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Old 06-14-2021, 10:45 AM   #1
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2 Circuit Breakers trip every power is transferred

I'll preface this post by saying I'm as dumb as the day is long when talking about electricity (my wife says that applies whenever I talk...). Anyway, 2 CBs under the bed in my 2019 Reatta trip off every I transfer power from shore to coach or generator to shore. One is to the kitchen, the other to LR and bathroom. They both trip at the same time. I reset them and everything works fine until the next power transfer. Entegra sent me a schematic and nothing downstream of the breakers are in use when they trip. NIRVC in Lewisville, TX said they could not duplicate the problem (interesting because when I picked my coach up, the breakers were tripped). Any ideas on what could cause this? I've read other threads about loose wires, etc., but to me it seems odd that 2 independent circuits always trip at the same time and not when I am actually using one of the outlets on one of the circuits. They always trip when power is switched. It seems to me the problem would be upstream, not downstream. Any advice is appreciated. Attached is a pic of the underbed CBs.
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Old 06-14-2021, 10:56 AM   #2
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From your picture, both those breakers appear to be not just breakers, but GFI breakers.


Is the GFI part tripping.
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Old 06-14-2021, 12:12 PM   #3
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In our 2018 Cornerstone we have one breaker that does that from time to time - tripping when we connect to shore power. And like you, we can reset the breaker and all is well until then next time it decides to trip.

I suspect the solution is to replace the breaker, but in our case it doesn't happen often enough to motivate me to do the replacement. In your case, I would replace the two offending breakers (yourself or have an electrician do it for you) and see if that solves the problem. My guess is that it will, but if not you'll have a couple of spare breakers.
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Old 06-14-2021, 12:29 PM   #4
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The fact that the only GFCI/breakers are those that trip, suggest that at some point while the power is being transferred, the ground and neutral may briefly be getting connected. Try monitoring the ground - neutral voltage while having somebody do the transfer. That voltage is usually only a few volts, but if it suddenly drops to zero, then that is the problem.

Note that the sudden voltage drop will be only a very short duration. It will be easier to detect with an analog meter.

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Old 06-14-2021, 01:05 PM   #5
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No. Just the breakers.
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Old 06-14-2021, 02:40 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by fallmeadow View Post
No. Just the breakers.
I don't understand what you're saying.


The 2nrx and 3rd breakers from the top are combination circuit breaker and ground fault circuit interrupter.


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Old 06-14-2021, 03:23 PM   #7
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I'm betting you have a loose connection on the neutral buss in the panel. All the grounds and neutrals should be checked to see if they are tight. You can do this safely if you disconnect form all power including the batteries before opening the panels.
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Old 06-14-2021, 03:38 PM   #8
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What is happening (most likely) is that the RV power (generator or inverter) has a neutral to ground bond (as it should) and when transferring power there is a moment that the GFCI senses the change in the transfer switch in particular with the neutral connection being bonded (when on shore power the neutral to ground bond is not bonded in the RV but on inverter or generator it is). Some inverter companies have written tech notes on this happening (basically explaining it without any resolution). One thing you could try is to disconnect from the shore power completely and then turn on the inverter or generator and see if they still trip (don't have the inverter or generator on when disconnecting from shore power). If that works then you have a choice of disconnecting power first and then turning on the inverter or generator, or resetting the gfci breakers everytime this occurs. There isn't a lot you can do about this, although some gfci breakers are more sensitive to this happening, you could try another brand breaker that is compatible with your panel or even a different transfer switch, although even with doing that the problem certainly could continue. ~CA

BTW, I suspect this has always occurred and not a recent change?
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Old 06-14-2021, 05:08 PM   #9
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Mine did just that!
When connecting or disconnecting shore power...

It started where I'd have to reset all the clocks that plugged into anything on the inverter panel.

Then the 2 gfi breakers would pop and I'd reset them.

Then they would not reset, popped immediately.

Then one day I got a DC overload lite on the magnum panel.

I removed the inverter and took it apart, the MOSFET board had let the magic smoke out!

The good news is Magnum's warranty wins at 5 years, and they agreed to cross ship a warranty replacement inverter.

Sent from my moto z3 using iRV2 - RV Forum mobile app
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Old 06-14-2021, 05:36 PM   #10
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Iím just as dumb about anything electrical so this probably will not help, but we were always told to make sure we did the shore/generator or generator/shore transfer with as little load as possible. Weíve always turned off the A/C and the generator before plugging into shore power and reversed the process when going back to generator. The only time we do not follow that procedure is when we are using the gen auto set. We havenít had any issues with the transfer on the rare occasions when the shore power has gone out and the generator kicks in and never when using the auto set when boondocking for a night. Do you still throw the circuit breakers if you are using the gen auto start or is it only when you are going from shore to gen or back?
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Old 06-14-2021, 06:41 PM   #11
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A Ground Fault Interrupter Circuit breaker (GFCI) is designed to minimize the chances that there may be an accidental potential difference (voltage) between earth ground and the ground/neutral of your electrical system and appliances which could produce electrocution or shock to users of the appliances or some appliance plugged into a power circuit. This is particularly critical on kitchen and bathroom circuits, A GCFI senses any potential difference (Voltage) that exists between the two "grounds" and the GFCI "trips" to prevent shock or electrocution.

I believe that J Birder and others are exactly correct. You have a failed ground or neutral in your buss wiring. Now the problem is to find out where that failed ground/neutral is located.

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Old 06-15-2021, 05:31 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fallmeadow View Post
I'll preface this post by saying I'm as dumb as the day is long when talking about electricity (my wife says that applies whenever I talk...). Anyway, 2 CBs under the bed in my 2019 Reatta trip off every I transfer power from shore to coach or generator to shore. One is to the kitchen, the other to LR and bathroom. They both trip at the same time. I reset them and everything works fine until the next power transfer. Entegra sent me a schematic and nothing downstream of the breakers are in use when they trip. NIRVC in Lewisville, TX said they could not duplicate the problem (interesting because when I picked my coach up, the breakers were tripped). Any ideas on what could cause this? I've read other threads about loose wires, etc., but to me it seems odd that 2 independent circuits always trip at the same time and not when I am actually using one of the outlets on one of the circuits. They always trip when power is switched. It seems to me the problem would be upstream, not downstream. Any advice is appreciated. Attached is a pic of the underbed CBs.


From your description it sounds like you are switching between generator and shore while generator is running. Yes, the transfer switch is supposed to handle that but it does put more stress on the system. Have you tried turning off everything that is not on inverter, shutting down generator, then connect shore power? Then do in reverse going from shore to generator.
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Old 06-15-2021, 06:43 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Butte64 View Post
From your description it sounds like you are switching between generator and shore while generator is running. Yes, the transfer switch is supposed to handle that but it does put more stress on the system. Have you tried turning off everything that is not on inverter, shutting down generator, then connect shore power? Then do in reverse going from shore to generator.
X2 and as hdgoldie said. There is a lot of voltage when switching power if both gen and shore power are on at the same time. Very taxing on our small RV switching stations. Next would be to check the connections in the circuit panel.
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Old 06-15-2021, 11:14 AM   #14
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No expert on electricity either, but when we built our house, electrical contractor put some of those breakers with the GFCI on them for some circuits in the main breaker box.. One of these controlled our kitchen plugs above the counters we use for coffee makers etc, and we kept tripping the breaker in the box in the garage. These plugs in the kitchen also had the built in GFCI controls on them too. Electrician said there should not be 2 on one circuit. Removed and replaced the breakers from the main breaker box in the garage with non GFCI, problem solved. I would see if any of the other GFCI plugs in your rig don't work when the breaker box trips and see if a circuit has 2 on them. (If that makes sense)
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