the MAP value from within the PCM by other means, via a device connected to the J3 port on the PCM, and I have megabytes of logs showing MAP in the range of about 6inHg to about 30 during my testing.

I think the BP/MAP tester they refer to may be the Breakout box, and I have one of those of EEC-IV. But yes, that part isn't clear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by subford

I have no idea what the MAP/BP tester is or how it works that Ford is using in this pinpoint.
But the scanner may be doing the same thing and out putting the voltage like the MAP/BP tester does but it is putting the decimal point in the wrong place.
So a HG of 15.5 is more than likely 1.55 volts for the MAP sensor voltage test. Using the chart below 1.55 volts would be about 500 feet elevation with key on and the engine not running.

A page from the 1994 Ford shop manual:

/

subford · 05-04-2021, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpaton

The Ford extract below is really a crude go/no go test for a parts replacer mechanic who doesn't have a frequency meter.

I think the BP/MAP tester they refer to may be the Breakout box, and I have one of those of EEC-IV. But yes, that part isn't clear.

The BP/MAP tester is a frequency device that outputs the voltages in the chart above and was used by Ford dealers.

The rest of the DF section pages.
http://www.diesel-dave.com/vehic/manual/vra/leftside=vras6al.htm&rightside=vras6ar.htm

Click on DF or the right side./

mpaton · 05-04-2021, 08:59 PM

Thanks for this useful additional information. I am happy to be accurately corrected; however, as I already have the frequency meter, I'll stick with that. I got the frequency meter when I got a GM fuel composition tester from ebay, as you need to measure frequency to get ethanol percentage with that device. I had been hoping to find that in counties outside of Austin, premium fuel would be E0. After buying 3 1 gallon gas containers, and getting a gallon of premium in a couple of stations, I didn't find that at all. I found my credit card didn't work at the 3rd gas station!

MarvinG · 05-06-2021, 07:12 PM

The scanner came today. I was pleasantly surprised, Amazon didn’t get it to UPS until last evening in Kansas City. This morning it was in Memphis. UPS must now be running a morning and evening delivery out here in this rural area because it was here this evening when I drove up.

It doesn’t list F-53. Should I choose Superduty or? Also, I notice Rock Auto lists a MAF sensor for 1996 chassis and mine of course has MAP. Which Rock auto lists for a ‘95 model. My Bounder is supposedly on a ‘96 chassis. Should I be telling the scanner it is 1995 instead of 1996?

mpaton · 05-06-2021, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarvinG

The scanner came today. I was pleasantly surprised, Amazon didn’t get it to UPS until last evening in Kansas City. This morning it was in Memphis. UPS must now be running a morning and evening delivery out here in this rural area because it was here this evening when I drove up.

It doesn’t list F-53. Should I choose Superduty or? Also, I notice Rock Auto lists a MAF sensor for 1996 chassis and mine of course has MAP. Which Rock auto lists for a ‘95 model. My Bounder is supposedly on a ‘96 chassis. Should I be telling the scanner it is 1995 instead of 1996?

Actron and their new owners, Bosch have cut a few corners on the vehicle selection code within the scanner. The closest description they have is F-Superduty. In fact, up until a few years, most catalogs including Rock Auto's showed F-SuperDuty and not F-53. So I'd pick that one, although the reality is I'd bet you that any year of truck between 94 and 97 with a G (7.5 litre) engine will work. Especially if you select F-Series or F-Superduty.

Do remember you'll need to use the cigarette lighter plug to power the scanner on OBD-1.

I called Actron technical support today, and learned that the engineering team is in Cleveland, and I'm submitting a bug report. I guess I'd better check all possible variants of vehicle in case MA works properly on one of them.

Oh, and because I knew they would ask if I'd updated to the latest Software, I tried that, but it turned out that my scanner already had the latest, which is 0B0B.

So if you have that, no need to update.

MarvinG · 05-06-2021, 08:52 PM

Excellent. I’ll give it a go in the morning and see what I get. It is quite a machine!

THenne1713 · 05-06-2021, 11:00 PM

re: "Amazon didn’t get it to UPS until last evening in Kansas City. This morning it was in Memphis" (I had an ebay rv repair part week/ so ago, shipped USPS Indiana to Southaven next day, then sat there for 5-DAYS before delivery; went to a local PO driveup box 2-3 weeks before that, and mail was almost hanging out of the chute, (i.e. competely filled) so I took mine inside to the INSIDE drop box, and reported by email to a Postmaster.

subford · 05-07-2021, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpaton

Oh, and because I knew they would ask if I'd updated to the latest Software, I tried that, but it turned out that my scanner already had the latest, which is 0B0B.

So if you have that, no need to update.

Mine said it was up to date also at first last week and then I clicked on something and it did the update. It did take it a while to remove the old software and update to the new.

As I said above my new software is rev 2BC0H. I do not know what version I had before I updated it to the new software.

I also can not find the CD that came with it as it is no longer in the carrying case. I know I put it in a safe place wherever that is.

MarvinG · 05-07-2021, 07:19 AM

My software is the latest 0B0B.

I haven’t driven it down the road to test but I’m getting the 172 code KOER sitting there in my driveway.

O2 sensor was at .05 KOEO and is varying between .07 and .08 with engine running both at idle and around 2500 RPM’s. It is like it is not responding at all. Or like it is all oxygen I guess.

Should I be looking at wiring/heater voltage for the sensor or take the air pump hoses off and test? Or is some other step recommended next?

(MAP is reading 15.5 KOEF just like both of your’s. And 10.2 KOER.)

mpaton · 05-07-2021, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subford

Mine said it was up to date also at first last week and then I clicked on something and it did the update. It did take it a while to remove the old software and update to the new.

As I said above my new software is rev 2BC0H. I do not know what version I had before I updated it to the new software.

I wasn't very impressed with the software update program at all. Even the instructions for it have a Windows XP look to them. The tech Support guy however didn't say that I had old software with the 0B0B revision.

The 0B0B may well (and probably does) contain the same code as the 0B0B, but the 0B0B isseems to be the latest for scanner model number CP9690 Elite (and the Bosch scanner clone 1300) and your 2BC0H seems to the the latest for your scanner Model number CP9185 Elite.

subford · 05-07-2021, 08:36 AM

Is the SW ID where you are getting the 0B0B number?

/

MarvinG · 05-07-2021, 08:42 AM

That’s where I got mine. Since mpatton said that is the latest, I didn’t hook it up to my PC to see if it found anything newer.

mpaton · 05-07-2021, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarvinG

My software is the latest 0B0B.

I haven’t driven it down the road to test but I’m getting the 172 code KOER sitting there in my driveway.

O2 sensor was at .05 KOEO and is varying between .07 and .08 with engine running both at idle and around 2500 RPM’s. It is like it is not responding at all. Or like it is all oxygen I guess.

Should I be looking at wiring/heater voltage for the sensor or take the air pump hoses off and test? Or is some other step recommended next?

(MAP is reading 15.5 KOEF just like both of your’s. And 10.2 KOER.)

Today my MAP reads 15.6 or 15.7 KOEO, but that just reflects a higher pressure day here. It also makes it less likely that the scanner error is a binary point/scaling error.

Remember that the O2 sensor voltage reading that you are getting can indicate only 2 things, mixture is rick or mixture is lean. It is called a narrowband sensor and it cannot say that the mixture is perfect (stoichiometric) or indicate how much too rich or too lean it is. To gain that information, PCMs go into closed loop fuel control, and make the mixture cycle between something they believe is too rich, and something they believe is too lean, and by noting when the change from rich to lean (and vice versa) happens, they discover how to get a perfect mixture.

Except that doesn't help us, because Ford fixed it so that the F-52 with the 460 almost never goes into closed loop fuel control.

I'll see if I can find the O2 sensor voltages that mean lean and rich for your F-53 and post them.

A reading over 0.45V means the sensor is reading rich.

I'll defer to the experts on what your next move should be, but one thing you could now do is to put a digital multimeter reading Volts on the O2 sensor with the engine running, and see if the meter thinks the voltage is the same as the scanner thinks it is.