Trac Bars on Both Ends

[iHoliday]

I have a 30' Tiffin on a 2003 20.5k chassis. I installed the Henderson track bar in the rear and the Davis track bar in the front. Day and night difference. I can drive one handed with a coffee in the other. Semi push/pull no longer a factor. Windy/gusty situations not an issue any longer either. If you are fatigued after driving your coach for only 6 hours then you should consider these mods. More importantly the safety factor rises exponentially. It becomes an investment in a persons we'll being.

[TeJay]

We've got almost 4,000 miles on the rear track bar that I built for $45. It has worked great with no problems. They can be built for a fraction of the cost. I didn't have an extra $400-600 for a commercial one.

If you are interested just PM me. If you don't think home-made will work or cause some issues (but I have no idea what they would be) that's OK also.


TeJay

[al2ride]

Everything you add will help. The rear trac bar was the first thing we added, but if we had to do it all over again, it would be the last. In our coach, the most noticeable improvement was the CHF and correct tire pressures. I'm about to order a steering stabilizer and I'm guessing that will also trump the rear trac bar.

Like I said, everything helps, but the rear trac bar is a small percentage compared to other mods.

[wa8yxm]

Best wisdom is a REAR track bar is better at controlling tail wag.. That said I put in a Davis Tru-Track on the front and love it.

Of course putting on two track bars, (Front and rear) is the best, that stops wag 100% dead in it's tracks. I plan on an Ultra Power rear bar one day but alas... not this month.

[TeJay]

al2Ride,
When we add item after item to fix our handling issues the only correct way to determine exactly how each add-on or change helped would be to install/change one at a time then determine the improvement level. Now remove or undo that and install/change the next thing. Piling one on top of the other and saying one or the other made the greatest difference is not an accurate evaluation.
We can all probably say that the CHF made the biggest or most noticeable difference. We already had a front track bar from the factory so I don't know what it's like without one and I'm not going to take it off to find out.
As has been stated every added item or change (CHF) will have some effect on ride and handling. Common sense tells me front/rear track rod and CHF will show the greatest improvement in handling. Controlling the side to side body sway and making the front and rear leaf spring suspension solid with the frame is going to provide the necessary ridged connection between coach body and moving suspension.

Here's the kicker. If Ford installs a front track rod on the chassis now. Our 2013 chassis has it but I don't know when they started adding them. That means that they FORD determined that the F-53 chassis needed it for better handling. And I can build a rear track rod for $45 why can't Ford just send their F-53 chassis to the MH builders with a front and rear track rod along with the CHF already done???? They could at least offer it as an option.

TeJay

[al2ride]

Originally Posted by TeJay

al2Ride,
When we add item after item to fix our handling issues the only correct way to determine exactly how each add-on or change helped would be to install/change one at a time then determine the improvement level. Now remove or undo that and install/change the next thing. Piling one on top of the other and saying one or the other made the greatest difference is not an accurate evaluation.

You are correct, problem is that the rear trac bar was the very first mod I did to the suspension. It got rid of some of the tail swing, but can't say the same for road wonder.

I started taming road wonder with the CHF and tire pressure. My guess is that our coach will be as good as it will ever be with the steering stabilizer and wheel alignment.

[TeJay]

Al2Ride, Give this idea some thought:

I have been giving some thought to putting some sort of shock absorber from the outer hole on the sway bar up to the frame. Why would I do that??? Here's my thoughts!!!

When we hit a dip in the road and the coach begins to lean their is no load stored in the sway bar. The bar is not twisted. It's kind of like a coil spring with no weight on it. There is no resistance or stored energy to prevent the sway from happening. So for the first few moments the coach leans as the sway bar is twisting and storing energy which is now trying to prevent the coach from swaying. Once the amount of energy stored in the twisted bar is sufficient to prevent any further coach movement the sway motion stops. My point is for the first few seconds there is nothing stored to prevent the sway from happening so the coach leans. A shock absorber prevents movement by forcing the inward or outward movement of the shock using oil passing through small holes inside the shock. A shock does not have to store energy to work it dampens movement using oil so it's ready to dampen coach movement the moment the sway begins to happen.

I need to find a small short shock absorber that would dampen in both directions or on compression and rebound. There's already a hole in the sway bar and attaching it to the frame would be a piece of cake. I'm going to get some measurements or compressed and expanded lengths and do some research. I really think it would help control the sway even more.

Think of it this way. There are three types of suspensions: coil, leaf spring & torsion bar. They suspend the vehicles weight & allow it to travel down the road absorbing road dips, ruts etc. Shocks are used to dampen the oscillations of the suspension movement. Isn't the sway bar a torsion bar?? It's a type of suspension that it is set up to control coach side to side sway & shouldn't we dampen the oscillations caused by the coach movement as we do with regular suspension systems??? It makes perfect sense to me.

This could be another revolution in the RV industry. Well maybe not but it's fun to think about it.
We could call this " The CHF Upgrade."

TeJay

[al2ride]

Originally Posted by TeJay

Al2Ride, Give this idea some thought:

I have been giving some thought to putting some sort of shock absorber from the outer hole on the sway bar up to the frame. Why would I do that??? Here's my thoughts!!!

When we hit a dip in the road and the coach begins to lean their is no load stored in the sway bar. The bar is not twisted. It's kind of like a coil spring with no weight on it. There is no resistance or stored energy to prevent the sway from happening. So for the first few moments the coach leans as the sway bar is twisting and storing energy which is now trying to prevent the coach from swaying. Once the amount of energy stored in the twisted bar is sufficient to prevent any further coach movement the sway motion stops. My point is for the first few seconds there is nothing stored to prevent the sway from happening so the coach leans. A shock absorber prevents movement by forcing the inward or outward movement of the shock using oil passing through small holes inside the shock. A shock does not have to store energy to work it dampens movement using oil so it's ready to dampen coach movement the moment the sway begins to happen.

I need to find a small short shock absorber that would dampen in both directions or on compression and rebound. There's already a hole in the sway bar and attaching it to the frame would be a piece of cake. I'm going to get some measurements or compressed and expanded lengths and do some research. I really think it would help control the sway even more.

Think of it this way. There are three types of suspensions: coil, leaf spring & torsion bar. They suspend the vehicles weight & allow it to travel down the road absorbing road dips, ruts etc. Shocks are used to dampen the oscillations of the suspension movement. Isn't the sway bar a torsion bar?? It's a type of suspension that it is set up to control coach side to side sway & shouldn't we dampen the oscillations caused by the coach movement as we do with regular suspension systems??? It makes perfect sense to me.

This could be another revolution in the RV industry. Well maybe not but it's fun to think about it.
We could call this " The CHF Upgrade."

TeJay

I have to give this some thought when I haven't had a few cold ones. Are you talking about installing shocks in lieu of the end links?

[TeJay]

No!! I'd add shocks in the place of the links that were moved to the inner hole. Each end of the sway bar would be dampened with a shock to the frame. It's no different from what is done on all suspension systems. The springs (torsion, coil, leaf) absorb road irregularities and cushion the ride. The shocks are there to dampen or reduce the spring oscillations.

The sway bar is a torsion spring. Chrysler used torsion bars for their front end suspension for years. Here's another way of looking at it. Regular springs reduce up and down motion and sway bars reduce side to side motion. There is no difference between the two. I believe they would benefit from and should be dampened just as springs are.

TeJay

[al2ride]

Originally Posted by TeJay

No!! I'd add shocks in the place of the links that were moved to the inner hole. Each end of the sway bar would be dampened with a shock to the frame. It's no different from what is done on all suspension systems. The springs (torsion, coil, leaf) absorb road irregularities and cushion the ride. The shocks are there to dampen or reduce the spring oscillations.

The sway bar is a torsion spring. Chrysler used torsion bars for their front end suspension for years. Here's another way of looking at it. Regular springs reduce up and down motion and sway bars reduce side to side motion. There is no difference between the two. I believe they would benefit from and should be dampened just as springs are.

TeJay

Sounds like it could work with some heavy duty shocks.

[Mnflyboy]

So, to all you guys who've installed your own rear trac bar....how did you break the rear end bolts loose? I got under my MH and hardly have room for a breaker bar...can I use my impact to try and loosen them? Thanks.

Jaye(Mn)

[TeJay]

The rear track bar plate bolts using the differential cover bolts. I removed 4 of the cover bolts and because my track rod plate was 1/2" thick I got 1/2' longer bolts. They are torqued to I think 65 ft.-lbs. I had plenty of room to work. Because of the extra stress being placed on those 4 differential bolts I also used blue lock tight. I didn't at first and had one bolt fall out and another was loose.

TeJay

[KSCRUDE]

I used a half inch impact gun. Ingersoll Rand brand, and I didn't use a torque wrench, and they will never come loose.

[Virago-Rider]

Anyone have a photo of a front track bar? I don't think I have one. But, then I don't know what a front one looks like.


Sent from my iPad2 using iRV2 - RV Forum