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Old 11-12-2020, 12:37 AM   #1
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DEF low concentrate error but Def is 3/4 full.

Anyone have this issue? I filled the passenger side. Should I have filled both sides?
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Old 11-12-2020, 05:26 AM   #2
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There is only one tank. Did you fill it with jugs of DEF or fill it at a pump?
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Old 11-12-2020, 06:31 AM   #3
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Here is the problem most have had if it's a newer coach. It looks like a matter of not "if", but when on the newer coaches. https://www.irv2.com/forums/f278/def...an-499983.html
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Old 11-12-2020, 03:04 PM   #4
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I have no idea what "Low DEF concentrate" means. DEF must be at a specific concentration to be legally called DEF. So, if the error literally means that a sensor says your DEF is below that federally mandated concentration (32.5 % urea and the rest deionized water"), then you may have run into one of those situation everyone talks about but few have really encountered.... you put in a tank of clear tap water that was put in a DEF tank given back to WalMart or similar pstore after the real DEF was put into someone's diesel tank before refilling with tap water. The alternative reason for that error would be that the DEF is OK but the concentration sensor is faulty.

If you have a reflectometer, you can literally measure the DEF concentration (should be 32.5 urea) of the DEF in your tank. If you actually poured in clear water rather than DEF, they you could drain the whole tank and fill it with good DEF and that might clear the code.

I would be on the phone to talk with Spartan soon and let them guide you on what to do. If the DEF is a problem, the ECM will only let you go so far before it throws a "de-rate code" and eventually a "shut down" code and you will be getting towed down the road. This could be a serious problem.

Your information says you own a 35' Holiday Rambler.... is that the coach you are inquiring about or have you changed coaches and now are talking about an Entegra coach? IF an HR, what specific engine do you have and what is the model year of your coach?

Gary
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Old 11-13-2020, 05:25 PM   #5
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Since the HR doesn't have fills for DEF on both sides I am assuming you have a newer coach. I believe that somewhere in late 2016 / 2017 the EPA mandated DEF Quality Sensors. This may be mounted on the side of you tank and could be the source of the error. I would do what Gary said and measure the the DEF concentration with a reflectometer. BTW, if you have the Aquahot service kit you will have one in the kit. Not sure if this is available in local auto parts stores, but if not here is one on Amazon. If you get a reading of 32.5 I would put in a call to Spartan as Cummins has said that this is not an uncommon failure.


https://www.amazon.com/Antifreeze-Co...xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
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Old 11-14-2020, 06:34 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brobox View Post
Here is the problem most have had if it's a newer coach. It looks like a matter of not "if", but when on the newer coaches. https://www.irv2.com/forums/f278/def...an-499983.html
Yep, mine went prior to delivery. Being that we are planning a very long trip this winter, I am worried. I called Spartan and asked would they ship me a spare. They will but for $~900. I pushed harder and asked if they would credit me in the event that it needed to be replaced. No, they will just send a new one. I think I will call again and push a little harder. I'll let the board know what they say. I'm simply trying to expedite a repair should I need one en route, perhaps saving an overnight or two layover
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Old 11-14-2020, 07:45 AM   #7
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Do all the other diesels vehicles have these same DEF issues?....
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Old 11-14-2020, 08:14 AM   #8
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Yes.....

DEF sensor and related issues are a problem right now. DEF is a great product in cleaning up the environment, but it has induced a bunch of problems in equipment to deal with DEF, and the government has had little tolerance for people running coaches and trucks which dont conform to expected standards. The real problem is that the companies that make these products to detect concentration, or pump DEF at the exact right volume, or sense whether the DEF is doing its job and there is not too much soot coming out of your tail pipe.... all of those things are involved.

Someone on here (Brobox) has reported that there are like 23 or 32 sensors just in the "afterprocessing" unit (the catalytic converter on a car) and all of those sensors have an important job to do, and all that information is fed back into the ECM which makes a ton of adjustments and regulates a bunch of processes that need to be regulated. All of it is good for the environment.... but all of that involves a bunch of processes that can still fail or get out of whack. Worse, the sensor technology is very new still and evolving, so a lot of it is just not yet at a point of being very stable. Several years from now, they will have this all figured out, but right now, as we see, there are still lots of potential problems.

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Old 11-14-2020, 10:25 AM   #9
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Here we go again! Picked up the 21 from the alignment shop late yesterday, 1,557 miles, same dealer installed DEF in the tank more, than 1/2 full. Check engine light came on at startup with Emission in the warning window with the follow message "Low DEF Concentrate". Restarted three times, it was getting dark so I didn't mess with it.
On the 19 it had the message "High DEF Concentrate" Looks I night get one of each for the messages.

Going up now to do a 12v chassis reboot and read the error code(s).
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Old 11-14-2020, 11:13 AM   #10
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Chuck
You do seem to get to have all the fun. We are planning to drive down to your neck of the woods next week from upstate NY. I sure wish there was a work around for these DEF sensors. While you and I have different chassis’s, I think we both came down Entegra line about the same time and we have similar mileage at this point. Our drive to Florida might be a bit of an adventure and take a little longer longer if we get a check engine light.
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Old 11-14-2020, 12:26 PM   #11
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Did all the reboots 3 more restarts and still the dreaded 3031 code. I'll call Spartan again and go through the drill. Also see if there's any reporting agency to file complaints. This is the second DEF sensor that has not made it to 2,000 miles on two new coaches. Are we having fun yet
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Old 11-14-2020, 12:58 PM   #12
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Tim, If you are traveling I 95 in NC at the Kenly,NC exit is a Cummins facility just past the Flying J and they've been extremely good to get service from in our experience. I'm hoping you don't have any issues !

Chuck, You just keep getting LUCKIER with each purchase 😡😡
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Old 11-14-2020, 01:03 PM   #13
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Chuck,
Did you happen to try the unplug solution? I don't know from personnel experience but have heard and read that unplugging the connector at the head has had a good outcome.

JP
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Old 11-14-2020, 02:20 PM   #14
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Reboot it, unplug it, kick it, shake it, there’s got to be a better way. These Generation six sensors were suppose to be the answer, but while they may be better there have been some failures.
Chuck, I think they intentionally put a Gen five in your 2021 just to p—- you off.😀😀
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