GVWR Question

[ScoobyDoo]

Originally Posted by Jshopes81

You dont want to fool with Tennessee. At all. They wont impound a vehicle but they will write a ticket. A couple guys i work with were driving from pa to tx in a ram 4500 with a gooseneck that was close to 30k. The one kids dad told him DO NOT GO THROUGH TENNESSEE! what did he do? Went through Tennessee and got himself a nice fine.

I have no doubt Tenn could find something to write about. That is one of the states that had to look under my pillow, roadside safety check, while bobtailing. But I don't know that the over GVWR, would be a issue, most likely a improper paperwork issue. My old Pete had a GCVWR of 80,000. But I had no problem getting a permit to gross 90,000 pulling a tri-axle RGN.
But has anybody ever seen Tennessee pull a RV on the scale? In a RV, I would be much more worried about that state's reputation on "Civil Asset Forfeiture" than I would the weight.

Originally Posted by Roy1

At least your new Motorhome has 1420 lbs extra cargo capacity . My brother has a 30 ft class c toy hauler with a 450 ford chassis. He has lost 4 rear tires in the past year. I had him weigh his coach and we found the Coach is over the gvw. The rear wheels are where the excess weight is. The 16” tires are 200 lbs each over the tire rating. It had an empty water tank and quarter tank of fuel. The only load in the cargo area is a 250 lb motorcycle and his tool box. This coach was sold new with little or no excess carrying capacity and it is a toy box ?? He should have been more aware of gvw like you are.

Most times the tires together are rated more than the axle. If having that much tire trouble upgrading the tires likely move the problem. Might be better to change to a heavier axle and springs. But then will need to watch the frame.

[Teamfoxy]

In 2005, when our RV was manufactured, there was no requirement to post the OCCC. After 13 years, I would not count on it still being correct anyway. I weighed our rig with full fuel, propane, spare tire, safety gear and the built in TV/VCR etc. as a starting point. I made a spreadsheet and weighed all the things we carry. When we were loaded up I weighed the RV again that way to make sure that we were not over.

[ScoobyDoo]

I think everybody should weigh at least once when loaded, ready to use. The fact is the rig will not act the same when over ratings. Not saying nobody should run over ratings, but they should know they are over...

[CWSWine]

Originally Posted by Old-Biscuit

GVWR is NOT covered by any Statue


Drivers License Classification is a infraction of not having the correct DL not being over GVWR

Here is just more info on the subject that based in fact:


By Bob Raybuck
Director of Technical Services
NTEA
Often, GVWR and gross vehicle weight (GVW) are thought to be the same, but they are not. A truck’s GVWR is the maximum weight rating established by the chassis manufacturer. GVW is the total weight of the truck and payload at a point in time.

There’s a common misconception that a truck’s GVWR is determined by adding gross axle weight ratings (GAWRs) together for all axles. Although this was a common way of calculating GVWR many years ago, it’s no longer an accurate method. The chassis manufacturer task of establishing a vehicle GVWR is much more difficult today due to advancement of safety system standards and how vehicles meet these requirements. This is why many trucks have a GVWR much lower than the combined axle ratings. It is not uncommon for a truck with a GVWR of 19,500 pounds to have a front axle rated at 7,500 pounds and a rear axle rated at 14,700 pounds. Safety standards that apply to braking, vehicle stability, and chassis manufacturer internal standards for durability, dynamic stability and handling can restrict GVWR even though the sum of the axle ratings exceeds 22,000 pounds. In this instance, the OEM set the GVWR at 19,500 pounds based on test results and vehicle dynamic performance to ensure a safe, reliable truck.

By Bob Raybuck
Director of Technical Services
NTEA “

https://drivewyze.com/blog/trucking-...g-work-trucks/

[Mudfrog]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

Here is just more info on the subject that based in fact:


By Bob Raybuck
Director of Technical Services
NTEA
Often, GVWR and gross vehicle weight (GVW) are thought to be the same, but they are not. A truck’s GVWR is the maximum weight rating established by the chassis manufacturer. GVW is the total weight of the truck and payload at a point in time.

There’s a common misconception that a truck’s GVWR is determined by adding gross axle weight ratings (GAWRs) together for all axles. Although this was a common way of calculating GVWR many years ago, it’s no longer an accurate method. The chassis manufacturer task of establishing a vehicle GVWR is much more difficult today due to advancement of safety system standards and how vehicles meet these requirements. This is why many trucks have a GVWR much lower than the combined axle ratings. It is not uncommon for a truck with a GVWR of 19,500 pounds to have a front axle rated at 7,500 pounds and a rear axle rated at 14,700 pounds. Safety standards that apply to braking, vehicle stability, and chassis manufacturer internal standards for durability, dynamic stability and handling can restrict GVWR even though the sum of the axle ratings exceeds 22,000 pounds. In this instance, the OEM set the GVWR at 19,500 pounds based on test results and vehicle dynamic performance to ensure a safe, reliable truck.

By Bob Raybuck
Director of Technical Services
NTEA “

https://drivewyze.com/blog/trucking-...g-work-trucks/

This is the way I've always understood it to be. The gvwr on ours is 15,000 lbs. The gawrs are 11,000 and 6,000, a total of 2,000 lbs more capacity. It never crossed my mind that I should go by what the axles were rated for because I know there's definitely more involved in calculating gvwr.

People are running overloaded everyday and make it to their destinations ok. Some however, make it,,, but not without a hitch here and there. A tire failure, mechanical problem, or frame related issue are not fun things to encounter on the road. Longevity of the rig will probably be reduced as well.

The OP has a legitimate concern. If it were me, the first step would be to load up and get the coach weighed. See what I had to work with and go from there..

[hohenwald48]

Originally Posted by Jshopes81

You dont want to fool with Tennessee. At all. They wont impound a vehicle but they will write a ticket. A couple guys i work with were driving from pa to tx in a ram 4500 with a gooseneck that was close to 30k. The one kids dad told him DO NOT GO THROUGH TENNESSEE! what did he do? Went through Tennessee and got himself a nice fine.

Because he was driving a commercial vehicle and not an RV. It's irrelevant and confusing in this discussion.

[hohenwald48]

Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo

I have no doubt Tenn could find something to write about. That is one of the states that had to look under my pillow, roadside safety check, while bobtailing. But I don't know that the over GVWR, would be a issue, most likely a improper paperwork issue. My old Pete had a GCVWR of 80,000. But I had no problem getting a permit to gross 90,000 pulling a tri-axle RGN.

More discussion regarding commercial vehicles. Irrelevant and confusing on an RV forum.

[hohenwald48]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

Here is just more info on the subject that based in fact:


By Bob Raybuck
Director of Technical Services
NTEA
Often, GVWR and gross vehicle weight (GVW) are thought to be the same, but they are not. A truck’s GVWR is the maximum weight rating established by the chassis manufacturer. GVW is the total weight of the truck and payload at a point in time.

There’s a common misconception that a truck’s GVWR is determined by adding gross axle weight ratings (GAWRs) together for all axles. Although this was a common way of calculating GVWR many years ago, it’s no longer an accurate method. The chassis manufacturer task of establishing a vehicle GVWR is much more difficult today due to advancement of safety system standards and how vehicles meet these requirements. This is why many trucks have a GVWR much lower than the combined axle ratings. It is not uncommon for a truck with a GVWR of 19,500 pounds to have a front axle rated at 7,500 pounds and a rear axle rated at 14,700 pounds. Safety standards that apply to braking, vehicle stability, and chassis manufacturer internal standards for durability, dynamic stability and handling can restrict GVWR even though the sum of the axle ratings exceeds 22,000 pounds. In this instance, the OEM set the GVWR at 19,500 pounds based on test results and vehicle dynamic performance to ensure a safe, reliable truck.

By Bob Raybuck
Director of Technical Services
NTEA “

https://drivewyze.com/blog/trucking-...g-work-trucks/

More discussion regarding commercial vehicles. Irrelevant and confusing on an RV forum.

[hohenwald48]

Nobody driving an RV is subject to commercial vehicle rules and regulations in any state. Why do folks have such a hard time understanding that there's a difference between an RV and a commercial vehicle?

[Ray,IN]

To the original question; if your specific situation it is very important you get a 4-corner scale weights measurement. From there you will then have the necessary information to proceed with what you will haul and where. Without that you will be guessing.

Originally Posted by hohenwald48

Nobody driving an RV is subject to commercial vehicle rules and regulations in any state. Why do folks have such a hard time understanding that there's a difference between an RV and a commercial vehicle?

They also get confused with the CDL requirement. For those folks--- THE FIRST WORD IS COMMERCIAL! Commercial is defined as driving for profit or wages.

[hohenwald48]

Originally Posted by Triple H

So I just picked up my new 2019 Fleetwood Bounder 35K. While I am not new to RVing I am new to ownership, been renting them for several years and never really paid any attention to weight. The MSO from Fleetwood states the shipping weight is 20580 lbs, I assume this includes full fuel. This basically leaves me with 1420 lbs cargo, persons, water etc., (22K chassis).

I weigh about 180, wife weighs about 130. If I travel with half a tank of fresh water (tank is 100 gal) 50 gal would be an additional 420 lbs. With just fresh water and two people on board I'm down to 690 lbs of cargo left. Now I haven't weighed any of my gear, but I have been preparing and have purchased 95% of what I think I need to live full time. I have been conscious about the weight of items I'm buying, but a few things are just heavy by nature like the grill, VIAir compressor, assortment of basis tools, etc. Of course I have sewer hoses, fresh and black tank hoses, camp chairs, small table, and multiple other items. I did buy melamine dishes and high end plastic drinkware (as high end as plastic can be) all in an effort to be weight conscious. None of this includes groceries, clothing, etc., but I'm sure it will be more than 690 lbs. I guess my question is, does any leeway exist on this 22k load? I'm sure I won't be 23k, probably somewhere closer to 22.5k. I take the blame for not thinking about the weight prior to purchase, but when the say it sleeps up to 8, that is extremely misleading. Even if everyone weighed 100 lbs, 8 people and a full tank of fresh water would put you over the limit. Other than cutting off a couple of limbs I just don't know where I can reduce the weight.

During the shopping/research phase, before we bought our 2019 Newmar gas motorhome built on the 26K chassis, we eliminated most of the Fleetwood gas powered line because of their low cargo capacity.

As others have said, the first thing you should do is get to a scale. You can go fully loaded or empty. Either way, you'll have a starting point. After that, you'll just have to load accordingly. I wouldn't make any assumptions as to what is included and what is not included in the MSO stated vehicle weight.

Going a few pounds over capacity is not going to cause your motorhome to instantly fall apart. However, it will make it harder to drive, stop, accelerate and just in general unpleasant to live with as you get things over capacity. Remember, most all of us are running near the top of our capacity and spend a lot of time, money and effort trying to get these behemoths to handle in an acceptable manner. Overloading will just make that worse.

There are many aftermarket parts to help with handling. I'm not aware of any aftermarket method to increase the GVWR.

[AKIQPilot]

Originally Posted by hohenwald48

During the shopping/research phase, before we bought our 2019 Newmar gas motorhome built on the 26K chassis, we eliminated most of the Fleetwood gas powered line because of their low cargo capacity.



As others have said, the first thing you should do is get to a scale. You can go fully loaded or empty. Either way, you'll have a starting point. After that, you'll just have to load accordingly. I wouldn't make any assumptions as to what is included and what is not included in the MSO stated vehicle weight.



Going a few pounds over capacity is not going to cause your motorhome to instantly fall apart. However, it will make it harder to drive, stop, accelerate and just in general unpleasant to live with as you get things over capacity. Remember, most all of us are running near the top of our capacity and spend a lot of time, money and effort trying to get these behemoths to handle in an acceptable manner. Overloading will just make that worse.



There are many aftermarket parts to help with handling. I'm not aware of any aftermarket method to increase the GVWR.

Good post and very good advice. Get loaded up with half tank or so worth of fuel and water and some gear and hit the scale. Dont assume anything as far as the MSO stated weight. Once he get a baseline weight he can decide if he needs to carry a little less water, more cargo over the front axle or any combination of things.

When we bought our Adventure i weighed it almost immediately. Half full of fluids but almost no personal gear. It was about 3000 under GVWR. The majority of that extra capacity was over the front axle. Last week i weighed again. Now we have everything for full time living including lots of tools and spare parts for the coach and toad. We are still under the GVWR by 1400lbs and the GCWR by over 3000lbs.

Get a weight on the coach and use that as a starting point. Anything else is just guessing.

[ScoobyDoo]

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
I have no doubt Tenn could find something to write about. That is one of the states that had to look under my pillow, roadside safety check, while bobtailing. But I don't know that the over GVWR, would be a issue, most likely a improper paperwork issue. My old Pete had a GCVWR of 80,000. But I had no problem getting a permit to gross 90,000 pulling a tri-axle RGN.

Originally Posted by hohenwald48

More discussion regarding commercial vehicles. Irrelevant and confusing on an RV forum.

Well sir, you managed to cut out the part of the post that indicated that my reply to warning about a false problem. Long before a state would worry about a RV over GVWR, they would not issue a permit for a CMV over GCVWR. Can I restate what I really said?

Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo

I have no doubt Tenn could find something to write about. That is one of the states that had to look under my pillow, roadside safety check, while bobtailing. But I don't know that the over GVWR, would be a issue, most likely a improper paperwork issue. My old Pete had a GCVWR of 80,000. But I had no problem getting a permit to gross 90,000 pulling a tri-axle RGN.
But has anybody ever seen Tennessee pull a RV on the scale? In a RV, I would be much more worried about that state's reputation on "Civil Asset Forfeiture" than I would the weight.

I don't have any idea what to tell the poor souls that buy a RV then find they can't carry enough stuff in it to use the RV. For the people RV shopping would it be a good idea to weigh the stuff you hope to take with them? But how long do you plan to keep the RV, and how long will that total weight stay the same? Kids grow up, parents grow out. But it is not just a change of weight of bodies. Clothes get bigger, bicycles get bigger... Can't predict future demands, but at least you could walk past the RVs that do not meet present demands. If enough of the impractical rigs where left on the lot...

[Solo_RV_Guy]

Originally Posted by ronster

First,you will never be weighed,you don't have to go over scales.The vehicle won't break in half if you are a thousand over.Make sure you have enough air in tires to carry the weight.The cops don't care about you'they are looking for trucks that are overweight,sometime they check for tires[front]that can't carry the weight.I know I'll be flamed for this post,ex fleet manager for a dump truck and trailer operation.Take it easy and be safe!

There *were* a few states that required RVs to stop at motor carrier inspection stations/port of entry/etc. I remember Colorado required (note past tense) RVs and even pickups pulling trailers of *any* description to get weighed. I haven't traveled to Colorado in the last few years so i don't know if they still do this, but there is precedent for it.


In my state your RV registration fee is based on weight, so if you're weighed and found over your registration classification you get the same ticket as an overweight truck. As registrations are typically based on the maximum placarded weight of the vehicle the GVWR is a *legal issue* at least where I am. That said, a quick internet search didn't turn up any public reports of RV drivers being cited for overweight here.



We have lots of retired L.E.O. on the forums who can probably tell us personal anecdotes related to this topic but I will say this: a cop will do what a cop wants to do; if he or she is wrong a judge will decide at a later time. Is that a risk? Sure, and so are floods in the Mohave...


But for the OP... really, do you want to operate an overloaded and potentially unsafe vehicle with your family, yourself, possible friends and neighbors riding inside? I'd hope not...