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Old 12-08-2020, 10:05 AM   #1
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New lithium batteries charging lead acid chassis battery

Any one experiencing this problem? If so, what was your resolution?

My Victron 700 BMS is showing a 1 - 2 amp draw with nothing turned on. When I shut off the main at the BCC, the draw goes to about 1 amp. Over night, after about 12 hours my batteries discharged approximately 10 to 15 amp hours.

My service center tells me finding the reason can be a time consuming and expensive.

Lion Energy tells me that an ignition controller relay is the best option. A Redarc dcbc charger is another.

I don't know what an ignition controller is or where I would install one. Anyone heard of this solution? If so please let me know where you put it.

I've thought about a dc - dc charger but I'm not convinced I need one and I wonder how that would slow or stop the drain.
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Old 12-08-2020, 10:21 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garyb1st View Post
Any one experiencing this problem? If so, what was your resolution?

My Victron 700 BMS is showing a 1 - 2 amp draw with nothing turned on. When I shut off the main at the BCC, the draw goes to about 1 amp. Over night, after about 12 hours my batteries discharged approximately 10 to 15 amp hours.

My service center tells me finding the reason can be a time consuming and expensive.

Lion Energy tells me that an ignition controller relay is the best option. A Redarc dcbc charger is another.

I don't know what an ignition controller is or where I would install one. Anyone heard of this solution? If so please let me know where you put it.

I've thought about a dc - dc charger but I'm not convinced I need one and I wonder how that would slow or stop the drain.
Because the voltage is higher on the lithiums, they will act like a charger and try to bring your lead acids up to the same level.
A ignition controller relay will disconnect both batteries when engine off. Many have reported problems when trying to charge lithiums off alternator because lithiums will take a very big charge which could overheat your alternator.
I went with a Victron dc-dc charger, it limits the current going to your house batteries, and supplies the proper voltage to charge them to 100% state of charge. The one I bought has an automatic disconnect that shuts it off if alternator goes below 13.1 volts.
With your present setup, you have a possibility of overheating your alternator and you will probably not see over 85% SOC.
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Old 12-08-2020, 11:10 AM   #3
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Because the voltage is higher on the lithiums, they will act like a charger and try to bring your lead acids up to the same level.
Agree. This is what I've found after searching the many threads on lithium house batteries.

Quote:
I went with a Victron dc-dc charger, it limits the current going to your house batteries, and supplies the proper voltage to charge them to 100% state of charge. The one I bought has an automatic disconnect that shuts it off if alternator goes below 13.1 volts.
I've seen the Will Prowse videos on the Renogy units. The one I like best is the 60 amp unit. It has a few features the others do not. Also the easiest straight forward install. Only question mark for my setup is the amps. Is 60 amps too many for my 145 amp alternator?

Other than that I'm not sure where I could put it. I only have minimal room in the entry step battery bay.
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Old 12-08-2020, 11:27 AM   #4
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Renogy DCC50S 12V 50A DC Board Battery Charger with MPPT

2005 Alpine Coach 36' FDDS

I just finished installing a Renogy DCC50S 12V 50A DC Board Battery Charger with MPPT -- Renogy DC/DC Charger can be found here (sponsored link. Use coupon code "WillProwse" for 10% off): https://shrsl.com/2faku
This thing is wonderful. It totally solves the issue you have. The LithIon battery will not try to charge to starter battery.
Watch it on YouTube -- Search "Renogy dc to dc charger with mppt"
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Old 12-08-2020, 12:16 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by garyb1st View Post
Agree. This is what I've found after searching the many threads on lithium house batteries.



I've seen the Will Prowse videos on the Renogy units. The one I like best is the 60 amp unit. It has a few features the others do not. Also the easiest straight forward install. Only question mark for my setup is the amps. Is 60 amps too many for my 145 amp alternator?

Other than that I'm not sure where I could put it. I only have minimal room in the entry step battery bay.
As long as it can put out a constant 14+ volts to charge your lithiums should work. Don't think 60 amps out of a 145 amp alternator is too much unless you idle a lot. With the Victron you need one lead from the start battery + and one lead from the house battery + and a common ground. It is bluetooth so running extra wires to a meter is not necessary, all settings and reading are on your phone. You can place the dc-dc charger anywhere, the cables just need to be able to handle 60 amps. On my sprinter, could not put one in the battery compartment [also under the steps] so just ran some more wire and mounted under the passenger seat.
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Old 12-08-2020, 07:57 PM   #6
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Not positive but pretty sure it's putting out at least 14v. At least that's what the indicator on the dash says. Also the volt meter in the cabinet where the other gauges are located.

I really haven't looked at bc - bc chargers other than the Renogy and Redarc, which was recommended by Lion Energy. If you don't mind saying, why did you decide to go with Victron?
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Old 12-08-2020, 10:10 PM   #7
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Not positive but pretty sure it's putting out at least 14v. At least that's what the indicator on the dash says. Also the volt meter in the cabinet where the other gauges are located.

I really haven't looked at bc - bc chargers other than the Renogy and Redarc, which was recommended by Lion Energy. If you don't mind saying, why did you decide to go with Victron?
Victron is fast becoming the most popular brand for RV's, a Dutch company has been popular in the boating world for years. They supply solar controllers, inverters, battery monitors, batteries, and all the gear necessary for a complete interconnected system and almost all their gear is bluetooth on your phone or tablet so less wiring.
Your alternator will put out 14 volts until your start battery is charged then drop down to 13.2 or so, not enough to fully charge a lithium, plus the big load on the alternator, this is the reason for a dc-dc charger. If you go to the AM solar site, probably the biggest installer of solar electrical systems, you will find they recommend Victron. Plus their equipment is priced a little bit lower than other equipment with the same features and has a great warranty.
I bought all my gear off Bay Marine Supply in CA. You can call them and ask any questions, very helpful, with good prices.
https://baymarinesupply.com/
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Old 12-09-2020, 10:37 AM   #8
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Victron is fast becoming the most popular brand for RV's, a Dutch company has been popular in the boating world for years. They supply solar controllers, inverters, battery monitors, batteries, and all the gear necessary for a complete interconnected system and almost all their gear is bluetooth on your phone or tablet so less wiring.
Your alternator will put out 14 volts until your start battery is charged then drop down to 13.2 or so, not enough to fully charge a lithium, plus the big load on the alternator, this is the reason for a dc-dc charger. If you go to the AM solar site, probably the biggest installer of solar electrical systems, you will find they recommend Victron. Plus their equipment is priced a little bit lower than other equipment with the same features and has a great warranty.
I bought all my gear off Bay Marine Supply in CA. You can call them and ask any questions, very helpful, with good prices.
https://baymarinesupply.com/
Thank you. Always great to have a source closer to home.
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Old 12-09-2020, 11:23 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjshively View Post
2005 Alpine Coach 36' FDDS

I just finished installing a Renogy DCC50S 12V 50A DC Board Battery Charger with MPPT -- Renogy DC/DC Charger can be found here (sponsored link. Use coupon code "WillProwse" for 10% off): https://shrsl.com/2faku
This thing is wonderful. It totally solves the issue you have. The LithIon battery will not try to charge to starter battery.
Watch it on YouTube -- Search "Renogy dc to dc charger with mppt"
I just watched the video. Very helpful regarding the install. My main issue with these isolators had been the ignition wire. Unless I am misunderstanding, those are only necessary for vehicles with a smart alternator. Makes my install easier.
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