Dealership problems

[Marcosdad]

Our experience seems to favor NIRVC's position. We ordered our rig in Lo$t Wage$ at Octoberfest. We wanted delivery in Thackerville at the "Customer Appreciation", but NIRVC would not do it due to potential infringement on MHS's turf. We drove to Atlanta, picked up the rig there and then drove it to Thackerville for the party. THEN we took it to Lewisville for work and it was there (and then) that we got our red carpet pictures but they had had our money for about three weeks.

[royals1212]

I have one question, how does NIRV business model differ from Motorhome Specialist (dealership that has North Texas). MHS sells to people all over country, ie outside their territory. A sales representative does not have to be located at the facility which is selling the unit. In this case the NIRV Entegra purchasers are not taking delivery of their new coaches in Texas. Seems to me like this is the same thing MHS is doing

[RickWhite]

At this point it is really hard to know/say what really happened. I think the at the end of the day it is two of the top selling dealerships taking shots at each other via the manufacture because one is fearful of the other and/or starting to feel the pressure. I also would not be surprised if the manufacture is taking action due to contractual obligations and not because that is what they want to do. The actions taken so far could be more about "See I tried" vs actually trying to resolve the problems personal problems the two dealerships have with each other themselves.

Here is my experience with both dealerships. This past February we got serious about looking for our next RV. We visited with both NIRV & MSHRV. Based on first impressions NIRV won hands down. Our initial salesman at MSHRV was clueless about how to help us. While we were clear in what features we were looking for he kept steering us to coaches that did not meet our criteria. None met the quality and finish we stated we were looking for. Granted he was new to selling RVs, I guess his impression of us that the Entegra's were beyond our means.

While not satisfied, before we left MSHRV, we went over to the old movie theater on site and had a bite to eat. It was actually decent BBQ. After regrouping, we decided we wanted to get a better look at the Entegra and a few other coaches before starting the 90m drive home. The nice thing about MHSRV is all coaches are unlocked and they have no issues helping yourself to tour any coach on the lot without a salesperson present. We even roamed the lot in our vehicle instead of checking out one of their golf carts.

In the end it was between Newmar & Entegra for us, with us ultimately deciding that Entegra was the coach for us. Because I had not starting actually talking details about purchasing with MSHRV yet, I contacted NIRV first. I knew they sold Entegras, just not at the Lewisville store. Like I said, we had a much better all around feeling from them. Our salesman at NIRV was clear and I already understood that they would have to sell me the coach from one of the other stores and in addition we would have to take delivery at a location/store other than the Lewisville store.

With the Lewisville salesperson not being familiar with Entegras, he put me in touch with a salesperson from one of their other stores. After long discussions with NIRV, it was determined they did not have the coach I wanted in stock and could not get one on my timetable. MSHRV did have the coach I wanted and the NIRV salesperson was doubtful that NIRV could beat the price at MHSRV for this particular coach. As much as NIRV wanted to sell me the coach it was suggest I buy the coach from MHSRV. NIRV knew I was not impressed with my initial salesman/contact at MHSRV and asked if it was ok to pass my information on to a different salesperson that the NIRV salesperson personally knew at MHSRV to contact me. The new salesman at MHSRV contacted me directly after being contacted by NIRV and in the end we purchased the coach and had a wonderful buying experience.

PDI went smooth and MHSRV was very detailed in going thru all the coaches systems. It was quite a learning curve for us going from a 2009 coach to a 2017. While all the systems are basically the same, it is still quite a bit to learn. Because of work (we still do that for a living) obligations we opted to take the coach home that evening instead of staying on-site for a few days. I feel that has been a mistake on our part. While very attentive during PDI, getting service to address the things we should have found during PDI and on-site has been less than impressive (story for another time/post/thread). While nothing on our list is serious or keeps us from using the coach, they are items that need to be resolved. If I was willing to leave the coach at MHSRV for a undetermined length of time, I guess they would get to it. The one trip to service for the only immediate attention item, I was poking around the service lot and it appeared most of the Entegras had been sitting there a minimum of 30 days. One for over 90. While I don't know why there, I bought the coach to use. Leaving it there for extended periods of time is not what I paid for.

I was excited to learn that NIRV could handle the service for my coach. Not only do I prefer them (so far at least). They seem to have a stellar following here and they are much closer to my home. So they are more convenient for me to use. Hopefully my assessment of it is just two dealers pi$$ing at each other is all this is and the manufacture has been drawn in reluctantly.

[MisterT]

Originally Posted by DeeGee

Depending upon the contract between Jayco and MHS, Jayco may not really have any choice about this. I'm betting that a sale is a sale and Jayco likes NIRVC, but they have to file this suit anyway.

right, they HAVE to file this to satisfy their other LARGE national dealer, MHSRV, who is the one complaining about this 'fishing' of business from them. MHSRV has the rights to the 'area', just as most dealers do for the make/model/line they have a contract with the factory on. The factory is in 'charge' of making sure that others, even their OWN dealers in other areas, do not take away sales from authorized dealers in THAT area.

in essence, if the proof can be shown that potential customers who contacted NIRVC in Texas were convinced to purchase an Entegra Coach from THEM, through their dealership in another 'area'/state, then, yes, their is a problem. But, in today's modern world of dealerships, where internet price-comparing and selling happen online, by phone, and email, then the lines become more gray.
If a customer walks into NIRVC in Texas and inquires about a Newmar, no problem. IF they then start asking about other makes, such as Entegra, is NIRVC not allowed to give them the option to contact their Georgia operation, who is an authorized Entegra dealer? Yes, No, buy maybe.

So is the question really about 'WHO' starts the conversation, and gives the referral, or is it really about 'HOW' the conversation proceeds?
If Angie is really 'luring' potential Entegra customers into NIRVC with the pretense that they, the Texas operation, are really Entegra's authorized dealer, then, yes, she is overstepping her bounds. If she, though, is just making a suggestion, or making a referral to the Georgia operation, then it's hard to say that she is in the 'wrong'.

Jayco/Entegra/Thor are really the one's with the issue to resolve, and to resolve it in favor of their true authorized dealer, MHSRV. This dealer is the one harmed, not Jayco/Entegra, but they have to act on the dealer's behalf. It's like a spat between your children, which do you side with? The one making the complaint? or the one saying they've done nothing wrong?

I'm not sure that the factory can win this suit, as they probably don't really want to anyway, but need to show good faith to their authorized dealer. MHSRV and NIRVC are going to be going at it from now on with this make of coach, it's up to them to see who comes out best, though we'll all be better off because of it, if price and service are part of the competition.

I also noticed that NIRVC is also carrying the Thor Palazzo line now. This is new to them, though MHSRV has carried Thor for years. They can't be happy about this either, but Thor caused this once they purchased Jayco/Entegra.

It's the nature of the business.

[DSL417]

Nothing like speculation about the law, driven by personal preferences, when you don't practice law in the state in question, or at all.

You know, you can't build a McDonalds, or a number of other franchises like Coca Cola bottling, two blocks down the street from an existing franchise holder because they have exclusive area agreements (sounds like the case here, but only the courts will judge that). Franchises like Pizza Hut seem like they are separated in cities by less than a mile. Then you find out Yum Industries has the franchise for the town, by agreement.

Counter - Subways on every corner.

Bottom line - speculating on what the courts will decide seems less than productive. JMHO

[spuds]

Originally Posted by MisterT

I also noticed that NIRVC is also carrying the Thor Palazzo line now. This is new to them, though MHSRV has carried Thor for years. They can't be happy about this either, but Thor caused this once they purchased Jayco/Entegra.

My understanding of this is that Thor pursued NIRVC regarding selling the Palazzo, not the other way around.

[brobox]

Along with what Dave is saying. I was involved with Red Carpet Real Estate Franchises is another life. Two offices got into a lawsuit over territories because the Phone Book boundaries differed from the franchise agreement. The Judge said "we don't practice law by the phone book" In other words, the judge will have the final decision.

[Brian W]

Originally Posted by MisterT

I also noticed that NIRVC is also carrying the Thor Palazzo line now. This is new to them, though MHSRV has carried Thor for years. They can't be happy about this either, but Thor caused this once they purchased Jayco/Entegra.



It's the nature of the business.

Actually, this is quite common in the RV industry. Forum rules don't allow me to discuss what units we carry at our dealership, so I will just say Manufacturer A.

We have an agreement with Manufacturer A to carry their b,c,d, f, and z models. Dealer down the road carries Manufacturer A's a, e, g, and h model.

Manufacturer B says if we want to carry their product we have to buy at least 3 of everything they sell every year.

Each manufacturer is different, and my guess is Thor offered MHSRV the right to carry Palazzo and they turned it down. Thor would then go to NIRVC and ask them if they want to carry it.

From everything I have read on here for the most part, NIRVC is a great dealership and hopefully things can be worked out.

[wnytaxman]

Originally Posted by brobox

Along with what Dave is saying. I was involved with Red Carpet Real Estate Franchises is another life. Two offices got into a lawsuit over territories because the Phone Book boundaries differed from the franchise agreement. The Judge said "we don't practice law by the phone book" In other words, the judge will have the final decision.

Chuck, I agree that the final will come down to the judge's gavel, but I do think that whichever dealer complained that they have a valid point. Let's say I plunk down a half million on a fast food franchise on Main Street in My Town. I sign a franchise agreement that says they will not open another franchise within five miles of my location. Now if another franchisee opens within that five miles, then I have a legitimate gripe and case.

Not knowing what Entegra's agreement contains makes all of our comments speculative, but more than likely they do feel they have a legitimate complaint, or at least their lawyers feel that way. If NIRVC got caught in a sting, then they should have known better. It's no different in my business. If I do something illegal, even though it's only once, then I have to pay the price.

Ed

[Boomertx]

Didn't MHSRV open up an "Entegra ONLY" service department? Apparently too many Entegra owners were making their feelings known about substandard service...

Personally we won't be back to MHSRV . . . they would only allow a test drive if we paid a non-refundable deposit on a specific unit . . . sorry, but for a $300k potential purchase that just wasn't going to happen. Besides which, we've pretty much abandoned the new unit purchase . . . we are too old and too ready to travel to spend a year inspecting a new coach for the manufacturer.

[dusty56]

So glad I am retired. I can read about this (makes for a good afternoon with a cocktail) and like all of us on the forum we feel strongly for all sides but have no $ in the game.


As one of the most brilliant litigation attorney's told me, " the truth never comes out in civil court, there is no DNA, no murder weapon, no video, no crime, just one interpretation vs another opinion. When the money runs out the matter is resolved."


Ok back to my job, retirement.

[MRUSA14]

The whole thing seems darned silly to me. Anybody who wants to can pick up the phone and buy an Entegra from more than a dozen dealers all over the country, so why pick on just one dealer, NIRV, who is regularly lauded for the best customer service in the industry? It may benefit MHSRV to bring this suit, but it sure does not benefit Entegra's customers, who would arguably wind up paying higher prices for inferior service.

[hdgoldie]

I suspect it was the face to face offer that caused the issue. Offering to negotiate and do paperwork in TX may be the issue. Contacts via phone and internet may well be acceptable- we purchased from Robin at RVOne while living in TX - and at the end of a bidding process between the two dealerships. So the face to face offer to the PI could have been their downfall. But, in a different industry, we had a dealership agreement that only allowed a certain percentage of total sales to customers outside our defined dealer area. If that is the case here, this could be an interesting case to follow.

[Brian W]

Here's the complaint
https://www.scribd.com/mobile/docume...ayco-Complaint