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Old 09-15-2019, 05:43 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivylog View Post
Maybe someone with a regular AR license will look on the back of it as a regular GA license has the normal 26K lb limit and 10K trailer BUT it goes on and says “All recreational vehicles are included” under this license...my wife can drive our 45,000 lb DP with air brakes using her regular GA license.

OH wait, didn’t danny285 above already confirm this???
It doesn't, it just says valid for "non-commercial vehicle."

This might be the appropriate statute. It's the definitions statute of the Transportation portion of Arkansas statutes.

Arkansas Code Title 27. Transportation § 27-23-103. Definitions


Quote:
(7) “Commercial motor vehicle” means a motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the motor vehicle is a:

(A) Combination Vehicle (Group A) -- having a gross combination weight rating or gross combination weight of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more), whichever is greater, inclusive of a towed unit or units with a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of more than 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds), whichever is greater;

(B) Heavy Straight Vehicle (Group B) -- having a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more), whichever is greater;  or

(C) Small Vehicle (Group C) that does not meet Group A or B requirements under subdivision (7)(A) and (B) of this section but that either:

(i) Is designed to transport sixteen (16) or more passengers, including the driver;  or

(ii) Is of any size and is used in the transportation of hazardous materials;
I've emailed DFA, which is the Arkansas department that handles licensing, to attempt to get confirmation, but the above statute is probably the appropriate statute for excluding RV's from requiring commercial licence due to weight.
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:04 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnedator View Post
I've emailed DFA, which is the Arkansas department that handles licensing, to attempt to get confirmation, but the above statute is probably the appropriate statute for excluding RV's from requiring commercial licence due to weight.

Again, not meaning any disrespect, but isn't that essentially the argument here? An RV isn't a commercial vehicle, therefore, they are excluded from requiring either a commercial (or even a special-class non-commercial license, if there was one). The implication is that weight is not considered for anything but "commercial" vehicles.

I realize that you really want to have that written clarification. Here's hoping that Arkansas is a different kind of bureaucracy than some of the other states I've dealt with and you'll get the desired response. Again, I only wish you the best outcome with this!
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:12 PM   #17
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Again, not meaning any disrespect, but isn't that essentially the argument here? An RV isn't a commercial vehicle, therefore, they are excluded from requiring either a commercial (or even a special-class non-commercial license, if there was one). The implication is that weight is not considered for anything but "commercial" vehicles.

I realize that you really want to have that written clarification. Here's hoping that Arkansas is a different kind of bureaucracy than some of the other states I've dealt with and you'll get the desired response. Again, I only wish you the best outcome with this!
It's not that I want written clarification, it's that, by law, if it isn't codified, it isn't fact. No disrespect, but that's a pretty simple concept.

The statute I just posted, unlike what has been posted in this thread previously, appears to be where it is codified. DFA can confirm that.

Again, no disrespect, but if you were in court and said, "judge, everyone knows an RV isn't a commercial vehicle" as your legal basis without being able to point to where it's codified, the judge would almost certainly laugh, before schooling you in how laws and statutory code works.
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:50 PM   #18
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Ah, okay. I guess you'll have to get your legislators to codify in more succinct terms. I have to go back to my first post in this thread ...to me, I just feel you're overthinking the whole thing. But that's not necessarily a criticism. I'm pretty anal myself.

As now a resident of Washington state where, like Arkansas, does not have a requirement for a special class of license for driving heavier non-commercial vehicles for its residents, I probably should have our legislators make it more clear too. I don't feel the need for it at this time personally, however. And the commercial vehicle classifications listed by Arkansas are pretty standard from state to state ...those are the same classifications you'll see in every state as it's federally mandated I believe.

If you're read my previous posts in prior threads on the topic of driver licensing, I've made my sentiments clear that I'd like to see the laws standardized from state to state. I believe anyone driving, for instance, a diesel pusher motorhome (typically over 26,000 lbs. GVWR) should be tested and licensed in the exact same manner as those driving the same class of commercial vehicle.

For example, why should a city bus driver be required to pass tests and possess a special license --CDL Class B written and skills and air brake restriction waiver-- and a person driving almost the exact same vehicle such as a DP motorhome not be required to pass the same tests and be similarly licensed (non-commercial Class B)?

Or why can a resident from Washington state or Arkansas drive the exact same DP motorhome in Nevada or Texas where residents of Nevada or Texas are required to pass tests and have a special non-commercial license? They could theoretically be driving the same vehicle on the exact same roads but one must pass knowledge and skills tests and have a special license and the other does not. It just makes no sense to me.

All states should have the exact same requirements, IMO.
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:51 PM   #19
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I went through this about four years ago. Since I had a class C CDL I just updated mine to class B. Went to take the skills test and they would not let me take it in a MotorHome. Had to rent a truck to take it.
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:55 PM   #20
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Thread Warning!!

Our community rules clearly state:
Do not take every opportunity to express your disagreement, incite argument, insult each other, or fan flames. Voice your opinion respectfully and then let it go.
Voice your opinion respectfully and then let it go!!

Let's get back on subject so this thread can remain open.
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Old 09-15-2019, 09:39 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by tnedator View Post
It's not that I want written clarification, it's that, by law, if it isn't codified, it isn't fact.

The statute I just posted, unlike what has been posted in this thread previously, appears to be where it is codified. DFA can confirm that.

Again, no disrespect, but if you were in court and said, "judge, everyone knows an RV isn't a commercial vehicle" as your legal basis without being able to point to where it's codified, the judge would almost certainly laugh, before schooling you in how laws and statutory code works.
I think the point being missed here is the definition of "commerce".

com·merce

/ˈkämərs/
noun
noun: commerce

1.
the activity of buying and selling, especially on a large scale.
"the possible increase of commerce by a great railroad"
synonyms: trade, trading, buying and selling, business, bargaining, dealing, traffic, trafficking;

This explicitly confirms a MH used for personal use only is NOT a commercial vehicle which would exclude it from the license requirements.

In Tennessee, they make the law more clear on the subject which I believe is the same except "implied" in AR and a lot of other states:

(12) (A) "Commercial motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the motor vehicle: (i) Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating of twenty-six thousand one (26,001) or more pounds;
(ii) Is designed to transport more than fifteen (15) passengers, including the driver; or
(iii) Is of any size and is used in the transportation of hazardous materials, as defined in this section;
(B) However, the following vehicles and groups of vehicles shall not be considered commercial motor vehicles for the purposes of this chapter: (iv) Vehicles designed and used primarily as recreational vehicles as defined in this section;
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Old 09-15-2019, 10:24 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by bharrisv65 View Post
I think the point being missed here is the definition of "commerce".

com·merce

/ˈkämərs/
noun
noun: commerce

1.
the activity of buying and selling, especially on a large scale.
"the possible increase of commerce by a great railroad"
synonyms: trade, trading, buying and selling, business, bargaining, dealing, traffic, trafficking;

This explicitly confirms a MH used for personal use only is NOT a commercial vehicle which would exclude it from the license requirements.

In Tennessee, they make the law more clear on the subject which I believe is the same except "implied" in AR and a lot of other states:

(12) (A) "Commercial motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the motor vehicle: (i) Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating of twenty-six thousand one (26,001) or more pounds;
(ii) Is designed to transport more than fifteen (15) passengers, including the driver; or
(iii) Is of any size and is used in the transportation of hazardous materials, as defined in this section;
(B) However, the following vehicles and groups of vehicles shall not be considered commercial motor vehicles for the purposes of this chapter: (iv) Vehicles designed and used primarily as recreational vehicles as defined in this section;
I posted the Arkansas statute a few posts above, which I found this afternoon, which is very similar to the Tenn one you posted.
(But for the explicit RV exemption) It's not in the section of Arkansas code that describes what type of license is needed for different purposes (what people posted earlier in this thread), but instead I found it in the code associated with the requirements for a commercial license.

I feel a lot more comfortable after finding the definition of "commercial vehicle" in Arkansas code.
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Old 09-16-2019, 12:36 PM   #23
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Long story, long, which I will try and make short.

I emailed Department of Finance and Administration (functions as DMV in Arkansas) and state police CDL departments last night.

DFA responded first, and in response to my question about whether I need a CDL for an RV over 26,000 lbs, they responded "Yes." Followed by saying that a CDL is needed for any vehicle 26,001 or more. (period) Then, a second sentence that said all RV and campers are exempt.

So, I emailed them back and said that there two statements seemed to conflict, and what happens with an RV that's over 26,000lbs, and also pointed out that those that have tried to schedule a class B in an RV were told they won't give a driving test in an RV. They responded with "call us."

In the meantime, I got an email from the state police who said, "There are no CDL requirements for a vehicle registered and licensed as a RV in the State of Arkansas. I would check with my insurance carrier for their requirements."

When I called the DFA CDL line, they told me "they've been told by the state police that there is no requirement for a CDL for any RV."

So, while the DFA sent me a conflicting statement in writing, over the phone they said pretty much verbatim what the ASP said.

It sure would be nice if on the DFA site or elsewhere they would actually document what the state police says, which is a vehicle registered as an RV is exempt. To the best of my knowledge, this isn't documented anyplace where we can find it other than contacting the state police.
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