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Old 06-04-2018, 09:14 PM   #1
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Battery - connected house batteries to both house and engine. Engine battery removed.

What should be any negative outcome of this configuration?

RV operated one month.

Now dead, no chassis power.

Generator starts and runs along with normal operation of related house 12 vdc systems.

House batteries check 12.36 vdc.
Pass load testing and were charged.

Would installing the chassis battery and reconfiguring the battery systems back to seperate chassis and house repair the dead chassis problem?
Thanks for any suggestions or fixes.
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Old 06-04-2018, 10:17 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MMMZ View Post
What should be any negative outcome of this configuration?

RV operated one month.

Now dead, no chassis power.

Generator starts and runs along with normal operation of related house 12 vdc systems.

House batteries check 12.36 vdc.
Pass load testing and were charged.

Would installing the chassis battery and reconfiguring the battery systems back to seperate chassis and house repair the dead chassis problem?
Thanks for any suggestions or fixes.
Well,
First off, one would wonder if and why, the two seperate systems were joined into one in the first place. There's a primary reason that the RV world has TWO SEPERATE BATTERY SYSTEMS. One system is to get you there and get you home. While the other is to be used, while you're there. If the one that is used while you're there GOES DEAD, you can STILL GET HOME. But, if the two systems are joined together and, your one and only system GOES DEAD while camping, guess what, you're NOT GOING HOME. The reason is, because the two were tied together, your chassis batteries are now DEAD. So, you can't even start the engine to get back any charging and, go home. NOT GOOD!

So, with all that BS being stated, if this coach is new to you, the very, very first thing I'd do is, SEPARATE the two systems, back to the original configuration. Once that's done, then you need to figure out just how both systems are charged, both on shore power and, when the engine is running.

Once you figure out how it's ALL SUPPOSED TO WORK, then you can now determine if there is a problem with any portion of any particular charging system. In some coaches and eras of coaches, the chassis batteries DO NOT CHARGE while on shore power. On some, they do and did. If your coach was setup to not charge the chassis batteries while plugged into shore power, there's very simple remedies for this. I won't go into that now.

On gas coaches, normally the CONVERTER handles charging the house batteries and, sometimes is tied into the chassis batteries. On most diesel coaches, an INVERTER/CHARGER handles the duty of charging the house batteries and, may or may not also be tied into charging of the chassis batteries. Further investigation is needed to determine that.

But, yep, I'd separate the one single battery system you now have, back into the original TWO seperate house and chassis battery systems to start with.
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Old 06-04-2018, 10:31 PM   #3
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Scott is right on with his advice but, in addition:

1. Think about using 6v golf cart batteries in series for your house bank.

2. You didn't say how old your motorhome is but, if the converter doesn't use multi-stage charging, consider replacing it. Your batteries will last much longer.
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Old 06-05-2018, 04:29 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by MMMZ View Post
What should be any negative outcome of this configuration?

RV operated one month.

Now dead, no chassis power.

Generator starts and runs along with normal operation of related house 12 vdc systems.

House batteries check 12.36 vdc.
Pass load testing and were charged.

Would installing the chassis battery and reconfiguring the battery systems back to seperate chassis and house repair the dead chassis problem?
Thanks for any suggestions or fixes.
Installing another battery won't fix your immediate problem, but a through cleaning of the battery cable ends may.

If the house and start cables are piled up on the house batteries and snugged down with wing nuts, there could be a bad connection.

Take them off, clean them up and tighten them back down with more then your fingers.

Double check that the engine ground cable is connected to the battery. Using a chassis ground will burn up the thin wires grounding the engine to the chassis.

Of course it makes more sense to have seperate systems but not nessessery.

I run my liveaboard, diesel boat, with one battery bank. If the batteries gets to weak to start the engine ( never has ), I have a portable generator to charge them.
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Old 06-05-2018, 07:00 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MMMZ View Post
What should be any negative outcome of this configuration?

RV operated one month.

Now dead, no chassis power.

Generator starts and runs along with normal operation of related house 12 vdc systems.

House batteries check 12.36 vdc.
Pass load testing and were charged.

Would installing the chassis battery and reconfiguring the battery systems back to seperate chassis and house repair the dead chassis problem?
Thanks for any suggestions or fixes.
Unless I'm reading this wrong what you're saying doesn't make sense. I'm reading that the house/chassis bank is currently tied together yet the chassis side has no power while the house side does...if this is the case they aren't tied together.
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Old 06-05-2018, 07:13 AM   #6
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I'm not clear on your current situation, either, but there is a definite reason not to use a single battery bank for both the house and the chassis.

The batteries used on each side of that equation are designed for very different uses.

A chassis battery uses lead sponges that are rather thin and delicate but have a LOT of surface area. As a result, it can handle very heavy, very short discharges - like what you would need to spin the starter on an engine. If they're discharged deeply (beyond 75-ish percent), they quickly build up sulfation deposits and die an untimely death. You can't equalize a chassis battery effectively as part of regular maintenance because the lead sponges will quickly disintegrate under the equalization voltage.

A deep cycle battery uses corrugated lead plates (think corrugated cardboard, but made from lead) that are thick and robust. They don't have as much surface area, so they can't handle heavy, short currents, but they do a great job of cycling deeply with light-to-moderate current draws. The sulfation deposits appear on the plate surface and can be regularly removed with a full charge or occasional equalization.

Those differences are the primary reason we split our house and chassis batteries to begin with: both sides of the motorhome require very different battery performance and technology for long, effective use.

Every battery might look like every other battery, but what's on the inside is quite specific to the intended task.
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Old 06-05-2018, 07:18 AM   #7
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I'm not clear on your current situation, either, but there is a definite reason not to use a single battery bank for both the house and the chassis.

The batteries used on each side of that equation are designed for very different uses.

A chassis battery uses lead sponges that are rather thin and delicate but have a LOT of surface area. As a result, it can handle very heavy, very short discharges - like what you would need to spin the starter on an engine. If they're discharged deeply (beyond 75-ish percent), they quickly build up sulfation deposits and die an untimely death. You can't equalize a chassis battery effectively as part of regular maintenance because the lead sponges will quickly disintegrate under the equalization voltage.

A deep cycle battery uses corrugated lead plates (think corrugated cardboard, but made from lead) that are thick and robust. They don't have as much surface area, so they can't handle heavy, short currents, but they do a great job of cycling deeply with light-to-moderate current draws. The sulfation deposits appear on the plate surface and can be regularly removed with a full charge or occasional equalization.

Those differences are the primary reason we split our house and chassis batteries to begin with: both sides of the motorhome require very different battery performance and technology for long, effective use.

Every battery might look like every other battery, but what's on the inside is quite specific to the intended task.
He probably has the typical Marine/ RV hybrid batteries. They do both things, just not as well as either type.
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Old 06-05-2018, 08:08 AM   #8
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I will upload a pic of batteries tommorrow, one is a "red top" and the other is a hybrid.

I also have the misunderstanding of how the generator start and run along with the house 12 vdc system is in operation but the chassis 12 vdc system is inoperable with both systems wired together.
I would gladly reconfigure the chassis and house into two seperate systems as recommended , as i agree that it is the correct sequence of events and subsequeny instal a new chassis battery in order to to acheive this goal.
But i would more so like to apply good monetary decipline as to the immidiate repair of a dead chassis system.
I have now 4 parking violations and currently experiencing the need to apply very modest means of expendable income for the purpose of obtaining a working vehicle as to allow the movement of vechicle.
Thank you in advance and for any prevoius help you may be able to extend or have extended with this repair.
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Old 06-05-2018, 08:18 AM   #9
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Thank you. It is to be believed that you are absolutely correct in the repair of the chassis 12vdc system, as a seperate system , that needs to be removed from the house system in order to properly troubleshoot and repair it.
This now leaves the proper troublshooting and repair of the the chassis 12vdc system now, with a ghost battery installed in the chassis system AKA one of deep cycle batteries for the purpose of this repair.
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Old 06-05-2018, 09:43 AM   #10
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for the purpose of obtaining a working vehicle as to allow the movement of vechicle.
Thank you in advance and for any prevoius help you may be able to extend or have extended with this repair.
Every motorhome I've ever been in has an "emergency" or "auxiliary" start switch on the dash or somewhere near the driver's seat. With good coach batteries, using this switch should enable cranking of the engine. Have you tried that?

I'm thinking that you may be saying that the chassis and coach systems are connected now, maybe via a jumper across the solenoid? If so, then the above would not work anyway. As others have said, wiring needs to be check for looseness, especially ground to chassis. Starter solenoid or starter itself could be bad. Could be a fuse or relay as well.
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Old 06-05-2018, 09:47 AM   #11
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1994 Winnebago Vectra 34m

http://https://photos.app.goo.gl/olMfUbDvuk8NH3Au2
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Old 06-05-2018, 10:15 AM   #12
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Pics of 1994 Winnebago Vectra 34m

https://drive.google.com/folderview?...Z9ynUBxHW2Nx4M
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Old 06-05-2018, 10:23 AM   #13
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Take a close look in there for another cable that goes to the engine block. I see one ground ( neg ) cable. I think it should have 2.
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Old 06-05-2018, 10:28 AM   #14
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I have uploaded pics on google drive if the batteries and battery configuration in the previous post.
The last link checks good. Not sure about any previous posts concerning pics.
Thanks again.
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