View Poll Results: How did you perform the CHF on the front (Cheap Handling Fix)
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Just moved the existing links
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30 |
48.39% |
Replaced the links with longer ones
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17 |
27.42% |
Used TeJay's plates
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15 |
24.19% |
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01-19-2020, 12:35 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Newmar Owners Club Nor'easters Club Appalachian Campers Ford Super Duty Owner Coastal Campers
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,463
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CHF Method Poll
How did you do the CHF on the front? There was a post recently on the Cheap Handling Fix thread recently wondering how many did just moved the existing links to the other holes, added longer links or used TeJay's plates. Hopefully this poll will answer those questions.
I know there is at least one poll on iRV2.com that has many more questions, this poll is only for those of us who have done the CHF and only about the three most popular methods.
I used longer links, but would have used TeJay's plates if they were available at the time.
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Stewart, Brenda and kids
2008 Newmar Canyon Star 3410, now at a new home
2006 Roadtrek Versatile 210
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01-19-2020, 01:00 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Posts: 2,594
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I just moved the stock links and ran for almost 3 years and 22,000 miles with no problems. But I seem to lift the front wheels off the ground more often than I should when leveling, so I oped for TeJay's plates.
They're very nicely built, and I have to say I do like the angle it puts the links at much better. I only recently installed, so I don't know yet if it still wheelies while leveling Even if it still does I think I'd recommend the plates or longer links for the improved angle.
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2021 Keystone Outback 221UMD
2018 Tundra Limited 5.7 liter
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01-19-2020, 03:30 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Safety Harbor, FL
Posts: 2,501
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Just like jmckinley did over ten years ago discovering the CHF I just moved the links to the inner hole with zero issues and greatly improved ride. Last I spoke jmckinley there have been no issues in a decade and many miles without extending the links. With mine it has been over 3 years and 30,000 plus miles no issues.
I also tested the axle droop with the CHF and sway bar completely disconnected and it only raises the tires off the ground 1/2" sooner with the CHF than without, so almost no real world difference.
If you understand suspension geometry you will know the angle actually contributes to the stiffness and by leveling them out with extended links or plate you are softening the CHF up. I have posted the math before and using extended links ends up being about half way between stock and and normal CHF as though you put a hole right in between the two and mounted there. Conversely If you wanted the same stiffness as the CHF but really want angle closer to 90 degrees you would need a hole much closer to the axle, right about where the bend is.
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2022 Thor Palazzo 33.5
2016 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad - Readybrute Elite Towbar
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01-19-2020, 05:09 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 323
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I just moved the links and have had no issues. jherrel's math confirmed my belief that extending the links would lessen the benefit.
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01-19-2020, 05:12 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Titusville, FL
Posts: 5,160
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Don't forget folks, there are several differing designs of Ford anti-sway bars. I've had 3 different F-53s over the last 5 years and every one has been different.
What's true for one configuration doesn't necessarily play for all configurations. Just because one person can simply move the link to the other hole doesn't mean everybody else gets such a simple solution.
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When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.
2023 Grand Design 2600RB, 2022 F-350 King Ranch tow vehicle, Titusville, FL when not on the road
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01-19-2020, 06:02 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Safety Harbor, FL
Posts: 2,501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hohenwald48
What's true for one configuration doesn't necessarily play for all configurations. Just because one person can simply move the link to the other hole doesn't mean everybody else gets such a simple solution.
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Very true, you want to make sure the links and bar don't make contact under normal suspension movement.
Its not rocket science you just don't want parts banging into each other at high speed. Use leveling jacks to observe suspension movement before and after.
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2022 Thor Palazzo 33.5
2016 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad - Readybrute Elite Towbar
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01-19-2020, 08:43 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 3,400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdInArk
I just moved the stock links and ran for almost 3 years and 22,000 miles with no problems. But I seem to lift the front wheels off the ground more often than I should when leveling, so I oped for TeJay's plates.
They're very nicely built, and I have to say I do like the angle it puts the links at much better. I only recently installed, so I don't know yet if it still wheelies while leveling Even if it still does I think I'd recommend the plates or longer links for the improved angle.
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I voted and I use Tejays plate front & rear. I have never had my front tires off the ground because I always manual level.
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01-20-2020, 06:51 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Posts: 2,594
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marjoa
I voted and I use Tejays plate front & rear. I have never had my front tires off the ground because I always manual level.
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I always manual level too. Automagic mode is like a carnival ride, and I can always level it closer to the ground manually. Even so, I usually wind up with a front wheel off the ground anyway. We've been out once since installing TeJay's plates, and I still had one front off, but I really think that site was front-end low.
I'm hoping Fred's plates will help some. It's not a huge issue; I just drive up on a pair of wedges left over from our TT.
Prior to Fred's plates mine looked just like the picture below, and even though I drove it 20k like that, I'm still happier with the angle with the plates. It's only logical that it would be softer with links more vertical, but I put them in the mid position and still one one harder in reserve.
On the one trip we've taken I couldn't tell the difference, but the roads weren't that challenging.
We'll see
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2021 Keystone Outback 221UMD
2018 Tundra Limited 5.7 liter
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01-21-2020, 08:00 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Metamora, MI
Posts: 5,518
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For those that are bringing up "manually level so tires don't leave the ground"...when you are driving, the suspension often "tops out" on road heaves. Leveling has nothing to do with CHF implementations. The suspension has to be able to articulate it's full range of motion and the limits have to be the limiting factor (not something induced). The shocks and any limit straps should be the top out limiting factor - not the antisway system.
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2002 Newmar Mountain Aire Limited 4370 w/ Spartan K2 and Cummins 500hp
ASE Master Certified (a long.....time ago...)
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01-21-2020, 08:10 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Posts: 2,594
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dav L
For those that are bringing up "manually level so tires don't leave the ground"...when you are driving, the suspension often "tops out" on road heaves. Leveling has nothing to do with CHF implementations. The suspension has to be able to articulate it's full range of motion and the limits have to be the limiting factor (not something induced). The shocks and any limit straps should be the top out limiting factor - not the antisway system.
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Logical. But here's what my front sway bar looked like before TeJay's plates. The weight is on the wheel in the photo.
For the record, this is not my photo, but it looked just like this.
I don't know if it limited downward movement or not, but I'm sure happier with the angle now.
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2021 Keystone Outback 221UMD
2018 Tundra Limited 5.7 liter
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01-21-2020, 08:43 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 35,349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdInArk
Logical. But here's what my front sway bar looked like before TeJay's plates. The weight is on the wheel in the photo.
For the record, this is not my photo, but it looked just like this.
I don't know if it limited downward movement or not, but I'm sure happier with the angle now.
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Is that picture with the front tires on the ground and the springs compressed, or up on levelers, with the axle hanging ?
It will make a difference in the angles it shows.
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01-21-2020, 09:35 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Safety Harbor, FL
Posts: 2,501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dav L
For those that are bringing up "manually level so tires don't leave the ground"...when you are driving, the suspension often "tops out" on road heaves. Leveling has nothing to do with CHF implementations. The suspension has to be able to articulate it's full range of motion and the limits have to be the limiting factor (not something induced). The shocks and any limit straps should be the top out limiting factor - not the antisway system.
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If you top out your shocks regularly they will be destroyed. Vehicles that tend to do that use limit straps to protect the shocks from damage.
Pretty confident my suspension never tops out in normal driving even over road heaves. This is because my sway bar makes contact with the leaf on at full droop and there is not a mark on the paint on the bar in that location. If I lift the tires off the ground it ends up resting there which is 1/2" less than the shock limits. That light contact when resting is not enough to even leave a mark.
The droop is about 4" of travel down, if you drop your axle 4" on a regular basis at speed you will need to put limit straps on either way.
The sway bar and links are designed to take at least 750 lbs per inch of deflection each and with the normal CHF over 1200lbs. The whole front axle assembly is probably around 500lbs which would be split between each link while holding off the ground, absolutely no issue there and I would venture the links would hold up longer than your shocks if the axle where going full limit at high speed.
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2022 Thor Palazzo 33.5
2016 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad - Readybrute Elite Towbar
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01-21-2020, 09:41 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Safety Harbor, FL
Posts: 2,501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdInArk
Logical. But here's what my front sway bar looked like before TeJay's plates. The weight is on the wheel in the photo.
For the record, this is not my photo, but it looked just like this.
I don't know if it limited downward movement or not, but I'm sure happier with the angle now.
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This is the lever arm plot I did on mine that lets you see the the effective arm for stock, CHF and extended links:
__________________
2022 Thor Palazzo 33.5
2016 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad - Readybrute Elite Towbar
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01-21-2020, 10:00 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Posts: 2,594
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinboat
Is that picture with the front tires on the ground and the springs compressed, or up on levelers, with the axle hanging ?
It will make a difference in the angles it shows.
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Mine look exactly like this with the wheels sitting on the ground with no other support.
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2021 Keystone Outback 221UMD
2018 Tundra Limited 5.7 liter
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