Starter Unable to Crank

[Arch Hoagland]

OP said: "Did a voltage drop test on the battery (fully charged), cables, starter solenoid and motor. No drops when trying to crank."

It should drop way down if the starter is getting power to it and supposedly trying to turn.

[twinboat]

Pull the replacement starter and try to turn the engine .

Were all of the teeth on the old starter gear in tact ?

[THenne1713]

Arch is right, battery voltage at battery should drop into 10-11 volt range w/ good battery and 9v or much lower w/ low charge or bad battery

[MrMark52]

In re-reading your OP and in support to what others have said -

Your dash lights would go dim and power assist pump would slow while trying to start. Starters trying to start an engine pull a lot of amps (hence why batteries have a “Cold Cranking Amps” or CCA rating). As a result, headlights and dash lights will dim, radios will quit working, etc.

And I’m somewhat struggling with the statements about running the engine off of a gas can because the fuel pump was out - I’m thinking this is a fuel injected engine, and FI engines that I know of won’t run without at least 45-50 psi of fuel rail pressure (unless it’s a TBI FI engine, and I don’t know that Ford ever did TBI, at least not for the year model you mention - and also in which case you would have to be squirting gas down the TB to run the engine because the TBFI’s still need fuel pressure behind them to work).
Even a carburetor needs a fuel pump to run the engine unless somehow the gas can was above the carburetor to allow gravity feed.

Am still having real issues understanding how a normally operating engine that was running and was intentionally turned off, seized.

Trying to turn the engine will tell the tale - assuming the engine is sound (i.e. had plenty of oil when previously run, no water presently in the oil, the engine wasn’t run for a long period without coolant, etc.).

[THenne1713]

Oh, and to expand that answer, SOLENOIDS (AND smaller RELAYS) can CLUNK or click and NOT connect, or alternate, can STICK energized/engaged. I have experienced both conditions on various vehicles in past 12+ months

[Neovivacity]

Originally Posted by Arch Hoagland

OP said: "Did a voltage drop test on the battery (fully charged), cables, starter solenoid and motor. No drops when trying to crank."

It should drop way down if the starter is getting power to it and supposedly trying to turn.

This what I followed,

* Check the positive battery post and cable connection by measuring the voltage drop between the two while cranking the engine. Connect the meter positive lead to the battery post and the meter negative lead to the cable clamp. A good post/cable connection should have zero voltage drop.

* Check the positive battery cable by measuring the voltage drop end to end while cranking the engine. Connect the meter positive lead to the clamp on the positive battery cable, and the meter negative lead to the end of the cable at the starter. Crank the engine and note the voltage reading. A good cable should have a voltage drop of 0.2 volts or less.

* To check the starter solenoid or relay connections, connect the meter positive lead to positive battery terminal on the solenoid or relay, and the meter negative lead to the starter motor terminal. Crank the engine and note the reading. A good connection should have a voltage drop of 0.2 volts or less.

Next, you need to check the negative side of the starter circuit. To check the entire circuit, connect the meter positive lead to a clean spot on the starter motor case and the meter negative lead to the negative battery post. Crank the engine and note the reading. The voltage drop on the negative side should be 0.3 volts or less.

[Neovivacity]

Originally Posted by MrMark52

Your dash lights would go dim and power assist pump would slow while trying to start. Starters trying to start an engine pull a lot of amps (hence why batteries have a “Cold Cranking Amps” or CCA rating). As a result, headlights and dash lights will dim, radios will quit working, etc.

Let me clarify a bit there. The amount dimmed was significantly more than normally starting the engine before. This supports bad electrically connection, and also fits with trying to run a starter motor on a seized engine that it seems to have.

And I’m somewhat struggling with the statements about running the engine off of a gas can because the fuel pump was out

I get the sketism, maybe someone else can chime in better how it's possible, maybe enough negative pressure in the tank to pull through the return line? The gas can was about a foot above the intake. It started and idled solid for 15-30sec. I only did this when I bought it to confirm the fuel pump was bad and the engine was fine. I'd be happy to reproduce on video when the engine is back together for science.

Am still having real issues understanding how a normally operating engine that was running and was intentionally turned off, seized.

It wasn't intentionally turned off, sorry if I misspoke in my original post. I started it, it ran for maybe a second, and then immediately stopped. Stopped as in abruptly and instantly ceased turning, not like it died from fuel or ignition failure.

[MrMark52]

Mmmm - now we may be getting somewhere!

Were fluid levels checked before the engine was run, as in the oil?

Still not understanding the gas can discussion but I think it’s mute at this point. But if we were to continue it, knowing what type of engine fueling you have (carburetor or fuel injection) will be important to understand before heading down that rabbit hole.

[Neovivacity]

The oil level was checked and was fine. I didn't do the oil change until after it seized (since I was only going to fire it up for a few seconds to check the new fuel pump). The oil I drained was old and black, but still a consistent viscosity that looked right. No weird smells that jump out at me.

Could be a failed oil pump that caused it.

[Unplanned Tourist]

I read through all the posts, and pulling the spark plugs and baring it over will give you an answer. Go back and forth if it moves a little.

It could have hydraulic lock-up if one cylinder got a big gulp of gas, and now that gas will leak past the rings (slowly) and into the sump.

Once you get it spinning on the starter, do a compression test.

Good Luck.

[Arch Hoagland]

You need to put the meter's red lead on the battery positive terminal post and the meter's black lead on the battery negative post, then try to start.

In your explanation all you were doing was measuring voltage drop from one post to the starter.

I want to know how much the battery voltage dropped at the battery itself.

[Neovivacity]

Yep, going over to work on it Saturday. Should have had plenty of time to soak and loose up it, then I'll put the breaker bar on it.

I'll get the battery drop when I'm there too, though I think I've ruled out anything electrical or starter related now.

[edge68474]

Following this discussion, thank you.

[Neovivacity]

Engine is very seized unfortunately. Worked the breaker bar back and for 10 mins as hard as I could without risking snapping the crank bolt. Solid as a rock.

​​​​​​​Next time I'm back out with more time the valve covers are coming off to inspect valves