Community Forums

twinboat · 06-22-2015, 09:10 AM

That would be a great question for Hendrickson, the maker of the bar.

cutlooselily · 06-26-2015, 01:41 AM

It's 3am as I type this. I am a new member and a recent second hand buyer of a like new, 5K mile 2014 Hurricane. I have put close to 900 miles on her since purchase, just to shake her down and figure out what I plan to do before going full time living on the road.

I am 46years old and thought I had driven pretty much everything out there but God as my witness, I was a nervous wreck when I wrestled this bitch over the SkyWay Bridge...totally, sweating palms. I ride motorcycles, been hit three times in my life and close to death but this rig puts the fear of the UNKNOWN in me!

Now I DO KNOW for sure why the first elder owner's wife wanted out of this ride! Wow, this rig stock is worse than ANYTHING I have ever tried to drive in my life!

I knew there was something wrong and low and behold, I found this thread. After reading damn near every single post 1-210, my heart sank as if I might have a later model or different chassis with the single hole front bar!

SO, at 2:30AM, with my eyes nearly bleeding I crawled out of bed and under the front end with cell phone light in hand! THERE IS A GOD AND HERE IS THE PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF! I know what I am doing in the shop tomorrow...er, later today!

Thank you all for your input on this subject but most importantly, jmckinley! Well played Gentlemen, got me hook line and sinker on this one and literally, sneaking outside and under my RV in my birthday suit!

I'll let you all know what's up when I'm done!

Best regards, mm

Knightab · 06-26-2015, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutlooselily

It's 3am as I type this. I am a new member and a recent second hand buyer of a like new, 5K mile 2014 Hurricane. I have put close to 900 miles on her since purchase, just to shake her down and figure out what I plan to do before going full time living on the road.

I am 46years old and thought I had driven pretty much everything out there but God as my witness, I was a nervous wreck when I wrestled this bitch over the SkyWay Bridge...totally, sweating palms. I ride motorcycles, been hit three times in my life and close to death but this rig puts the fear of the UNKNOWN in me!

Now I DO KNOW for sure why the first elder owner's wife wanted out of this ride! Wow, this rig stock is worse than ANYTHING I have ever tried to drive in my life!

I knew there was something wrong and low and behold, I found this thread. After reading damn near every single post 1-210, my heart sank as if I might have a later model or different chassis with the single hole front bar!

SO, at 2:30AM, with my eyes nearly bleeding I crawled out of bed and under the front end with cell phone light in hand! THERE IS A GOD AND HERE IS THE PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF! I know what I am doing in the shop tomorrow...er, later today!

Thank you all for your input on this subject but most importantly, jmckinley! Well played Gentlemen, got me hook line and sinker on this one and literally, sneaking outside and under my RV in my birthday suit!

I'll let you all know what's up when I'm done!

Best regards, mm

That will help improve but be aware of possibly having to lengthen the links to maintain the correct angle. Next you may want to look at making or buying a rear track bar. There is a great link here on this particular forum for building your own. That is a major improvement also for tail wagging. Can be done for around $50 if you have the tools available.

Here is the link for the track bar that Tejay started http://www.irv2.com/forums/f23/track...lt-242761.html

Magister54 · 06-26-2015, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knightab

That will help improve but be aware of possibly having to lengthen the links to maintain the correct angle. Next you may want to look at making or buying a rear track bar. There is a great link here on this particular forum for building your own. That is a major improvement also for tail wagging. Can be done for around $50 if you have the tools available.

Here is the link for the track bar that Tejay started http://www.irv2.com/forums/f23/track...lt-242761.html

I agree, I have a TracBar and this prevents most of the tail wagging especially when 53' trailer pass you at 70mph when you drive 55...

Also the CHF is not magic, I drove this past days in ME/NH/VT where there was high gust of winds and sometimes the MH would wag 1 foot on the left or right, so always be careful

Knightab · 06-26-2015, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magister54

I agree, I have a TracBar and this prevents most of the tail wagging especially when 53' trailer pass you at 70mph when you drive 55...

Also the CHF is not magic, I drove this past days in ME/NH/VT where there was high gust of winds and sometimes the MH would wag 1 foot on the left or right, so always be careful

That is exactly correct! Not much is going to correct wind push especially from the side. I have all the mods and heavy winds still make it a bear.

TeJay · 06-26-2015, 07:16 AM

mm,
Glad you finally found this thread. We had a 1999 DS 34' that could have used the CHF but I sold it before we found this.
I'm the guy (TeJay) who started the thread to build a rear TB for under $50. I just finished a re-do and will post some pics hopefully today for what I did. So hang on and don't start that just yet.
I did ask John McKinley how many miles he has on the CHF. He has over 30,000 miles and has not extended the links. So that's another project that you don't have to do right away. While as stated it does improve the angle it is not absolutely necessary for correct operation or to improve it's longevity. It just looks better.

Sometimes we tend to over think these things and go a little far. We also don't have the option of laboratory testing or a bunch of engineers who can put a pencil to a design and say it will or will not work. We do however use real world testing and that can work as well.

I've got over 8,000 miles on the TB that I just redesigned and there were no issues with it. I just wanted to extend the differential side about 6" to reduce the ARC effect and side play. It cost me only a little time.

Do the CHF front and rear then take it for a good drive and let us know. The rear TB as reported will also help a lot especially with the tail wagging motion. Every time a semi pushes your behind sideways you have to steer up front to correct and that gets old fast.

Also keep in mind that all suspension items really do work together to make improvements. For example shocks are designed to reduce the leaf spring compression and rebound when you hit a bump. However if a wind is trying to tilt your coach to the side the shocks also resist that compression/rebound. The shocks maybe works harder (do more) on the leaf springs but they still help in some way with other coach movements. It's really a total package.

We just recently installed the Koni shocks. At $160 each they are not cheap. Now most have reported that they are a big improvement. I'd have to agree. Others have reported that they were not a big change and since they were costly not worth the $$$$. So it really depends on your coach.

We really have no studies on these improvements. We don't know if the CHF works better if your coach is less that 34' or greater than 34'. The same if true for the shock issue. That gets into the idea that every coach is different. There are just way to many variables to make a general statement. Well I'll say this. I think the CHF will improve 95% of coaches. As you read. Very few have reported anything negative. There were a few skeptics at first but we've not heard from them in months. Many were sure we were going to break a stabilizer bar. That has never happened or been reported to the best of my knowledge.

I can tell you this for certain. Tire size and tire pressures are very critical for a smooth ride. The 22.5" tires are MUCH better riding than the 19.5" tires. I wanted some 22.5" tires installed on our coach but was told they would not fit. I believe they would but. Get your tire pressures a low as you can without being so low they get hot and cause excessive tire wear. Most use the pressures listed by the manufacturer on the stickers inside the coach. Ours say 82 and that's about where I ended up after some trial and error.

Most will also tell you to get each corner of your coach weighed and then use the tire chart to set your pressures. Do you know how hard it is to get your corners weighed??? It's almost impossible. If you find a friendly grain elevator weigh station the guy may be talked into doing it for you. The CAT scales used by truckers won't do it. They usually have rails on the sides so you can't get the tires far enough to the side to just weigh the corners. Then you have to turn around and do the other side. It just won't work at those CAT scales. If you go to an RV rally yes. Sometimes the State Police will weight coaches because they are interested in coaches not being over weight.

Good luck with the CHF and do keep us informed. If you have any questions about the TB send me a PM.

TeJay

Knightab · 06-26-2015, 07:23 AM

Only thing I disagree with Tejay, is extending the links is more than looking good. Depending on what angle the bar ends up you could essentially turn a sway bar into a solid link. I think the best way to describe it for some is take a paper clip and bend it into a square U shape. Lay on desk and slide one end over the end and press down on the one end. It will bend. Now stand that up with ends pointing up and try it. It won't bend it will jam. The angle is more important than you may be thinking. Obviously if he does not extend the link the sway will be more resistant up to the point of no sway but that then turns into a harsh ride.

MartinC · 06-26-2015, 08:51 AM

Just to add my two cents. TeJay, I believe it is the rear track bar you are recommending to add. I don't disagree with that. However, I think it's possible that the OP, with a 27' coach, may not have a front track bar fitted. Our first Class A was a FW Encounter on a 15k# F53 without a front TB. That was a real cow to drive - if it wandered over a drop off it would go all over the show and take a while to get stable again. Within a year, we traded up to a Bounder and that had the front TB and was much easier to control, even before I did the CHF. For some reason back in 2010, Ford did not think the lighter weight F53s warranted the front bar but maybe now they do.

So, to the original poster, I suggest you crawl back under your rig, preferably in daytime and suitably attired, to look see if you have a front track bar. It is a large bar running parallel to the axle clear across from the spring mounting on one side (I forget which) to the main chassis frame on the other. If it is missing, get one fitted - it will make a huge improvement in handling.

rosspam · 06-26-2015, 10:51 AM

My fronts (2006) would require lengthening. Rears look easy. Any one done just the rear amd did it help. My new bushings helped some but haven't decided if effort on rear only worth crawling on my 62 yo back again.

TeJay · 06-26-2015, 12:07 PM

If John Mckinley does not have a rear SB find the post and let me know. To all who either don't know or just didn't read John's original posts. He does have a front and rear stabilizer bar. If I missed the post or just misread it then I made another mistake.

I have read this thread and NOBODY has ever considered or ever mentioned extending the rear links. If somebody did find the post and list it. For geometric reasons the rear SB links do not need to be extended. The angle of the extended SB arm does not change much when the CHF is done on the rears.

I extended my front links 2+". I believe it is more geometrically sound, reduces pressure on the SB bushings and should extend the life of the front links. And YES it does look better from a working angle not from a (Wow that's pretty) angle.

I reported to mm what John reported to me, he has never extended his links (30,000 miles) and has not had any problems. While (mm) is setting his up it is not absolutely necessary to immediately extend the links. I didn't extend mine for the first 1,000 or so miles. Many others have followed the same path and extended many miles after they did the Fix.

For the first long bit of time nobody mentioned extending the front links. Once it was mentioned it took some discussion before some actually did the extension. Then more discussion ensued and it was determined that it would make it easier on the bushings and from a leverage point it is better. When applying a force using a lever it is always best to be at right angles to the axis of rotation.

John has never had an issue with his after 30,000 miles. So what's the big hurry??? Are there differences between coaches??? Sure there are. Has anybody EVER reported twisting their SB into a pretzel because their link and SB became a solid bar???? NO !! Could it happen?? Maybe, but so far experience and miles has not proven that to ever be a problem. If mm feels compelled to immediately extend his links fine. I just think the guy would like to give it a try for a few hundred miles before doing it.

Ford F-53 came out with a front TB I believe in 2012. Mine is a 2013 chassis and it has a front TB. It's the rear that nobody with a Ford chassis has a TB from the factory. An aftermarket TB is pricy. They range from $400 to over $500 or $600. Many of us have added a HB TB.

TeJay

TeJay · 06-26-2015, 12:16 PM

rosspam,
I got you by 9 years and still crawl all around under the coach because I need to keep fit and yes it will help if you do the rears. Anytime you make it so more energy is needed to allow your coach to sway then it is an improvement. The improvement may or may not be a dramatic as the doing the fronts. You could do this. Put the fronts back to original then do the rears and check the difference. Then reverse the rears and re-do the fronts to again see the difference. Then re-do the rears to see how it is with both. Or NOT. That would really give you a basis of comparison. I think you're back will either be a bit better or maybe a lot worse. So maybe you shouldn't do it either. I hope you realize that I'm just kidding. Or NOT!!

TeJay

cutlooselily · 06-26-2015, 12:54 PM

Just got back from the modified sway bars~F&R test drive.

First impressions?

MOD! This is the first time that the factory cabinet doors & drawers (and it's contents!) didn't fly from port to starboard or vise versa since taking delivery 900 miles ago. I would estimate seat of the pants at a solid 25% IMPROVEMENT!

Here's the way it went...

**********

Front end- I measured the factory end links at 10 11/16" CL. To maintain the same "stock" bar position I arrived at 13 1/8" CL required to nail the inboard bar hole.

I found a short piece of odd ball .890" o.d. x .500" i.d. cold rolled carbon steel tubing laying around in my scrap. A quick i.d. drill to 9/16", burned in with the mig...blacked back out with chassis black epoxy and torqued all back together.

Total front time 1.5 HRS, including three phone calls and two walk in interruptions.

**********

Rear end- Total baby food...On this example, I could not see any potential chassis or rear end casting/component interference possible throughout the min/max sway bar arc or it's end links so...

I flipped the bracket, installed the passenger side first then loaded the passenger side by jacking under the lower shock mount to get the driver side within "slip" alignment. Torqued her back up and let her back down on her feet.

I did study the best approach to a track bar as nothing I have seen in the aftermarket satisfies my OCD. I had only enough plate around the shop to get halfway through plasma cutting so I made two calls and those raw materials along with end links should be in house for next week's fun...which I'll post up then.

Total time (on sway bar only) 15 MINUTES!

*As mentioned elsewhere on this thread, I am very sure that this shorter chassis platform (2014 Thor Hurricane 27K/V-10 18K Chassis)...thus lighter attributes significantly to such a huge perceived improvement. I do agree 100% that a rear track locator will also be worth the additional investment. To answer the wonder about a factory front Track Bar...YES! This rig has a beefy transverse forging as delivered!

FWIW, my rig is fully loaded for full time living and all tanks currently above 1/2 full. The ONLY load that wasn't on this before and after test is my 400# yamaha crotch rocket...Her heavy Mighty Hauler bike lift however, is always along for the ride!

Thank you all again! mm

P.S... I'm gonna try that damned SkyWay Bridge again this weekend and be a SQUATTER on the Gulf Of Mexico!

...I'll post up the difference but I'm pretty sure already my butt won't be as puckered as PRE~CHF!

Knightab · 06-26-2015, 12:59 PM

awesome

TeJay · 06-26-2015, 05:33 PM

mm,
Great when things work out as well as that. We have not studied or thought to much about lengths making that big of a difference but maybe you are correct. I think the difference is there but a heavier coach will not be as effected by wind of any kind so I'm sure that's it.
Good luck in the travels and do let us know how it works out. I'll get my pics of my new TB MOD posted tomorrow. I made mine out of 1/2" plate and when I moved the hole I ended up with a plate that is 1" thick. Probably overkill but I didn't want to completely start over so I just added a piece of 1/2" plate to the first 1/2" plate to keep everything on the same plane. Check the forums mid morning tomorrow and I'll have some new pics up.

TeJay