Fred vs DP?

[Scarab0088]

I think this is a Roadmaster FRED: Monaco Coach - vesta

300 HP Maxxforce V8 (non-DEF until they're all gone), 29,000 GVWR, and air-bag suspension.

[Chuck 1935]

Originally Posted by SuperGewl

Sorry according to their video it is a DP and also if you look at the video you can see that it does NOT have a grill up fromt for air flow. They also state it will fit into a 12' garage door. Yes it has an Alison tranny , but they all do. This one has the 2100 Alison and only a 4 -5k towing capacity. Yes it comes with a 10k hitch but the GCWR is 30k.

Whatever it is, it sure has a massive amount of overhang. It should be lots of fun in a crosswind.
You would think that after all these years and all the extra stuff they sell to keep these tail waggers between the ditches, that tjhey would extend the wheelbases. Appaently the are still learning how to build these things. It's no wonder they went belly up once.
Like I have said, they sell you a big kit, it's up to you to make it work right !!

[SuperGewl]

I must admit I was mistaken, the Bounder Classic Diesel is a FRED. I was looking at the Excursion which is a DP.

[edgray]

Originally Posted by 336muffin

It is a fred and does have air suspension and brakes, a friend of mine just bought one at the FMA rally in Goshen, In. last month.

Not doubting you at all, just VERY puzzled about who's CHASSIS it is built upon. Will you please ask your friend to confirm the brand of the chassis? THANKS! Ed

[Ernie Ekberg]

I have had the front engine gasser and diesel. Got tired of climbing over engine doghouse. Now, all noise, hump and heat is 40 feet behind. When you are over 60- you can hear the wife better. That may be good or bad- your call

[szy]

Originally Posted by gmanatl

The Freds I have looked at don't have air brakes or air bag suspension. Several manufacturers have stopped making them. DPs cost more but you get more in my opinion.

Air bags are nice

[336muffin]

Originally Posted by edgray

Not doubting you at all, just VERY puzzled about who's CHASSIS it is built upon. Will you please ask your friend to confirm the brand of the chassis? THANKS! Ed

Freightliner, Very quiet and rides very well. Fleetwood had a open live forum at the Goshen FMA Rally last month. They introduced the chassis Engineer that had the task of meeting the criteria's of Fleetwood. Flat floor, air ride, quiet, no hot spots in floor and able to fit in a 12ft garage. They are trying to be innovative in this ever changing market.

[historyljc]

Check the chassis specs at: http://freightlinerchassis.com/image...der%202012.pdf

[edgray]

Originally Posted by 336muffin

Freightliner, Very quiet and rides very well...... Flat floor, air ride, quiet, no hot spots in floor and able to fit in a 12ft garage. They are trying to be innovative in this ever changing market.

Originally Posted by historyljc

Check the chassis specs at: http://freightlinerchassis.com/image...der%202012.pdf

THANKS to both of you for this chassis info! This info tells me FCCC has been busy improving upon their original FRED chassis while I'ved been napping.

The original FRED, heavily promoted and used by Tiffin, was sprung suspension & hydralic brakes. I was unaware of this "new" configuration, which would be a huge improvement IMO. Not sure "why" they chose to de-rate the the ISB to 240HP-but that may be just a typo, as the latest ratings I've seen for that motor are up to 340HP.

[CampDaven]

Had two gassers, now a fred. About half the noise of a gasser, about $70K less than like sized DP. 11mpg, honest! Towing 4000lb toad. Only 12K miles so will get better. Love my fred

[Sky_Boss]

Originally Posted by CampDaven

Had two gassers, now a fred. About half the noise of a gasser, about $70K less than like sized DP. 11mpg, honest! Towing 4000lb toad. Only 12K miles so will get better. Love my fred

If I was looking for another part timer MH, I would seriously consider a FRED because I really do like the mid entry and with 2 GSDs, it works well. I think a FRED could present some hurdles for FT use. Reduced basement storage being the biggest.

[Gary RVRoamer]

While the Freightliner FRED chassis has front engine, spring suspension and hydraulic brakes, there are front engine diesels that have air suspension and brakes, e.g. the Monaco Vesta. The Vesta uses a Roadmaster chassis with a MAxxForce diesel in front.

On the other side, there are rear diesel pusher chassis that have leaf springs and hydraulic brakes. Or at least there have been in the past - the older Bounders were an example.

My only point here is that one shouldn't generalize about Freds vs pushers except that one has the engine in the front and the other in the rear. However, I will concede that most Freds have leaf spring suspensions and most pushers have air.

[slickest1]

Like another poster mentioned I would be put off by the rear overhang. On a longer coach it is very hard to not have that unless they stretch the wheelbase. Doing that would affect turning radius and could make for a clumsy unit. With the DP's they set back the front axle to keep the wheel base manageable. The long rear overhang can be a problem in tight quarters as when you turn it can swing out and hit things like fuel pumps etc. They are also notorious for being harder to control in windy situations. I'm sure each has it's pros and cons.

[ga traveler]

Originally Posted by Sky_Boss

Anyway...in delving deeper into the OP's question?

FREDs are going to be more like a gasser in general lay out. You will have a dog house between you and the co pilot but I don't know how much noisier a FRED is compared to a gas. Getting the air brakes and suspension would seem to improve upon the gas chassis. The FRED will probably have a better time with cooling. Like a gas engine you have directed airflow through the grill. A DP doesn't have the direct air flow over the cooling system so it will have to bring it's fans into play more often. I have read that the HP loss to the fans is rather significant.

As I mentioned, I would assume that a FRED genset would be in the rear so running it at night might make for a noisier bedroom.

THOR has a FRED on a Workhorse W20D frame. I'm not an expert but I don't think it has air brakes or suspension. I also don't find the HP stats for the Maxforce V8 diesel either. One article puts it at 620 lb.ft. torque. It only has a 40 gal fuel tank and 22,000 lb GVWR which would also be very small compared to DPs.

It really does depend on what you are looking for. If someone travels light, even has a small toad, something like that might fit the wallet and needs.

Almost any selection needs to factor in price and floor plan as a starting point. From there you can decide if Gas, DP or FRED designs help or hurt your price range and feature desires.

GOOD LUCK.

Sky boss: Is it true air traffic controllers tell pilots where to go?