Community Forums

brianw8602 · 11-14-2014, 05:16 PM

Dave, makes sense on the contract part. Might be a good part time job for a retiree. I guess my concern is the lack of reporting what seems to be a quite obvious problem. Maybe Entegra should drive them around the block a few times to see if there are issues. I would think this would save them money over a very short period of time by not having to pay some other vendor to correct these issues. Or maybe it's a Spartan issue and they eat the repair bill? Either way, why not correct it before the customer has to deal with it?

DSL417 · 11-14-2014, 05:32 PM

I don't know how much they drive them "around the block", but it is about a 1/2 mile back and forth from the factory completion area/storage to the inspection point (same building where maintenance goes on. In a different post, I discussed my visit with the guy who heads up the inspection point that a coach must pass (checklist is currently 349 items) before it goes to the delivery company. This is new starting about May or Jun and my guess is they are just starting to get the "bit in their teeth". That said, I showed him about ten things that should have been ID'd on my coach...none were on the list. OTOH, that list is sufficiently long to suggest that they are getting a pretty rigorous inspection before they leave, and they don't leave until they pass. That said, stuff happens on the road. I just reread a thread on bad roads and I75 in FL was ID'd. Been on it; no doubt it and other interstates are not good on alignments. The other side, I have no doubt that curbs are struck, corners are cut subjecting the coach to ruts and pot holes, and any of the other things that damage front ends and knock coaches out of alignment. The addition of an alignment facility at Entegra in a couple of months will help, but you can't overcome drivers that are paid to get it there (and are not likely to acknowledge what they hit in route; or can't because of experience differentiate the difference between rutted and crowned roads and a poor alignment). JMHO

brianw8602 · 11-14-2014, 06:09 PM

All good points Dave. We did a factory tour a couple of months ago and were very impressed. We were told that all coaches now go through 2 separate PDI's. I assumed this was coach specific, not necessarily chassis specific. Maybe they can combine the two? My overall opinion of Entegra remains the same . . . quality product. With over 1600 units on the road, the problems/issues presented here are hopefully the exception and not the rule. I guess we will find out in Feb.

coachmanrvr · 11-14-2014, 06:09 PM

Based on your list I would honestly like to say welcome to RV ownership. We have had the pleasure of owning two class C's and three class A's....all have issues. All of them. We have owned a Class C Coachmen 31KS, Class A Holiday Rambler Vacationer Gas pusher, Class C Winnebego Access, a Tiffin Allegro 35QBA, and our current Entegra. The Tiffin by reputation should have been the most reliable but was quite a handfull. See my past posts for proof! We have had slide out issues, jack issues, hydraulic system issues, step issues, water leaks in the slide outs, refrigerator issues in the Tiffin and now the Entegra...you name it we've seen it. You can't buy your way out of issues. They are part of the journey of RV ownership. Learn your rig and use this forum for what it is as a tremendous resource for learning and assistance. Thanks for sharing your issues as it helps to share information, but you have a short list and basically none that would prevent your trip. Take your trip and enjoy the journey!

Here's a few for the road...

Nowabeachbum · 11-14-2014, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coachmanrvr

Based on your list I would honestly like to say welcome to RV ownership. We have had the pleasure of owning two class C's and three class A's....all have issues. All of them. We have owned a Class C Coachmen 31KS, Class A Holiday Rambler Vacationer Gas pusher, Class C Winnebego Access, a Tiffin Allegro 35QBA, and our current Entegra. The Tiffin by reputation should have been the most reliable but was quite a handfull. See my past posts for proof! We have had slide out issues, jack issues, hydraulic system issues, step issues, water leaks in the slide outs, refrigerator issues in the Tiffin and now the Entegra...you name it we've seen it. You can't buy your way out of issues. They are part of the journey of RV ownership. Learn your rig and use this forum for what it is as a tremendous resource for learning and assistance. Thanks for sharing your issues as it helps to share information, but you have a short list and basically none that would prevent your trip. Take your trip and enjoy the journey!

Well said! Issues are inevitable, hopefully they can get fixed easily along the way. So far it sounds like the issues are small. As was said above, it's all part of the journey! It's also why a 2 year warranty is a big deal!
Also I would suggest you schedule a service trip to Entegra now even if you are not sure of what problems you will have them work on. You will be surprised how far out Entegra is booking! Next summer in Middlebury is already pretty scheduled!
As you have already noted, getting service from quality service outlets is always problematic.

hogdriver · 11-14-2014, 09:55 PM

RV issues are a nature of the sport. I feel your pain. Sorry you are having them. This is my fourth Class A and all have had issues. On the flip side. Once you get the bugs worked out they seem to last for a long time. Hang in there. I've never seen a perfect brand.

zman62 · 11-14-2014, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brianw8602

I keep seeing a couple of common complaints on a few different threads on this forum; front end alignment and air leaks. I have to wonder what the background is of the drivers used to deliver these coaches to the dealers? Are they hired by the selling dealer or are they Entegra employees? Either way, I would think they would have a responsibility to report to the dealership that the front end is out of alignment or that there is an air leak! Some of these sound like they were so bad, the driver should have never left the lot in Middlebury, or at least turned around and returned. You can't tell me a professional driver (I know I am making an assumption here) would not detect either of these issues, and not report them. Then again, maybe they do and the dealership ignores it. I hope not.

I dont think its the drivers responsibility. He is hired to take a coach from point a to point b not diagnose problems. The coach should be coming off line with an alignment and no air leaks, I think that is the problem. Since taking delivery of our London Aire and putting 4k miles on it I can honestly say I have not one problem. It can be done and more manufactures need to do it.

brobox · 11-15-2014, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brianw8602

I keep seeing a couple of common complaints on a few different threads on this forum; front end alignment and air leaks. I have to wonder what the background is of the drivers used to deliver these coaches to the dealers? Are they hired by the selling dealer or are they Entegra employees? Either way, I would think they would have a responsibility to report to the dealership that the front end is out of alignment or that there is an air leak! Some of these sound like they were so bad, the driver should have never left the lot in Middlebury, or at least turned around and returned. You can't tell me a professional driver (I know I am making an assumption here) would not detect either of these issues, and not report them. Then again, maybe they do and the dealership ignores it. I hope not.

I think the delivery driver on my coach was one step below a trained monkey and it was evident....they flat don't care! I said the same thing to Entegra and Lazy Days, but it fell on deaf ears. I was told it was the transportation company's problem. Your post has been a pet peeve mine since our MH was delivered. What's wrong with paying a driver an extra 20 bucks to take 5 minutes a fill out a drivers check sheet? I know for a fact, I would not take delivery without a pre-inspection first next time.

jestal · 11-15-2014, 11:18 AM

#9 -- You might want to replace the small filter cartridge for the reefer water as well as the house filter element. It sounds like your coach sat for a long time probably with the RV antifreeze in the filter. The AF will plug filter media. Also replace the filter in the reefer itself if it has one.

I can appreciate your frustration after sorting through many of the exact same issues on a pre-owned 2013 fresh from a PDI @ Entegra. Can not understand how the coach got past delivery drivers, previous owner, two dealers, Entegra PDI, etc.

At least there is some satisfaction in getting the coach "right" finally...

Did you check your VIN for the trans "economy mode" re-flash requirement.

dusty56 · 11-15-2014, 12:18 PM

Dave I watched my dealer check in my previous coach at the time of delivery. There is a separate area for new deliveries. I happened to be at the right place at the right time. Drivers sit in the office until the process is complete. They are asked questions from the check in person from what I could see. The drivers really didn't want to talk to a customer like me. I was able to talk to one driver of another brand and he said he was in freezing weather, stuck in traffic for 12 hours in Tennessee. He also said he is not allowed to run the generator so he relied on dash board heat. They must have their marching orders.

The dealer wouldn't even let me in the unit the process was complete. They checked what worked etc... opened all cabinets checked for dings and outside paint and all the mechanicals. Took pictures as well. On mine it was a good couple of hours. They did the same thing on other manufacturer coaches.

Apparently they put together a list, I assume they submit to manufacturer and get some form of compensation. Makes sense because it is my understanding that nothing leaves the manufacturer until the dealership wire transfers the funds. So that would mean it is in every dealers best interest to make a punch list and get some form of compensation, after all they paid for the unit upfront. I don't think they test drive it, at least I didn't see them test drive. I assume that is what they ask the delivery driver "any problems". If he/she says all is good, they take his/her word. If there is a problem, cummins or spartan has to fix anyway no cost to dealer and the manufacturer would probably not be interested in a 3rd party problem anyway. Just a guess on my part.

Then again someone at the dealership has to work on the new coach and that would be a expense. I can't believe the dealership would just say ok we will fix it no charge. Now what happens from that point in time until it is delivered to the new owner well that is another topic. Just saying!

Now I know of someone that I met at the dealership who bought a unitD and the initial manufacturer delivery was a day or two late for some unknown reason. When he finally got into the coach well he found receipts dated the same time the unit would of been in transit for a strip club off of I75. So apparently the drivers have some discretion as to where than can stop and rest

Sum it up, my coach passed inspection and everything checked out. Happy Camper! Unless the manufactures own the dealership, or the dealerships own the manufacturer, we have the above referenced system in place. Not a perfect system.

For those newbies buying their first big rig, it is a daunting experience to say the least. Warranty work, well they will come to understand seasoned RV'rs will move forward with plans to travel (if the problems are minor) and will migrate when time permits to the shop that they feel comfortable dealing with. In my case where I purchased the unit.

DSL417 · 11-15-2014, 01:23 PM

Mike,

I'm going to assume I'm the Dave you referred to in your post...I kinda thought that was the process at Lazy Days, and I assume that is where you are referring. They have a really good receiving area, so I assumed that was going on there in some shape or form, but I had not experienced it there. I had not observed RVOne in Orlando, but, as you are aware, their space for delivery is not so elegant...guess you have to preserve costs somewhere. I do know that it can be costly for a dealer to not be very observant of dings and blemishes. I'm not so sure they do the detailed (does it work) review until they prep for delivery...after all, warrantee will cover that :(

There are some that will certainly be reassured by what you post, I would certainly view it as a plus if I were looking at LD as a potential dealer.

That said, Beth brought up a really good point when we were talking about this this AM...concerning both delivery and the inspection people at Entegra.

They are all looking for what DOESN'T WORK, when we get the coach, we are looking for things that are NOT RIGHT. I would submit there is a difference. That would sum up my visit with the inspection lead at Entegra.

DSL417 · 11-15-2014, 01:30 PM

You know, Mike, just thinking about it, they don't have the free parking ID'd at the strip clubs in all those on line apps and books, but I'll bet if there is room, they'll let you boondocks. Of course, Beth might not appreciate it if I tried to save a few bucks that way

brobox · 11-15-2014, 02:38 PM

Mike, I sure wish our delivery had the same experience that you did at the same dealer. Our generator had 26 hours on it at delivery and 44 hours on it when we picked it up at Entegra. That surprised me with Aqua Hot. The black tank was a third full. Those items I could have cared less about, I was actually glad the generator had a few "test" hours on it.

It was the terrible steering, air leaks that were down to zero in an hour that were never mentioned to anyone, not even me. I guess it is the luck of the draw, some have fantastic deliveries and others not so much. I would have given anything to have had a delivery like you did, I know it's possible.

dusty56 · 11-15-2014, 03:34 PM

I think it is costly for a dealer to accept it. Just like shipping of a product, when the package arrives damaged you are suppose to notify the carrier. If a coach comes defective it would be a lot more difficult to get the manufacturer to pay 30 to 90 days sitting on your lot. Warranty items aside, but damage to cabinets, tile, paint, leather etc... that is going up to the manufacturer upon delivery. That is my opinion.

Chuck, somehow you got the short end of the straw on that delivery. It is unfortunate but I read about you getting things done on it to make it your own. One day you will sit back and enjoy the coach. I will be in LD in January you need to drop on by and say hi.

My opinion, if the dealers didn't have a waiting list of ordered coaches and they knew they would have to keep them on the lot and market them for 30 to 100 days (time value of money) they would probably have them in great shape, cleaned ready for the next potential buyer. Just saying if I was a dealer and I had three units delivered on Tuesday (roughly 1 million in real company dollars) and I had three buyers that were waiting on them for six months, dealer might have the tendency to call them on Tuesday and say come in before Saturday to pick up your new coach. Might not perform the inspection as thoroughly. I think this could even be more exaggerated when the dealer knows that you are out of state, it is all about pricing and you may never come back to have it serviced regularly. Makes the quick buck, quick turnaround, quick profit.

This may get some negative comments but come on put yourself in the shoes of a dealer. They have some serious money in these units. If they can get you in it (they made their profit) then warranty repair it (you own it not them ) they win twice.