DEF Sensors complaint filed with NHTSA

[richie-rich2]

It is time for those who have new coaches still under a manufactures warranty file suit against the manufacture to get restitution. We can fight back. I found this article in rvtravel.com a now weekly publication that may assist some of you. I have been getting this electronic magazine for over 10 years now and I respect the editor and most authors. Here is a website for an attorney who focuses on the RV industry. Best of luck - Richard

https://www.rvtravel.com/lemon-law-a...e-rv-industry/

[RV_Lee]

Didnt read the whole thread and not sure if this has been said but many towns have DEF systems deleted in their emergency vehicles. Cant have them going into limp mode while racing to a fire or racing to the hospital with a person dying in the back. No military vehicles have ANY emission controls for the same reason



But its totally OK to ruin your vacation

[tyoneonit]

Originally Posted by RV_Lee

Didnt read the whole thread and not sure if this has been said but many towns have DEF systems deleted in their emergency vehicles. Cant have them going into limp mode while racing to a fire or racing to the hospital with a person dying in the back. No military vehicles have ANY emission controls for the same reason



But its totally OK to ruin your vacation

What government entity is going to risk getting fined for doing that????
Besides, engine manufacturers already have embedded code to prevent DEF issues from shutting down engines. Buses and emergency vehicles have that code. Where do you think the EPA, engine and chassis mfgs came up with the idea to make it available to the rv world?

[Joebmetro]

I just received a notice of the same problem with my 2016 Ford F-250
Are the same sensors also used on the 2019 Freightliner chassis

TIA

[dj3183]

https://www.rvtravel.com/motorhomers...e-rules-1052b/

[ronboatplane]

Wonder if Shaw head 7th edition has had any failures. My current is 6th and had my failure on #5. I’ve seen a few failures reported on sixes on IRV2 but don’t know if anyone had seen the stats.

[i01rar]

chuck look on pittsburg power web site there is something called fuel max it works great on diesels

[dj3183]

Interesting article concerning DEF shortages. Isn’t it interesting that our country mandates the use of DEF and the two countries that produce the most urea required for the production of DEF (Russia, #1 and China, #2) are our top two adversaries. Way to go, U.S.! Is that the stupidest thing you’ve ever heard, or what?

“DEF is largely water, the balance of about a third is urea. That’s an organic chemical compound that, long before DEF was even dreamed of, was a major player in fertilizer. And that’s part of what’s causing the alarm about potential DEF shortages. China, the second-largest world exporter of urea, is having issues with an increased in-country demand for fertilizer. In the first quarter of this year, its exports had dropped nearly a third. The first largest exporter of urea is none other than Russia. Certain issues between Russia and Ukraine have led to economic constraints and export restrictions.”

https://www.rvtravel.com/def-shortages-sideline-summer-travel-plans-rvt-1055b/

[Solo_RV_Guy]

Originally Posted by dj3183

Interesting article concerning DEF shortages. Isn’t it interesting that our country mandates the use of DEF and the two countries that produce the most urea required for the production of DEF (Russia, #1 and China, #2) are our top two adversaries. Way to go, U.S.! Is that the stupidest thing you’ve ever heard, or what?

“DEF is largely water, the balance of about a third is urea. That’s an organic chemical compound that, long before DEF was even dreamed of, was a major player in fertilizer. And that’s part of what’s causing the alarm about potential DEF shortages. China, the second-largest world exporter of urea, is having issues with an increased in-country demand for fertilizer. In the first quarter of this year, its exports had dropped nearly a third. The first largest exporter of urea is none other than Russia. Certain issues between Russia and Ukraine have led to economic constraints and export restrictions.”

https://www.rvtravel.com/def-shortag...ans-rvt-1055b/

The use of DEF pre-dates the current international political situations.

IMNSHO, this thread not the place for a discussion about the geopolitical issues regarding DEF. This thread is for documenting the reporting of DEF head failures and their safety impact to the NTSB, and to share any responses the NTSB makes to complainants.

[bjogan]

Great job. Will follow up with a filing. We got stuck over Christmas in a rest stop. Fortunately they did not make us get towed since we agreed to limp a couple miles down to I-75 to a campground where serve stranded for 2 week while Spartan went through Christmas shutdown and inventory. Had we not been near a campground, we would have had to have been towed to a repair facility. I think getting stuck on an interstate is easily a safety issue.

Let's hope they press these guys to resolve the issue and perhaps issue a recall for those who have not had the better ones installed.

[ROUGHRIDER3]

I to have had to be towed. The governent employees are well aware of the problem but could care less since basically they cannot be fired and think they are over worked. Lazy! If they had to make a profit like most enitys, I sure things would be different. How much effort and time is required to pick up a pencil and change some rules to help the people for whom they supposely work for. Why 5 more years to write new rules, seems about a hours work to me?

[Solo_RV_Guy]

Originally Posted by ROUGHRIDER3

I to have had to be towed. The governent employees are well aware of the problem but could care less since basically they cannot be fired and think they are over worked. Lazy! If they had to make a profit like most enitys, I sure things would be different. How much effort and time is required to pick up a pencil and change some rules to help the people for whom they supposely work for. Why 5 more years to write new rules, seems about a hours work to me?

It's generally unhelpful to ascribe motives to people you don't know.

Also, how would a regulatory body "make a profit"?

And it's not as easy as picking up a pencil to change something folks don't like. Trust me on this, I worked for 22 years with various regulatory agencies (none in transportation, though).

Finally, the NHTSA works for ALL persons who use the highways for moving themselves or property. They don't work for "you" or "me" as an individual.

From my observations here in the RV world, 90%+ of the problem DEF sensors and related ephemera came from a single manufacturer/distributor. It's not the fluid, it's not the engine manufacturer (although Cummins is taking much heat). The blame largely sits with Shaw Development. Why is there no class action lawsuit against them? Nope, it's easier to complain about the government and the folks who work for it.

[shagphil]

I spent 25 years in government regulations and I would generally agree with the gentleman that most Federal Employees after 5 years ARE lazy. They feel they have a "job for life" and don't have to act or care about what they are doing. Plus, with all the political BS at the top they generally begin to think "who cares"!

[ROUGHRIDER3]

If the NHTSA is aware of the problem, they are, why has it not been rectified? Many people are being effected by this problem, OTR truckers, construction equipment, Motorhomes, pick-up trucks and more. A problem exist, but they could care less apparently.