Class "A" Toyhaulers

[focker]

Originally Posted by DGShaffer

My biggest fear in life it that if I die first my will sell all my stuff for what I told her I paid for it!

LMAO, best thing I have read all day

[Shapi]

In researching a few that are out there I have been left with a few questions. One I will throw out there now. I know many on this forum are happy Outlaw owners, so I am not sure how objective or experienced some are with this, but are the Newmar Canyon Star 3920's better Class A toy haulers? Now I know it comes down to preference, so I guess, what I am really asking is why does Newmar charge and is able to get a premium price for the 3920? Are they better build quality and so you pay more for that? Do they use better materials, components, etc? Any insight would be great.

As always, thank you!

[Orangepeel]

Originally Posted by Shapi

In researching a few that are out there I have been left with a few questions. One I will throw out there now. I know many on this forum are happy outlaw owners, so I am not sure how objective or experienced some are with this, but are the Newmar Canyon Star 3920's better class A toy haulers? Now I know it comes down to preference, so I guess, what I am really asking is why does Newmar charge and is able to get a premium price for the 3920? Are they better build quality and so you pay more for that? Do they use better materials, components, etc? Any insight would be great. As always, thank you!

From a glance, dedicated downstairs bedroom, sony electronics, central vac, powers seats, wood floors, think it has a convection oven and a bit fancier interior. I do not know about exterior. There may be other interior items. I also feel you are paying a premium for the Newmar name, but then there are a lot of manufacturers like that. Not saying it is or is not deserved.

For us it came down to floor plan. I did not care about a dedicated bedroom and was fine with the loft. I did not like the main tv placement in the Newmar(over the cab). I did not want an electric bunk in the garage, preferred it being over cab. The bathroom sticks out in the Canyon Star and the wall looked awkward to me. I don't think at the time we were looking the Canyon Star had the back patio set up, not sure if it does now. It has been a year since we started looking and close to a year since we bought.

That said....the Canyon Star has a prettier interior, no question. I also would have liked to have those power seats. But I still am happy with the choice we made. Personally, I like the interiors of some of the 5th wheel toy haulers better but we didn't want a 5th wheel.

Basically, it is eventually going to boil down to personal preference and what you think is right for you. None of us can answer that.

Oh, one other thing. You had mentioned wanting to stick to 100k. You will never get a new Canyon Star for 100k, it is highly doubtful you would get a new Outlaw for that amount. You will either need to shift to looking at pre-owned or hope that somehow a dealer has a previous year model he didn't sell, really wants off his lot and that hopefully doesn't have lot rot from sitting unused for so long. The latter is probably unlikely.

Not trying to be a killjoy, and of am sorry if i am, but that is my honest opinion. There are always high quality per owned coaches out there. Maybe give them a look too so you keep to that number you set.

[Shapi]

Thanks OP. As for the budget, I am figuring that we will have to go used. I am hoping to find someone who got in on impulse and now needs to get out...or like you said a dealer that just is tired of looking at it and needs the space. The longer they on on the lot, the more they cost!

[Orangepeel]

I think you will have great luck finding a good used toy hauler, regardless of brand you choose. With summer here there may be people ready to sell now, looking for people who want to start their adventures when the weather is nice.

[Scarab0088]

Shapi,

If considering new, NOW is the time to be looking for that year-end deal on a 2014 model from either maker. Newmar and TMC have introduced their 2015's.
To compare, in late summer 2013, there were some close-out deals on new/never used 2013 Outlaw's in the mid $90,000's.

If buying used - the best prices will be had after the summer months due to demand.

For new, both makers produce a very fine product, on duplicate Ford 26,000lb GVWR chassis (there's no chronic slide or chassis problems in the Outlaw!). But please be aware that there are just fewer total units made from Newmar, starting in 2009 and fewer total units made vs. 2007 for TMC with a much higher production volume.

The real difference to any buyer will be in personal desires (like how the rear end cap is designed, lift bed in the garage vs. the front overhead - loft vs. no loft - choice in surfaces, fabrics, etc.)

Note worthy is that there is an Outlaw with a dedicated bedroom called the 37MD

AND - please notice that Newmar has introduced the CS3921 with a massive 1 piece full-wall slide that goes from the drivers seat to just forward of the garage! If you want room - it's huge!

Start your search and come back with specific questions. Owners will be quick to help here:
http://www.irv2.com/forums/f103/new-...up-120271.html
here:
http://www.irv2.com/forums/f103/cany...er-178956.html
and here:
http://www.irv2.com/forums/f120/i-lo...aw-102560.html


Best luck!

[bross]

We haven't even picked up our new 2014 Canyon Star yet, 2 more weeks. But I'll chime in with why we chose it. Main reason is we liked the floor plan of the CS better and really did not want the loft. Some of the reasons pointed out to us about why a Newmar is better: thicker walls, most coach builders use aluminum frames with insulation sandwiched between the inner and outer walls and bonded together. Newmar add a styrofoam layer between the frame and insulation and the outer wall providing better insulation, keeping it both warmer and cooler. Was told and I've seen different coaches on frosty mornings where you can see all the panels frosty but you can tell where every "stud" is.

Newmar have their own slide rail system that made sense to me, large toothed cog that engages in the rail, instead of a fine toothed rail. I've seen/heard more than a few people beating and banging on their lopsided slides trying to fix a jumped gear.

We just sold our 26' Winnebago that we towed a 14' utility trailer for our bikes. We decided that we wanted it all, we want our bikes, but we also wanted a vehicle for rainy days, for garage saleing etc. So now we have everything we need, and without the car we're basically the same length as we were with the smaller RV towing the trailer.

Anyway, will let everyone know how our pickup and delivery goes and our first impressions.

[Scarab0088]

Great information above - Thanks!!! Congrats and best luck with the Canyon Star!!

The point about the slide gear (Schwintec Slide Gear ) is true for many new RV's. New Outlaw's have these new drives - but only since late 2013 models. Before that, the slide gear was a very heavy rack and pinion set from Lippert (easy to get parts if needed).

But, the point about the walls has me confused. Please see the mfgt video labled "Sidewalls and Roof" here: Award Winning Quality Control | Newmar
Newmar stuffs the erect wall with pink insulation then bonds the exterior wall to the frame with industrial adhesive. There is no foam on the outside of the frame.

In contrast, TMC vacuum bonds all walls and roofing units with solid foam cores before installation on the frame. See: 2015 Outlaw Class A Toy Haulers: Class C Motorhomes by Thor Motor Coach

The results are a similar R value, and neither have an exterior foam layer.

Thanks again to Bross! Please share all about that beautiful new coach.

[DGShaffer]

We took the Newmar tour and they were using batton type insulation and then the outside laminate is glued on and held in place with 2x4's until the glue set. The other thing I didn't like was the running of the electric inside the walls where it's inaccessible if there's an issue. The side walls are screwed down onto the floor rather than to the side like Thor. The only reason they cost more is due to their lack of purchasing power.

[JeffAZ]

Originally Posted by Orangepeel

...I don't think at the time we were looking the Canyon Star had the back patio set up, not sure if it does now...

Orangepeel, a patio Don Deck is not possible with the Canyon Star because of the back door design. The door has the angle hump built into it. The same angle that the OTL has built into its floor. I feel the OTL door design here is far superior to the Newmar. Yes, the Newmar has a 12' garage compared to the OTL's 10', but the hump in the door and the backward opening bedroom door negates most of that space.

I agree the Canyon Star interior is "prettier", but I prefer my OTL interior, which I consider to be more of a "utilitarian" motif!

[Scarab0088]

Originally Posted by JeffAZ

...the Newmar has a 12' garage compared to the OTL's 10'...

A 12' garage would be AWESOME!!!

But both Canyon Stars have exactly 10' deep garages. See:
Canyon Star Floorplans | Newmar
and
Canyon Star Floorplans | Newmar

The Outlaw 3611, 37LS and 37MD's garages are 10'2" (122") See:
2015 Outlaw Class A Toy Haulers: Class C Motorhomes by Thor Motor Coach

To get a 12' garage in a Class A, you have to find a used Gulfstream Bounty Hunter:
http://www.irv2.com/forums/f258/clas...ml#post1249932
or Outlaw 3808:
http://www.irv2.com/forums/f258/clas...ml#post1249942

They are rare, but they are out there

[JeffAZ]

Ya I must have been thinking of the BountyHunter. So the design of the Canyon Star garage makes it's usable space less than 10 feet.

BTW, is Gulfstream still operating?

[Scarab0088]

Originally Posted by JeffAZ

BTW, is Gulfstream still operating?

Only for towables: Travel Trailers, Fifth Wheels, Light Weight, Toy Haulers | Gulf Stream RV
But they are supporting their motorized model owners here:
Untitled Document

I really wanted a Bounty Hunter, but they were just to rare to find a good deal.

[Orangepeel]

I was curious on the Bounty Hunter. Here is one for sale on RV Trader for anyone else that wants to look at pictures and floor plan.

2008 Gulf Stream Bounty Hunter 381b, Greenfield IN - 112061185 - RVTrader.com