Community Forums

ie2special · 02-27-2014, 12:27 PM

I thought I had all This straight and then WHAM. Fleetwood Bounder classics have the option for a Diesel engine up front with air ride on a freight liner chassis!

Where do these things fit in the Pecking order?

**CLIFFTALL** · 02-27-2014, 12:31 PM

They peck up nicely $ 4 $. It depends what $ MH your stacking it up to.

ie2special · 02-27-2014, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clifftall

They peck up nicely $ 4 $. It depends what $ MH your stacking it up to.

Between A Gasser and A DP...what are the benefits of spending the money on that engine when it tows the same as far as I can see. Torque is higher so better on uphills but what else?

t55watson · 02-27-2014, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ie2special

Between A Gasser and A DP...what are the benefits of spending the money on that engine when it tows the same as far as I can see. Torque is higher so better on uphills but what else?

The difference is WAY more than engine. Bigger and better in DP. Frame,brakes axles. springs, cooling.
In reality they are totaly different from the floor of the coach down.

Statgeek · 02-27-2014, 12:51 PM

The Front Engine Diesels are commonly called "FREDs." Some people love them, but for me, it takes away one huge advantage of the pusher... having that loud engine 30' or more behind you. I didn't like the noise of our Gas engine, and while a diesel hums at a lower RPM, I suspect it's still pretty loud up front. That said, it may be the case that if you want massive towing capabilities, maybe the FREDs offer more than DPs? I only think that because I've walked through a few "Super-C's" that were FREDs and they were super-equipped for towing.

VestaDave · 02-27-2014, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ie2special

Between A Gasser and A DP...what are the benefits of spending the money on that engine when it tows the same as far as I can see. Torque is higher so better on uphills but what else?

Make no mistake, any engine in a MH is under extreme use pulling or pushing. None are light weight. Put a 4000 lb toad behind her and that's more weight. For limited use gas jobs are fine, there are a lot of them out there.
For overall comfort however, the diesel better. Air ride, pulling power, longevity in extreme use, mpg, and air brakes. This said buy the one you want. Its your money. Btw, diesels are more costly to maintain.

ie2special · 02-27-2014, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t55watson

The difference is WAY more than engine. Bigger and better in DP. Frame,brakes axles. springs, cooling.
In reality they are totaly different from the floor of the coach down.

I know that. I am trying to figure out if a FRED (diesel in front) has benefits over Gas engines..for example the air ride/suspension.

ie2special · 02-27-2014, 01:00 PM

......Btw, diesels are more costly to maintain.......

Because of the engine itself, location, or a little of both?

t55watson · 02-27-2014, 01:03 PM

I see on another thread ( Where to buy from?) you have made up your mind. Buying Integra just wondering about dealers. I can't help you ther, I only buy used from owners.

ie2special · 02-27-2014, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t55watson

I see on another thread ( Where to buy from?) you have made up your mind. Buying Integra just wondering about dealers. I can't help you ther, I only buy used from owners.

We decided that we love Entegra, but I just don't love any of the floorplans for where we are at in our lives. I love American Coach, and love the Closet bunk conversions but my husband is visual and needs to see things in person...they are few and far between.

We are leaning towards getting a unit under 100K and not full timing since we aren't in love with anything 100%

t55watson · 02-27-2014, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ie2special

We decided that we love Entegra, but I just don't love any of the floorplans for where we are at in our lives. I love American Coach, and love the Closet bunk conversions but my husband is visual and needs to see things in person...they are few and far between.

We are leaning towards getting a unit under 100K and not full timing since we aren't in love with anything 100%

You are on the right track asking questions here. The info you get is really worth what you pay for it. Nothing.

Don't take that seriously.
You have lot of time until 2015 and visit as many units as you can. Private party sales are good because you have no heavy handed, I want my commission, salesmen to deal with.
Good hunting.

**TonyDi** · 02-27-2014, 01:34 PM

Biggest disadvantage of a FREDs is with the engine in the front you will get a lot of noise from the engine. Being big in size diesels generate more heat and you will have to contend with that under your feet. The market for FREDs is smaller then a DP which will make the eventual sale more difficult. The door on a FRED will usually be mid-coach.

edgray · 02-27-2014, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ie2special

I know that. I am trying to figure out if a FRED (diesel in front) has benefits over Gas engines..for example the air ride/suspension.

You should not assume that ALL of the FRED chassis include air ride suspensions. The most common FREDs are by FCCC, and Tiffin used a bunch of them under their pre-2010 Allegro and Allegro Bay coaches. Newmar built some of their Grand Star models on them as well. Those were all steel sprung suspensions-just like their gasser competitors from Ford and Workhorse. OBTW, Workhorse also made a "fred" out of it's W series gasser chassis by adding a Maxxforce diesel in place of the 8.1L gas motor. The first of these was the W16D under the Damon Avanti, and later the W20D was used under the TMC Serrano coaches-none of these rode on air, either- except for what was in the tires.

IMO, FREDs with air ride / brakes are fairly rare, with apologies to all the Monaco Vesta and HR Trip owners out there.
Ed

VestaDave · 02-27-2014, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edgray

You should not assume that ALL of the FRED chassis include air ride suspensions. The most common FREDs are by FCCC, and Tiffin used a bunch of them under their pre-2010 Allegro and Allegro Bay coaches. Newmar built some of their Grand Star models on them as well. Those were all steel sprung suspensions-just like their gasser competitors from Ford and Workhorse. OBTW, Workhorse also made a "fred" out of it's W series gasser chassis by adding a Maxxforce diesel in place of the 8.1L gas motor. The first of these was the W16D under the Damon Avanti, and later the W20D was used under the TMC Serrano coaches-none of these rode on air, either- except for what was in the tires.

IMO, FREDs with air ride / brakes are fairly rare, with apologies to all the Monaco Vesta and HR Trip owners out there.
Ed

Apologies accepted. With regard to an earlier post, most Vesta/Trip owners do not find the engine noise or floor heat excessive. In fact I find it to be pleasant. The heat I find, and yes there is heat, comes mostly from the large A class windshield. I think this issue is common to all class A MHs. My old C Class was way better in this regard with its overhead that acted as a big visor.