Community Forums

Cherokee180C · 09-20-2016, 07:03 PM

Would you guys be afraid to buy an 8 to 10 year old Travel Supreme if it had great maintenance records and passed a third party certified inspection knowing what you know now on how the Entegra is holding up? Also what age would you consider the sweat spot on lowest upfront cost vs. maintenance not out of hand yet and aftermarket exclusionary warranties are still able to be purchased? I just went to Hershey and fell in love with the Anthem, but we are not retiring for a few years and I feel like we should buy an older unit first to minimize depreciation as we learn what really matters to us. Also, lets assume I get a got deal on a 10 year old coach and decide I want to upgrade to a much newer unit after 2 years, will the major dealers like RVOne, etc take a 12 year old unit in on trade? Looking for some advice, but I would like to start out with a quality brand.

wmpbauer · 09-20-2016, 09:36 PM

Hard to finance, but it is probably worth consideration. Just remember, it will be even HARDER to sell down the road, so while you're trying to hedge your bet, this could bite you on the back end when you want to purchase new.

Pat Bauer, President
Entegra Coach Owners Association
www.entegraowners.com
2017 Anthem DEQ/Ford Edge

Ann n Gene · 09-20-2016, 10:32 PM

I agree with Pat. Very few banks will finance a 10 year old coach and the market will be very limited when you want to sell because of this. So I think you should really have to buy at a low price to keep depreciation and limited market from hurting you. Now, with that said. Those old Travel Supremes are great coaches and have features years ahead of most coaches so if you can find one at a good price I think you will love it. JMHO

2016 44 B Topaz Cornerstone
2014 MKT towed

Smitty77 · 09-20-2016, 11:10 PM

As far as age. A quality TS, well cared for with good records, and with a clean inspection - would not be a concern.

On resell in say 2-5 years, IMO, also not much of a concern. Yes some may need to skip looking because of RV Finance concerns. But, many also will be either paying cash or using a home equity line. So buyers will be available, for the right price - and of course, this is where taking good care of the unit on our part, will help on the sell.

On the question sweet spot for age vs maintenance costs. Well somewhere between 8-12 years of a age, it's prudent to replace all hoses as preventative maintenance. Slide Toppers and possibly awnings too, will have a replacement cycle probably also in the same 8-12 of age. Batteries of chassis and house are so dependent on how well they were cared for, regardless of if wet of AGM, that this could be almost anywhere after the coach rolls of the factory floor. (I've known people to buy 'new' coaches from dealers, with batteries so neglected that they'd lost many years of life due to poor maintenance.) That being said, probably the 7-10 year cycle for those major batteries is the max. And tires of course, are usually in the 5-7 year range, and they age out.

Other factors include different smog levels transitions. Where sometimes an older coach, could have less likely need for emission related maintenance items.

So to me, I'd not be as much worried about he years, as much as I would:

> Picking the budget range that I want to purchase.
> Retain some contingency funds in the budget, to do catch up baseline maintenance if needed. And an personal mod's to make it your coach. And a bucket for the things that pop-up that could surprise you.
> Drop years to remain within budget purchase range, and buy the highest quality coach you can find that meets your needs.

And, if you really are looking at a replacement coach in say 2-4 years. Another viable option is to even drop older, and search a bit longer, and purchase a much less expensive coach to gap those years. Their are so many pride of ownership coaches available. 10-20 years old, and older, that due to great maintenance by the owners, have many good years of life ahead of them. Say a $35-50K coach. That would take a much lower hit in depreciation when you got sell it in such a short period of time. May not have all the bells and whistles you want long range, but for sure, would be fun and safe to go out in for a few years.

Or, pay the price you would for an older say TS, and get a newer higher end gasser of now.

Best of luck to you on this. Oh, an TS were on our short list when shopping. We were looking for 4-6 years old coaches when we shopped, but that was to reach the earlier pre heavy changes to smog changes. We were shopping 5-7 years ago now, so going back that far got us into the higher quality coaches, and less smog, while remaining wishing budget. We were lucky, while those that had to get out from under were not, that the financial problems of 2007-2009 still had many high end coaches flooding the market, as owners needing to move on. Not the case at this time...

Again, good luck,
Smitty

Cherokee180C · 09-21-2016, 11:51 AM

Thanks for all the replies. I will be able to pay cash, so not worried about the loan restrictions for myself, but it sounds like I should indeed worry about that issue for resale. Will banks lend for a 9.5 year old coach, but not 10? Also the other items such as tires etc are all good items that would be documented in the inspection report and must be included in the price negotiation process. If the seller was unwilling to lower the price accordingly, I would just walk away.

So I still don't know if someone like RVone will take 10-12 year old units in trade, and if they do, are you only talking about prices way below NADA low -10%?

RubiconTrail · 09-22-2016, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherokee180C

So I still don't know if someone like RVone will take 10-12 year old units in trade, and if they do, are you only talking about prices way below NADA low -10%?

I can't speak to your specific coach, but I will say they will take about any reasonable coach in trade. They will also price accordingly. I've only done this once, but tried at multiple dealers and the numbers came out the same at all of them once the trade in and coach price were reconciled...trade in was half or less of NADA book. Dealers that take coaches older than 10 years are wholesaling them in big lots to non-flooring dealers for very low prices.

pcurt23 · 09-22-2016, 12:00 PM

Buy your last one first. It will cost a lot of money to try one out for two years. Resale is worse than horrible.

I have a 10 year old coach that is in fairly good condition. Since it was financed I still have a ways to go to pay it off. So my view is that 10 years on a pusher is not that old if it has been maintained. And who can afford to give up 200,000 every 10 years so it must be worth something.

This year was extraordinary in terms of expense. I have replace the front seats, new turbo, new pac brake, new genny coolant tank, and the normal yearly maintenance. And the damn Norcold cost me 1200 in service calls over the Winter.

We use our coach a lot. We are in it about 5 months a year. So it is worth the expense.

Cherokee180C · 09-22-2016, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RubiconTrail

I can't speak to your specific coach, but I will say they will take about any reasonable coach in trade. They will also price accordingly. I've only done this once, but tried at multiple dealers and the numbers came out the same at all of them once the trade in and coach price were reconciled...trade in was half or less of NADA book. Dealers that take coaches older than 10 years are wholesaling them in big lots to non-flooring dealers for very low prices.

This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for. This tells me to not even think about a 10 year old coach first if you are thinking to try first before buying a newer coach unless you get it substantially below NADA low. It sounds though that you will have a hell of a lot of leverage on the seller who only choice is half NADA low on a trade or a reasonable cash offer.

What is a reasonable trade in on a 7-8 year old unit? Where are the wholesalers selling the older units that they buy at 1/2 NADA?

Matt D · 09-22-2016, 02:12 PM

Based on your handle, I'd expect you're fairly comfortable with the concept of renting and buying high dollar toys. While buying said toy is always the most satisfying, it constrains you to achieve the perfect balance right off the bat.

While getting granular on potential resale scenarios is interesting, there is no predicting exactly how your deal will transpire.

My suggestion would be this, rather than buying right away, simply rent.

Yes, I know what renting a pusher costs. My answer to this is to calculate maintenance and depreciation for a year, then compare that to your planned usage and rental costs.

For example, even if you want to use it for a full month of touring, at $5000/wk you're at $20K for that month.

Unless you buy really inexpensively, you will most likely exceed $20K in costs over a year of ownership. If not, you're pretty close.

While that rental is expensive, consider it the price of learning exactly what you prefer.

Food for thought,

-Matt

Airflite1 · 09-22-2016, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherokee180C

This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for. This tells me to not even think about a 10 year old coach first if you are thinking to try first before buying a newer coach unless you get it substantially below NADA low. It sounds though that you will have a hell of a lot of leverage on the seller who only choice is half NADA low on a trade or a reasonable cash offer.

What is a reasonable trade in on a 7-8 year old unit? Where are the wholesalers selling the older units that they buy at 1/2 NADA?

I just purchased a 2003 Travel Supreme Select, I've stayed in it the last two months and I'm very impressed over the 2000 Monaco Diplomat I had previously. I think I got a very good deal trading, the dealer had just serviced all major items and put all new tires on it. Next week I'll finally put some miles on it driving from Idaho to Minnesota. I was looking at a 2007 TS and also a 2007 Newmar Mountain Aire. The Floor plan is what swayed me along with it only having 16,000 miles and the fact it didn't look like it had ever been used. My intention is if I use it as much as I hope I might trade for something 2012-new. The only thing I feel compelled to upgrade right away is the TV's, The Plasma works great, but people told me it puts out quite a bit of heat, and it does. My feeling is the newer RV's will depreciate faster than mine so I'm not worrying about depreciation in a future trade. I'll just keep this serviced upgrade as I want, then If I see one I really like trade in a year or two. (of course I said that about the Monaco and kept that 7 years).

Cherokee180C · 10-02-2016, 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airflite1

I just purchased a 2003 Travel Supreme Select, I've stayed in it the last two months and I'm very impressed over the 2000 Monaco Diplomat I had previously. I think I got a very good deal trading, the dealer had just serviced all major items and put all new tires on it. Next week I'll finally put some miles on it driving from Idaho to Minnesota. I was looking at a 2007 TS and also a 2007 Newmar Mountain Aire. The Floor plan is what swayed me along with it only having 16,000 miles and the fact it didn't look like it had ever been used. My intention is if I use it as much as I hope I might trade for something 2012-new. The only thing I feel compelled to upgrade right away is the TV's, The Plasma works great, but people told me it puts out quite a bit of heat, and it does. My feeling is the newer RV's will depreciate faster than mine so I'm not worrying about depreciation in a future trade. I'll just keep this serviced upgrade as I want, then If I see one I really like trade in a year or two. (of course I said that about the Monaco and kept that 7 years).

Do you mind me asking what you paid? Sounds like a cherry RV. Did you say the dealer took you Monaco Diplomat in trade? Other people have been suggesting dealers will only accept older than 10 year units in at about 50% NADA low.

What you are doing sounds like the best way for us to try for a year or two before spending $300K, so I am very interested in how it works out for you!

Ready2Travel · 10-02-2016, 08:54 AM

If you get into a 10 year old TS at a good price it will not depreciate that much in 2 years. If you do up date in a few years be prepared to sell it yourself rather than trading. If you negotiate a good price on a new one the dealer is not likely to give you a fair price for your trade. A 10-12 year old in good condition offered at a reasonable price is not that difficult to sell on RVTRADER.