Installing Lithium Batteries in 2019 Vista 29ve

[nnason]

I bought two Battleborn batteries as drop-ins for the cheap OEM lead-acid batteries in my 2019 Winnebago Vista 29VE. In my research I found drop-in isn't the case. My research, which follows, found four alternatives. Has anyone installed Lithium batteries in their 2019 Vista. How hard was it? What parts did you use? Any help/ideas/pictures would be appreciated. I have the current wiring diagrams such as they are.

The email thread:
Noah,

All 3 of these options you’ve included here will work. We have the most experience with the battery isolation manager, but have assisted a number of customers using both the RedArc and Victron options.

If you plan to use 2 batteries in the system the RedArc would be our suggestion as it will put an appropriate amperage for the batteries without risking an over charge and potentially shortening the cycle life. The other options will work, but exceeding 100 amps for 2 batteries will cut down their lifespan.

Please let us know if we can help with anything else.

Best,

Eric Carter
Battle Born Batteries
775-622-3448



From: Noah Nason <sp2.nason@earthlink.net>
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2020 8:17 AM
To: Battle Born Batteries <info@battlebornbatteries.com>
Subject: RE: New submission from Contact Us - battlebornbatteries.com

Jodi,
Thank you for the quick response and suggestion.
My alternator is 175 amps.

Would either of these other alternatives work:
https://amsolar.com/rv-battery-accessories/98-altcli230
and
https://www.etrailer.com/Battery-Cha...BCDC1250D.html
and
http://precisioncircuitsinc.com/wp-c...i-BIM-Rev1.pdf
This is listed on your site with a kit.


From: Battle Born Batteries [mailto:info@battlebornbatteries.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 21, 2020 2:11 PM
To: sp2.nason@earthlink.net
Subject: RE: New submission from Contact Us - battlebornbatteries.com

Hello Noah,

Thank you for your email.

What is the amperage output of your alternator?

With 2 Battle Born batteries you don’t want to charge with more than 100 amps, if your alternator is pushing more than 100 amps s back to the batteries, we would recommend a battery to battery charger that limits the amperage when charging.

We usually recommend the Sterling battery to battery chargers like the one in the link below.

https://battlebornbatteries.com/shop...-dc-converter/

Jodi

From: Noah Nason III <info@battlebornbatteries.com>
Sent: Monday, April 20, 2020 1:46 PM
To: Battle Born Batteries <info@battlebornbatteries.com>
Subject: New submission from Contact Us - battlebornbatteries.com

First Name
Noah
Last Name
Nason III

Message
I bought two 100AH Battleborn batteries to install in my Class A 2019 Winnebago Vista 29VE. This vehicle charges the house and truck batteries when the engine is operating.

During last week's Webinar by Lichtsinn.com the service manager stated that Lithium batteries, that are swapped in for wet batteries, will need a different solenoid to prevent improper charging.
With the Battleborn BMS prevent issues with RV vehicle charging systems?

[757driver]

Are you sure that if you put those two lithium batteries in that they would charge at more than 100AH? I have a 170 amp alternator with the Precision Circuits lithium BIM (listed in your post) and when the engine is running I get a net gain of a maximum additional 50 amps of charge from the alternator for a 15 minute period followed by a 20 minute rest. The time values are a function of the lithium BIM.

[vsheetz]

Suggest to check the actual current draw on the alternator with batteries at low SoC before deciding what to do.

I have 600ah lithium. Pulls about 40-45a from alternator at low SoC. So I have not installed a BIM, DC2DC charger, or other.

[AVJim]

Hi Noah,
Have you made any recent progress? I also have a 2019 Vista 29VE and am about to do the same thing, drop in two Battle Born batteries. I just started realizing that I need to do something about the alternator and started looking into that. Will the LiFePO4 Battery Isolation Manager work to solve this issue? I have 400 watts of solar so I have plenty of power during the day but often don't make it through the night with the stock group 24 batteries.
Thanks,

[nnason]

All,
Thanks for your information.

AVJim,
Nothing after your post. I have written Batteborn to see if they have a recommended shop in my area to do the installation.
I am pretty handy and will install my AGS, but AGS involves low power wires. If I mess up no fires or worse. I have located where the solenoid is but I just don't want to go messing with high amp wiring without some else having done it first and provided helpful hints/instructions. I'll update this once I find a shop and have work done as to cost parts etc.
Live Long and Prosper,
Noah

[lockinload]

Just curious as to what you gain from those lithium's, other than expense? My 4 6 volts produce more power than I could possible need, TV, receiver etc

[nnason]

Two CPAP machines with humidifiers at remote NW Maine.

Also My RV is new, Lead Acid batteries are failing, and the higher pries for 10 years of use makes this a good choice for me.

[AVJim]

Originally Posted by nnason

All,
Thanks for your information.

AVJim,
Nothing after your post. I have written Batteborn to see if they have a recommended shop in my area to do the installation.
I am pretty handy and will install my AGS, but AGS involves low power wires. If I mess up no fires or worse. I have located where the solenoid is but I just don't want to go messing with high amp wiring without some else having done it first and provided helpful hints/instructions. I'll update this once I find a shop and have work done as to cost parts etc.
Live Long and Prosper,
Noah

I also found the solenoid location but could not figure out where the alternator ties in. I identified all of the large cables that come into the box where the solenoid lives, the cables from each battery and the cable from the generator, but the cable from the alternator is already joined with the chassis battery before it hits this box and before it connects to the solenoid. I am hopefully receiving My Battle Born Batteries this week and installing them over the weekend. I am going to disconnect the control for the solenoid until I can figure ont what to replace it with. I have solar so in the meantime, my new batteries will only be charging off of that or from shore power and not from the alternator.
I am looking at using either the Orion-Tr Smart DC-DC charger or the Charge Mate Pro 40 and dropping that in place of the solenoid, I think that is where it would go. The Orion has Bluetooth so that is handy for monitoring.
What are you planning on doing to monitor the SoC of the new batteries? I purchased and just finished installing the Victron BMV-712 which should work well. I installed it next to the monitor panel on the one-stop. If you decide to go that way let me know and I can send some pics and give you some pointers on the cable path to the batteries.
Next task as soon as the batteries come in is attempting to squeezing the two Battle Born batteries into the area under the step. I think it will fit but it will be tight.

[twinboat]

The alternator always connects to the chassis battery in isolation solenoid applications.

The isolation system is nothing more the a automatic jumper cable between the chassis and house batteries with some logic control.

Driving, the alternator always charges the chassis battery. If near full charged, it parallels the house battery to the chassis battery.

Most modern systems also do the same when on shore/ generator power.
The house battery is charged by what ever charges it, converter/charger or inverter/charger. When at 80% charged, it parallels the chassis battery.

[jharrell]

I have a Vista 31be with two house batteries under the steps. I have thought about going lithium quite a bit but have been holding off due to issues brought up here.

I went with Lifeline 6V AGM's for 220AH instead I don't have to worry about it and they have been a great upgrade to the cheap dual purpose 12v that came with the coach. When they are dead I will reevaluate.

Issues are:

1. Heat and cold, the battery compartment under the steps is open to the environment and get 100+ degrees while driving and can get really cold in the winter. Lithiums do not tolerate temperature extreme well and they are usually installed in air conditioned space for maximum lifespan. My AGM can tolerate -67F to 122F, they are mil spec.

2. Alternator charging. I installed a Magnum 3000 inverter/charger that can easily be programmed for lithium charging but when running the engine the combiner solenoid directly attaches house to alternator through some distance of cable. I have personally never seen over 100amps going into my batteries from the alternator, more like 80 amps and I suspect its due to the wire gauge and distance, but it ends up a solid 14.1 volts constant while driving.

If I did lithium I would probably go for a Sterling batt to batt charger to limit current and get correct voltages, right now I use a BlueSea ACR that replaced the cheap failed solenoid that same with the coach.

If I did lithium I would like at least 300AH which will not be possible under the steps, so would need to put them somewhere else in the coach preferable in the conditioned space.