System Air Prefill

[twinboat]

Most small 120 volt compressors, including quiet ones, can output about 2 cubic feet of air a minute.

A engine mounted one can produce 15 cubic feet of air a minute.

Your RV has about 20 cubic feet of air tank capacity, plus what ever the air bags hold.

So do you sit there for 10 to 15 minutes running a portable compressor or do you sit warming up the engine for 2 to 3 minutes ?

[jcussen]

Originally Posted by 96 Wideglide

Unfortunately, your compressor is going to unload before you leave whether it be 5AM or 10AM!
Best I seen was a guy idle'ing his coach for about an hour before he was ready to move !

I was at a campground in Oregon a couple of years ago in a tiered campsite with one guy 3 ft above me.. Guy above me lit off his engine at 7 am. Normally go back to sleep, but his filter/dryer discharged every 3 or 4 minutes, something wrong there.
Guess he drove off in his towd for breakfast, so finally had some peace at 8.30, when he finally returned and left. I normally build up pressure with my 12 volt compressor, leave, then idle to a spot where I can warm up my engine and not annoy others.

[bandit2014]

Good Morning All

Thank You all for your input. I appreciate your thoughts on this. Thank you JCUSSEN for the info on your system.
The wife and I were in the KOA in West Yellowstone a couple of years ago and we started up the coach at about 8 in the morning and I swear I had barley picked my coffee cup back up before we had a knock at the door from a neighbor asking us to shut down our rig. I explained that we were getting ready to pull out and had to let the engine warm up a bit and get air pressure. I though it was obvious we were leaving as we had all the slides in and were disconnected from shore power.
I generally will start up and get air pressure to get back up on bags and then will pull down to the dinghy hook up area and then let the engine warm up while I'm connecting our jeep to the coach, doing the light check, my walk around the whole rig for a look before we hit the road.
Again, my thought behind this was just trying to be a good neighbor.

Sam

[FormerBoater]

Originally Posted by bandit2014

Good Morning All

Thank You all for your input. I appreciate your thoughts on this. Thank you JCUSSEN for the info on your system.
The wife and I were in the KOA in West Yellowstone a couple of years ago and we started up the coach at about 8 in the morning and I swear I had barley picked my coffee cup back up before we had a knock at the door from a neighbor asking us to shut down our rig. I explained that we were getting ready to pull out and had to let the engine warm up a bit and get air pressure. I though it was obvious we were leaving as we had all the slides in and were disconnected from shore power.
I generally will start up and get air pressure to get back up on bags and then will pull down to the dinghy hook up area and then let the engine warm up while I'm connecting our jeep to the coach, doing the light check, my walk around the whole rig for a look before we hit the road.
Again, my thought behind this was just trying to be a good neighbor.

Sam

People who do not like the sound of a diesel engine should pick another activity for their recreational pursuits.

[nehog]

Originally Posted by 96 Wideglide

Unfortunately, your compressor is going to unload before you leave whether it be 5AM or 10AM!
Best I seen was a guy idle'ing his coach for about an hour before he was ready to move !

Sheesh! A 4-5 minute idle is more than sufficient, and in fact more than that is actually detrimental to the engine, IMHO.

But I too have seen rigs do just that: idle 30+ minutes before departing.

[twojayhawks]

Originally Posted by bandit2014

Good Morning All

I have always wondered if it was possible to put an electric air compressor on a diesel coach to pre-fill the air tanks before getting ready to pull out.
My thought is that this would allow the system to get fully pressurized without having to start the engine and let it fill the system the normal way. I'm sure this would make your neighbors happy by not having to smell the fumes. Of course you would still start the engine up and let it warm up some before just pulling out, but just not as long.

There would be a check valve between the compressor and tanks so to prevent the normal system air from escaping.

Has anyone done anything like this?

Thanks,
Sam

I love the idea of a prefill without starting diesel. I'm OCD about disturbing others. Too often we are those people that arrive late & leave early. What's worse is Newmar is emphatic about airing up suspension before retracting slides. In the a.m. I have to crank up ISL, air up, and mine takes every bit 3-5 min to air up, THEN shut off & break camp. Then another start when finally ready to pull out. If a coach builder had a OE option for a "prefill" without starting I would have it.

[Holmstead]

Originally Posted by twojayhawks

I love the idea of a prefill without starting diesel. I'm OCD about disturbing others. Too often we are those people that arrive late & leave early. What's worse is Newmar is emphatic about airing up suspension before retracting slides. In the a.m. I have to crank up ISL, air up, and mine takes every bit 3-5 min to air up, THEN shut off & break camp. Then another start when finally ready to pull out. If a coach builder had a OE option for a "prefill" without starting I would have it.

Why not air up the afternoon before leaving. Everything else gets done without starting motor. I’ve yet to see any of our fellow RVers push their rigs out of a campground. Another thing, there are many gas vehicles louder than a DP.

[Ray,IN]

Originally Posted by bandit2014

Good Morning All

Thank You all for your input. I appreciate your thoughts on this. Thank you JCUSSEN for the info on your system.
The wife and I were in the KOA in West Yellowstone a couple of years ago and we started up the coach at about 8 in the morning and I swear I had barley picked my coffee cup back up before we had a knock at the door from a neighbor asking us to shut down our rig. I explained that we were getting ready to pull out and had to let the engine warm up a bit and get air pressure. I though it was obvious we were leaving as we had all the slides in and were disconnected from shore power.
I generally will start up and get air pressure to get back up on bags and then will pull down to the dinghy hook up area and then let the engine warm up while I'm connecting our jeep to the coach, doing the light check, my walk around the whole rig for a look before we hit the road.
Again, my thought behind this was just trying to be a good neighbor.

Sam

Cummins says no warm-up in necessary. The engine will be warmed enough by the time you get on the interstate for high speed driving. Just like their engines will be cooled down enough by the time you reach the campground.

[FIRE UP]

To the OP,
Either pre-filling an air system or, KEEPING it filled is a noble idea. Heck, I even do it AT HOME! I keep my home air compressor plugged into the coach while in storage in the RV garage. This way, I don't have to run it as long as it would normally take to build air, so I could move it out for various reasons. After several years on the FD, in the older fire trucks, they'd ALL LOOSE air after a while. Some, would loose most of their air even in a short period of time. WE had many, many *Delayed* responses due to *Low air*.

So, when the newer fire trucks came out with an auxiliary air system as an option, WE TOOK IT! The system that is used on those is called the Kussmaull system. That Kussmaul system DESTROYS any V-air or any other 12V system on the market. And, contrary to most that are clueless, they're not noisy at all. The only time you could hear it is if it was running, while you walked by the compartment that it was installed in. Otherwise, if you were more than just a few feet away, you simply could not hear it.

Once we equipped all the newer trucks with that system, we all but eliminated *delayed* responses. The point is, yes, you can equip your coach with a system that will keep the air system topped off with very little noise associated with it. The Kussmaul system is not cheap, to say the least but, you get what you pay for.

https://kussmaul.com/air-compressor-accessories

Now, as for the hard headed diesel operators that think they need to idle for hours on end without concern for people all around them, well, you're not gonna change them. First of all, they have to learn to have common sense and common courtesy. Diesels, especially all the newer ones in all the coaches around the country, are NOT CARBURETED GAS ENGINES! In other words, they won't fall on their faces if not warmed up before asking them to move a load.

I'm pretty sure that I haven't and most likely no one else on here as EVER read of a instance where a diesel coach owner damaged or blew up his engine 'cause he took off from camp too soon after start-up. The manufactures make those diesel engines a bit more stout then some give them credit. As an example, of course ALL of our fire trucks were diesel and, we didn't let them WARM UP before heading out on any emergency. Get in, turn the switch on and, fire it up, and STAND ON IT.

In over 30+ years, not one engine ever exploded due to a cold hard throttle take off. Yes, on many of them we did have block heaters. And those block heaters were constantly plugged in. But, a very, VERY large percentage of the time, those block heaters were BURNED OUT, due to CONSTANT ON! We'd repair them and, in some time later, burned out again.

As for filling your air system the afternoon before you leave, yeah sure! Leak's are leak's. If you're gonna loose air, filling your system hours before you take off, ain't gonna help. It all depends on the rate at which one looses air. Some keep an almost full set of air tanks for quite a while. They're the lucky ones and by far, are not the majority. Air systems loose air, period. You can chase the leak's and, maybe even repair them but, eventually, you'll develop more leak's.

Again, it's a noble idea to try and either pre-fill your air system or, even keep it topped off with an *on board* either 12VDC or, 120VAC compressor. Yep, some of either versions will wake up the dead, IN THE NEXT ZIP CODE! So, keep your train of thought about being kind to your fellow campers and take a look around at various compressors, even the so-called super quiet ones at Harbor Freight. It would be very simple to tie it into the system.
Scott

[n2zon]

Originally Posted by Ray,IN

Cummins says no warm-up in necessary. The engine will be warmed enough by the time you get on the interstate for high speed driving. Just like their engines will be cooled down enough by the time you reach the campground.

That might vary by year. The 2015 ISL owner's manual says:


------------------------------------------

Normal Starting Procedure



Starting



Disengage the driven unit, or if equipped, put the transmission in neutral. With the accelerator pedal or lever in the idle position, turn
the keyswitch to the ON position.



Idle the engine 3 to 5 minutes before operating with a load.
------------------------------------------

[BigLar368]

Originally Posted by bandit2014

Good Morning All

Thank You all for your input. I appreciate your thoughts on this. Thank you JCUSSEN for the info on your system.
The wife and I were in the KOA in West Yellowstone a couple of years ago and we started up the coach at about 8 in the morning and I swear I had barley picked my coffee cup back up before we had a knock at the door from a neighbor asking us to shut down our rig. I explained that we were getting ready to pull out and had to let the engine warm up a bit and get air pressure. I though it was obvious we were leaving as we had all the slides in and were disconnected from shore power.
I generally will start up and get air pressure to get back up on bags and then will pull down to the dinghy hook up area and then let the engine warm up while I'm connecting our jeep to the coach, doing the light check, my walk around the whole rig for a look before we hit the road.
Again, my thought behind this was just trying to be a good neighbor.

Sam

Some people will never get it. If it was at 8 AM I believe that is more than reasonable. If that happened to me I would not have even answered the door. Your a better man than I am.

[OldWEB]

Originally Posted by BigLar368

Some people will never get it. If it was at 8 AM I believe that is more than reasonable. If that happened to me I would not have even answered the door. Your a better man than I am.

Why not answer the door? Maybe the neighbour was there to remind you that your antenna was still up, return the $20 they borrowed, noticed you have low air in a tire...

[BigLar368]

Originally Posted by OldWEB

Why not answer the door? Maybe the neighbour was there to remind you that your antenna was still up, return the $20 they borrowed, noticed you have low air in a tire...

You're right. After I found out why he was there then I would make my decision and if his complaint was my engine was running and it was 8 AM then I would just shut the door and go about my business.