Freightliner V- Drive Failure

[Jonnyboy 316]

This past September while traveling to the Tiffin factory service center with our 2023 Phaeton 40 IH, we lost two major bolts holding the entire rear assembly , holding our very large four rear tires and axle. Little did we know was that one of two very large bolts(6 inches long and over 1 inch thick, grade 8) had come out a half hour or so before we became totally disabled when the second large bolt fell out of our chassis V-Drive. Our rear wheels became very unstable and our mh was undriveable. We were fortunate that we were on a secondary road and traveling at about 20 mph. Needless to say, Tiffin repaired what they could so we could have Freightliner make the warranty repairs in Tupelo, Ms.. A new drive shaft, universal joints, and 6 or seven other parts were changed out by Freightliner, who were responsive to our new Phaeton's chassis failure. Apparently these major bolts were never adequately torqued when factory built by Freightliner.
If this had happened at highway speeds, our fate would have certainly been much worse, perhaps fatal. The chassis had less than four thousand miles on it at the time.

Has anyone had a similar experience with the entire V- Drvive, rear axle and tires come completely disattached? Please respond. We can't believe we're the only one!

[zrock2010]

i do not remember seeing any recall or TSB about this.. Not trying to put the blame on you but something like this could have been picked up on doing a pretrip before leaving for the day, loose bolts like that would have been noticeable. Glad you and the family did not get hurt could have been much worse

[ViperJD]

Thanks for posting, totally disagree with zrock.

There are some things that we just don't check on our before start checklist. You have the right to expect that it was put together correctly. Yes, it would be nice to check everything, but then we would never leave the driveway.

That said, my trailer hitch fell off my 2003 Dutch Star...at 45 MPH with my F-350 in tow. 3 of the 4 bolts that retained the hitch (original) were missing nuts. Yes, I could have caught that if I went under the back end...but so should the LaMesa RV inspector. We paid them $1500 for an inspection after we purchased the unit and it was conducted 2 weeks prior to our mishap.

Great post, consider making it an official safety post (NTSB cares), and thank you for sharing. All the best,

[SAS30]

Originally Posted by Jonnyboy 316

This past September while traveling to the Tiffin factory service center with our 2023 Phaeton 40 IH, we lost two major bolts holding the entire rear assembly , holding our very large four rear tires and axle. Little did we know was that one of two very large bolts(6 inches long and over 1 inch thick, grade 8) had come out a half hour or so before we became totally disabled when the second large bolt fell out of our chassis V-Drive. Our rear wheels became very unstable and our mh was undriveable. We were fortunate that we were on a secondary road and traveling at about 20 mph. Needless to say, Tiffin repaired what they could so we could have Freightliner make the warranty repairs in Tupelo, Ms.. A new drive shaft, universal joints, and 6 or seven other parts were changed out by Freightliner, who were responsive to our new Phaeton's chassis failure. Apparently these major bolts were never adequately torqued when factory built by Freightliner.
If this had happened at highway speeds, our fate would have certainly been much worse, perhaps fatal. The chassis had less than four thousand miles on it at the time.

Has anyone had a similar experience with the entire V- Drvive, rear axle and tires come completely disattached? Please respond. We can't believe we're the only one!

While at the Newmar International rally last summer, there was an owner that had the same issue. I believe he had a Ventana model. But other that, I can’t remember much about the issue.

[zrock2010]

Originally Posted by ViperJD

Thanks for posting, totally disagree with zrock.

There are some things that we just don't check on our before start checklist. You have the right to expect that it was put together correctly. Yes, it would be nice to check everything, but then we would never leave the driveway.

That said, my trailer hitch fell off my 2003 Dutch Star...at 45 MPH with my F-350 in tow. 3 of the 4 bolts that retained the hitch (original) were missing nuts. Yes, I could have caught that if I went under the back end...but so should the LaMesa RV inspector. We paid them $1500 for an inspection after we purchased the unit and it was conducted 2 weeks prior to our mishap.

Great post, consider making it an official safety post (NTSB cares), and thank you for sharing. All the best,

not sure why doing a proper pre trip is not doable? Everyone i know with a motorhome or TT does it including myself.. Does not take long to get down on your knees and look for signs of loose bolts or suspension. Takes me 10 min to do my trailer and that is putting hands on everything.. Sorry but their is no excuse for not doing it as this is putting your life and others in jeopardy.

[ViperJD]

zrock, you missed the OPs point, asking if others had this issue. Instead you insinuated that his pre-start checklist was to blame. Do you check the ft-lbs of every lug nut on each tire on your rig every time? What about the corner welds on the frame near the cap? What about the straps that hold your fresh, black, gray tanks in place? All can effect safety, but we can't check everything all the time. Torques on suspension equipment, drivetrain connections and such are an annual inspection for most of us...not a requirement for a "proper pre-trip"

[twinboat]

Originally Posted by zrock2010

not sure why doing a proper pre trip is not doable? Everyone i know with a motorhome or TT does it including myself.. Does not take long to get down on your knees and look for signs of loose bolts or suspension. Takes me 10 min to do my trailer and that is putting hands on everything.. Sorry but their is no excuse for not doing it as this is putting your life and others in jeopardy.

A trailer ! Looking at a trailers suspension is world's apart from " looking over " the suspension of a air ride diesel motorhome suspension.
For 1 thing, they practically sit on the ground, so looking under it isn't a simple task. If you start it and raise the suspension, your not supposed to be under it without safety stands, looking around. It's no longer a cursory inspection and you would expect major components to not fall out.

[Jonnyboy 316]

You do not seem to know much, if anything, about V-Drive chassis structures. Those 2 bolts are permanent bolts, like huck bolts, far up forward of the entire rear axel assembly. They are torqued at the factory (been to the Gafney Plant tour) at over 300 lbs. They are not anywhere close to visible even on a creeper while under the motorhome home. Freightliner said Those bolts are never to come out. Tiffin mechanics were incredulous that it had happened. The motorhome was almost brand new. One would not expect, perhaps, the whole IFS system to become apart with less than 4k miles??? The huge bolts are forward of the rear axle, but higher, positioned just under the floor and inaccessible from anywhere except under the motorhome, probably 36 inches or more from the ground. You should study a V-drive assembly before making comments you seem to know so little about. It is NOT a pre- trip inspection item.

[Jonnyboy 316]

Thank you, SAS 30. I believe it was a factory oversight and I was surprised by Freightliner 's lack of concern for others that might suffer the same plight. I asked about their responsibility for NTSB reporting. They said they don't do that. Wow, I thought. But thank you for your response and the reporting issue.

JD Viper as well. Thank you.
I do check my Blue Ox hitch for weld failures, etc.on every trip. I have done those things for my 20 years of owning our diesel pushers. Thanks again. Stay SAFE!

[zrock2010]

Originally Posted by ViperJD

zrock, you missed the OPs point, asking if others had this issue. Instead you insinuated that his pre-start checklist was to blame. Do you check the ft-lbs of every lug nut on each tire on your rig every time? What about the corner welds on the frame near the cap? What about the straps that hold your fresh, black, gray tanks in place? All can effect safety, but we can't check everything all the time. Torques on suspension equipment, drivetrain connections and such are an annual inspection for most of us...not a requirement for a "proper pre-trip"

Actually yes i do as most of that is a quick visual inspection. when i have my kids in the car and others safety on the road the extra few min is worth it.

Originally Posted by twinboat

A trailer ! Looking at a trailers suspension is world's apart from " looking over " the suspension of a air ride diesel motorhome suspension.
For 1 thing, they practically sit on the ground, so looking under it isn't a simple task. If you start it and raise the suspension, your not supposed to be under it without safety stands, looking around. It's no longer a cursory inspection and you would expect major components to not fall out.

I do not remember saying climb under the unit to check the tightness of the suspension bolts. A visual check is what is needed as you will see the difference in paint or rust around the bolt is it is loose and moving around. Plus with this type of failure their would have been other signs in the suspension something was wrong.

Originally Posted by Jonnyboy 316

You do not seem to know much, if anything, about V-Drive chassis structures. Those 2 bolts are permanent bolts, like huck bolts, far up forward of the entire rear axel assembly. They are torqued at the factory (been to the Gafney Plant tour) at over 300 lbs. They are not anywhere close to visible even on a creeper while under the motorhome home. Freightliner said Those bolts are never to come out. Tiffin mechanics were incredulous that it had happened. The motorhome was almost brand new. One would not expect, perhaps, the whole IFS system to become apart with less than 4k miles??? The huge bolts are forward of the rear axle, but higher, positioned just under the floor and inaccessible from anywhere except under the motorhome, probably 36 inches or more from the ground. You should study a V-drive assembly before making comments you seem to know so little about. It is NOT a pre- trip inspection item.

Really because i work in the industry.. I have also pulled wrences on units with the same suspension and been able to inspect the components.. I see units on a daily basis where a pre trip is never done and things should have been caught. I worked in a campground for years and 1 out of 10 people would actually do a walk around or pretrip before leaving, I also remember several units make it around the corner before their wheel fell off or something that should have been caught. Taking chances with other people lives is unacceptable to me. Sorry if i offended you but i see stuff like this way to often especially working in the industry and honestly it scares the crap out of me. I have also worked for emergency services and seen the aftermath of something that could have been caught.. When you have to pull a child out of a veh because someones wheel came of their motorhome and killed...

[ViperJD]

zrock, you really don't get it. If it wasn't done right leaving the factory, it won't show rust or paint changes on bolts that didn't move. My eye can't see the difference between 30 and 70 ft-lbs, but you have been there done that. Ok, you are better than me. If you worked in the industry, then these oversites are partly your fault. You should have caught every mistake and saved the lives you are mentioning. The OPs point was asking if anybody else had these issues. You should have spoken up and said yes, it happens all the time...here is the evidence.

[jimpav]

Yep... Lost my V drive bolts somewhere on Rt 80 in Gary, Indiana. Trans West in Gary did a great job to repair that and other factory problems. Only problem is that there was no new drive shaft to be found anyplace. Gaffney had to build me a new one.
2023 Phaeton 40ih 5K miles

[SAS30]

[QUOTE=Jonnyboy 316;6951934]Thank you, SAS 30. I believe it was a factory oversight and I was surprised by Freightliner 's lack of concern for others that might suffer the same plight. I asked about their responsibility for NTSB reporting. They said they don't do that. Wow, I thought. But thank you for your response and the reporting issue.

Of course they are not going to report it to NTSB. They don’t want a black eye on their product. But they should be concerned about this. These are very large bolts that are falling out/off. Not as much danger to lose control of the rv as something that would come apart on the front axle. But can do some major damage.
This is also something that you can’t see during a pre trip. As it’s located high up in the frame rails. Unless you jack it up and get way under the coach you can’t see it. However, a very experienced driver would probably notice the driveline reaction from it.

[TFell]

This is an eye opening thread. I'll put it on a list to check mine when it comes out of storage, if I can get it up high enough to see them. Definitely not normal pre-trip stuff.

These should be reported to the NTSB. Interesting that the two posters in this thread have 2023s.