DEF Sensors complaint filed with NHTSA

[tnedator]

When I go to NHSTA and enter my VIN it says VIN not found. Is there a special site for RV vins, or does that mean Spartan didn't properly register it with NHSTA?

[R.Wold]

This is what get from their vin decoder:

Vehicle Type: INCOMPLETE VEHICLE
Model Year: 2016
Make: FREIGHTLINER
Model: XC-R Raised Rail Rear Engine Motor Home Chassis
Body Class: Incomplete - Motor Home Chassis

Have you tried their vin decoder or just entering it in the vin field of the complaint form?

https://vpic.nhtsa.dot.gov/decoder/Decoder

[tnedator]

Originally Posted by R.Wold

This is what get from their vin decoder:

Vehicle Type: INCOMPLETE VEHICLE
Model Year: 2016
Make: FREIGHTLINER
Model: XC-R Raised Rail Rear Engine Motor Home Chassis
Body Class: Incomplete - Motor Home Chassis

Have you tried their vin decoder or just entering it in the vin field of the complaint form?

https://vpic.nhtsa.dot.gov/decoder/Decoder

Vin field of complaint form which won't let me proceed.

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by tnedator

Vin field of complaint form which won't let me proceed.

I wonder how often that happens - it appears they have very poor data collection and storage. Imagine that!

[fatboy4909]

go here first. "https://www.nhtsa.gov/recalls"

then you will see in the middle of page the words
VIN VEHICLE CAR SEATS TIRES EQUIPMENT

click on VEHICLE and then under the words Check your vehicle safety you will see

Also search by NHTSA ID or..... click on NHTSA ID

then enter the NHTSA ID in the cell and press go
then towards bottom of screen you will see the words Components: ENGINE
press on those words, then scroll to bottom of page where it says
1 affected product and press on that...and the make, model and year shows up.

Sorry but I wasn't smart enough to provide a link directly to the answer you wanted.....

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by fatboy4909

go here first. "https://www.nhtsa.gov/recalls"

then you will see in the middle of page the words
VIN VEHICLE CAR SEATS TIRES EQUIPMENT

click on VEHICLE and then under the words Check your vehicle safety you will see

Also search by NHTSA ID or..... click on NHTSA ID

then enter the NHTSA ID in the cell and press go
then towards bottom of screen you will see the words Components: ENGINE
press on those words, then scroll to bottom of page where it says
1 affected product and press on that...and the make, model and year shows up.

Sorry but I wasn't smart enough to provide a link directly to the answer you wanted.....

Well you managed to prove there’s a problem with their reporting system and I think that’s pretty important. There’s no way I could have missed that error when filing my first report. It will be interesting to see what happens with my new one.

[Solo_RV_Guy]

Originally Posted by R.Wold

I wonder how often that happens - it appears they have very poor data collection and storage. Imagine that!

Data services and web design by lowest *qualified for government work* bidder. The NHTSA is hardly the only agency that has dealt with things that break or input that does not conform to developer expectations.

[Ray,IN]

Scroll down to
So right here’s the attainable workaround

https://ustravel.news/rv-rentals/str...ble-workaround

[dmctlc]

Originally Posted by Ray,IN

Scroll down to
So right here’s the attainable workaround

https://ustravel.news/rv-rentals/str...ble-workaround

Thanks for passing this along. Appreciate the updated info. Questions I'd have for those mentioned in the article is what I think still need to be answered. Not to be critical of what is said in this article but its a lot of words IMHO say very little other than they agreed to have only one POC for anyone to bug on a DEF failure. Hate to be that person. Second the work-around as stated might've worked for the crane guy though not sure long term, they still waiting to hear back. Also not sure if this would work for MH DEF failures. JMO but even if it did on short term would you be still able to get a replacement or would you have to wait until it fails again? It still amazes me that the NHTSA doesn't deem this a safety issue. They're the ones everyone needs to bug. When mine failed I was on pins and needles, first to get back home which was about 150 miles but second to get to the Cummins Service Center 60 miles away and that Tiffin would follow through and send a new head once confirmed as a failure. I was one of the lucky ones at the end of April this year. Both happened within 3 days though having a new makes me feel better, hearing gen 6 fail as well makes me still cautious.

[tyoneonit]

After two DEF head failures I began a rigorous writing campaign. NHTSA finally called me a couple of months ago. Also received this email yesterday from the EPA:

Thank you for your email to Mr. Regan regarding failed Diesel Emission Fluid sensors. The EPA has issued the following message through our compliance office addressing this issue.

Statement Regarding Failed Diesel Emission Fluid (DEF) Sensors

EPA and the California Air Resources Board (CARB) have been working with the manufacturers of diesel vehicles and engines to address this issue related to the ongoing shortage of computer chips and the impact that has had on the availability of certain replacement parts. One part in particular, a sensor that monitors the quality of diesel emissions fluid (DEF), has been of concern because the failure of the part can lead to the vehicle being unable to operate. The Engine Manufacturers Association (EMA) on behalf of its member companies has proposed an industry wide approach that would provide a software solution for vehicles with failed parts to enable them to operate temporarily while the industry works to produce more replacement parts and that, long term, would provide replacement parts through a recall program. EPA and CARB have reviewed the proposed approach and believe it is appropriate for the companies to implement the proposed solution going forward as quickly as possible.

The manufacturers must still develop new software code and test it to ensure the software can be installed on vehicles in the field. The companies expected that they would begin fixing some vehicles with failed sensors as soon as this week. The companies will also make available a similar software update for vehicles whose sensors have not failed but are among a group of vehicles where such a failure could be expected to occur to prevent a sensor failure from disabling the vehicle. This updated software is likewise expected to be available to service centers in the coming weeks.

For more information, please contact your dealer or service center. Thank you for contacting the Office of Transportation and Air Quality.


Sincerely,

Communications Team
Office of Transportation and Air Quality
U.S. Environmental Protection Agency

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by tyoneonit

After two DEF head failures I began a rigorous writing campaign. NHTSA finally called me a couple of months ago. Also received this email yesterday from the EPA:

Thank you for your email to Mr. Regan regarding failed Diesel Emission Fluid sensors. The EPA has issued the following message through our compliance office addressing this issue.

Statement Regarding Failed Diesel Emission Fluid (DEF) Sensors

EPA and the California Air Resources Board (CARB) have been working with the manufacturers of diesel vehicles and engines to address this issue related to the ongoing shortage of computer chips and the impact that has had on the availability of certain replacement parts. One part in particular, a sensor that monitors the quality of diesel emissions fluid (DEF), has been of concern because the failure of the part can lead to the vehicle being unable to operate. The Engine Manufacturers Association (EMA) on behalf of its member companies has proposed an industry wide approach that would provide a software solution for vehicles with failed parts to enable them to operate temporarily while the industry works to produce more replacement parts and that, long term, would provide replacement parts through a recall program. EPA and CARB have reviewed the proposed approach and believe it is appropriate for the companies to implement the proposed solution going forward as quickly as possible.

The manufacturers must still develop new software code and test it to ensure the software can be installed on vehicles in the field. The companies expected that they would begin fixing some vehicles with failed sensors as soon as this week. The companies will also make available a similar software update for vehicles whose sensors have not failed but are among a group of vehicles where such a failure could be expected to occur to prevent a sensor failure from disabling the vehicle. This updated software is likewise expected to be available to service centers in the coming weeks.

For more information, please contact your dealer or service center. Thank you for contacting the Office of Transportation and Air Quality.


Sincerely,

Communications Team
Office of Transportation and Air Quality
U.S. Environmental Protection Agency

I read this same response on another thread at least a week ago. Have you posted it before? If it wasn’t you, someone else did and it’s a new boiler plate response. I’ll be somewhat amazed when I hear that it has actually been developed and implemented.

On another note, I received a phone call from Newmar Customer Service yesterday about my latest NHTSA complaint. Apparently they track these but don’t get the details of the submission, so they wanted to know about the problem. It’s not a Newmar issue, but it was nice to see they track potential safety issues and want to address them. So to Newmar!

[jerryd13]

Dear friends in the Motor Home DEF Community.


My I add a few important things that will help us all in this period of DEF issues and solutions. Please simply follow the following minimum steps.


1. Always provide 100% accurate information. note below.



* Year and Model vehicle.
* Mfg. and size engine.
* Mfg. of Chassis.


* Description of failure, no guesses, only the facts you know.


* DO NOT ACCEPT ALL THE QUICK FIX SOLUTIONS, disconnecting

speedometer cable, Rabbit foot, or other non accurate fixes.
* If you have a DEF quality issue,

? How old is the DEF Fluid.
? Was it stored in 80 degree F temps or higher, general Rule of thumb is
for brand new DEF, BASED ON DATE CODE- SEE DATE CODE READING

EXPLANATION BELOW.



36 Months at 77 Deg F
18 Months at 77 Deg. F
12 Months at 86 Deg. F
6 Months at 95 Deg. F


Peak Blue DEF Fluid date code explanation. GA 20 83 0503


GA = Plant Mfg.


20 = Year, BUT YOU MUST SUBTRACT 1 FROM THIS NUMBER. for

example if it say's 20, then the actual year of Mfg. = 19 or 2019.


083 = the 83 Day on a 365 day JULIAN CALENDAR. 365 Minus 83=

the 282 day of the year. this would be, Oct. 9th.


therefor, the DEF was manufactured on Oct. 9, 2019.


Then using the life expectancy information above, you can now quickly see the expected time your DEF Fluid is good for.


So if you don't know this, you are flying BLIND, and again this is just one more issue we need help from the EPA, the DEF Manufacturers, and I advise, use fresh DEF, pay attention to time DEF sits in your MH if it is parked or stored, so you will avoid this problem. It really is easy to do.


We all can do these things and make our MH experience much more trouble free.


Jerryd13

[Pheaton 2018]

I’m in the same boat right now they say my main
Silo iOS is out and have 4 codes up basically all the codes there is for the def are on i ha e been told at this point I can not get the part and have have no idea when I will get it there is only one supplier of this part or the Cummings motor there is no aftermarket parts this is so unacceptable I can’t believe it I guess at this point I do not know where to turn

[tnedator]

Originally Posted by Pheaton 2018

I’m in the same boat right now they say my main
Silo iOS is out and have 4 codes up basically all the codes there is for the def are on i ha e been told at this point I can not get the part and have have no idea when I will get it there is only one supplier of this part or the Cummings motor there is no aftermarket parts this is so unacceptable I can’t believe it I guess at this point I do not know where to turn

Have you reached out to Tiffin directly, or just the diesel shop contacting freightliner? If you haven't called Tiffin, I would, since some people have had better luck with Tiffin having the parts than through normal supply channels.