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03-02-2021, 07:55 AM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 313
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Does Entegra discourage air pressure winterization?
I believe I've read that some Entegra owners use air pressure but I can't find any procedures for that in the manual. Do you use air pressure? Any cautions or issues?
I've always used antifreeze but I'm sick of trying to get it out of the system when we hit the road. I'm thinking about using air, and thoughts?
__________________
Fleetwood Terra, Airstream Land Yacht, Tiffen Pheaton, American Eagle, Gulf Stream Friendship, Beaver patriot Thunder, Forest River Charleston, "In-country" 1971-72
2015 Entegra Anthem 42RBQ
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03-02-2021, 08:48 AM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Cypress, Tx.
Posts: 1,143
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The problem with air is some people complain that they had used air to blow out the lines but some water is left in a line and to breaks at that location.
When I use air I use no more then 25psi, and spend a lot of time going around to each faucet or connection to drain the water. Refrigerators, washers, and dishwashers are the hard items to remove water from.
I am not sure what grade of Pex Entregra is using but Pex can take freezing without damaging any piping. Since Texas has just had it's first major freeze in 11 years there have been a lot of pipes broken. I have not heard of any with Pex that had any break.
__________________
2014 Foretravel IH45
Houston (Cypress), TX.
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03-02-2021, 08:56 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Green Valley, AZ
Posts: 1,735
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My understanding is that the Aqua Hot may not fully drain using compressed air, and the low point(s) in the tube may retain water and subsequently break when frozen.
__________________
Stew and Diane (and Marco)
2018 Entegra Cornerstone 45X
Formerly: 2015 Entegra Cornerstone 45B, 2013 Entegra Aspire DEQ IFS, 2004 DSDP; all sold
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03-02-2021, 10:01 AM
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#4
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Member
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 98
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It shouldn't be that difficult to get the antifreeze out of the system after, just run the taps a bit. You aren't by chance getting antifreeze in your freshwater tank are you? With air, pretty difficult to be sure your fridge, dishwasher, washing machine, and aquahot don't have any pools left in them. And you have to put antifreeze down the drains anyway, easiest to do it through the supply lines.
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03-02-2021, 10:25 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 442
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Using air requires specialized equipment that not everybody has (e.g. compressor and fittings), and it's a little more error-prone (blowing apart lines, or failing to blow out all the water).
RV antifreeze, by contrast, is widely available and cheap, and, while you can still screw up winterizing with it, it's easier to do properly.
PEX can handle freezing, at least better than copper, but the valves and other fittings can't. And neither can your water pump, macerator, washer, fridge, dishwasher, etc. That is why I use RV antifreeze too. I'm just not confident that 25-30psi is enough to blow out all the water that pools in there.
For what it's worth, in Georgia I used only air. Now that I live in New Hampshire, I use both. In my opinion, RV antifreeze is faster and easier as long as you have a helper to walk around inside while you manage the winterizing tube (those jugs drain fast).
__________________
2019 Entegra Reatta 39BH
2018 Winnebago Minnie Plus 27BHSS, "Raspberry" (retired)
2017 Ford F-150
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03-02-2021, 10:36 AM
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#6
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Member
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schad
In my opinion, RV antifreeze is faster and easier as long as you have a helper to walk around inside while you manage the winterizing tube (those jugs drain fast).
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Yes, if you are doing it alone, empty the jugs into a 5 gal pail first.
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03-02-2021, 10:42 AM
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#7
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Member
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwaynesmith
Yes, if you are doing it alone, empty the jugs into a 5 gal pail first.
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Or, buy a 1 gal jug of concentrate (Camco for example) and just fill the rest of the 5 gal pail with water from your fresh water tank before you drain it. Also from New Hampshire.
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03-02-2021, 10:53 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcosdad
My understanding is that the Aqua Hot may not fully drain using compressed air, and the low point(s) in the tube may retain water and subsequently break when frozen.
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From the Aqua-Hot 450D Owner's Manual:
Winterization:
When it’s time to store a motor home for the winter months or when freezing temperatures are expected, it’s crucial to properly winterize the Aqua-Hot to avoid serious damage, requiring a complete system replacement not covered under the Aqua-Hot Limited Warranty Statement. The process of winterization consists of completely draining the domestic water from the system and pumping RV winterization antifreeze through to flush out the system.
Take care,
Stu
__________________
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned."
2018 Anthem 42DEQ
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03-02-2021, 11:35 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Highland NY
Posts: 3,905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcosdad
My understanding is that the Aqua Hot may not fully drain using compressed air, and the low point(s) in the tube may retain water and subsequently break when frozen.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schad
Using air requires specialized equipment that not everybody has (e.g. compressor and fittings), and it's a little more error-prone (blowing apart lines, or failing to blow out all the water).
RV antifreeze, by contrast, is widely available and cheap, and, while you can still screw up winterizing with it, it's easier to do properly.
PEX can handle freezing, at least better than copper, but the valves and other fittings can't. And neither can your water pump, macerator, washer, fridge, dishwasher, etc. That is why I use RV antifreeze too. I'm just not confident that 25-30psi is enough to blow out all the water that pools in there.
For what it's worth, in Georgia I used only air. Now that I live in New Hampshire, I use both. In my opinion, RV antifreeze is faster and easier as long as you have a helper to walk around inside while you manage the winterizing tube (those jugs drain fast).
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I have used air on all 4 of my coaches in NY state. Yes you need a compressor and air fitting. But over time they pay for themselves. You can get get a pancake compressor and air fitting for around $120.
The trick is making sure you blow out every line multiple times. including and especially the low point drains. When I do it, I open each faucet and LP drain one by one, and redundantly. I make several passes. I also run the DW and washer on rinse once or twice. Then I return to the LP lines again. The fridge gets the same treatment. The process takes about an hour+. 4 winters have passed with no issues and non of the nasty smell or taste from the AF. Then just pour some AF into the traps.
I do believe Entegra advises against using air because of the AH as another poster has suggested. It's a valid point. YMMV
__________________
Bruce, Lisa and the pups, Charlie, Opie and Rebel
2021 Cornerstone Y Azure
2018 Anthem, Victory Blue Sold, 2019 Ram Laramie 1500
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03-02-2021, 03:00 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Yakima, WA
Posts: 1,015
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I pay a local dealer to blow out the lines. He adds antifreeze to the traps and drains. He also winterizes my aqua hot. Price is usually around $150.00 Did I mention he hates doing aqua hots but does ours as a favor. I suspect he got burned once. Never had a problem with either of our Entegra’s or our first coach, a Berkshire.
__________________
Dan and Pam-Natalie-GSD's Sofi & Lindee
2021 Cornerstone 45 B
2018 Cornerstone 45 W (sold)
2020 Chevy Tahoe, etrailer XHD 10500 tow bar, Demco SMI AirForce 1.
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03-03-2021, 06:54 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 1,004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schad
Using air requires specialized equipment that not everybody has (e.g. compressor and fittings), and it's a little more error-prone (blowing apart lines, or failing to blow out all the water).
RV antifreeze, by contrast, is widely available and cheap, and, while you can still screw up winterizing with it, it's easier to do properly.
PEX can handle freezing, at least better than copper, but the valves and other fittings can't. And neither can your water pump, macerator, washer, fridge, dishwasher, etc. That is why I use RV antifreeze too. I'm just not confident that 25-30psi is enough to blow out all the water that pools in there.
For what it's worth, in Georgia I used only air. Now that I live in New Hampshire, I use both. In my opinion, RV antifreeze is faster and easier as long as you have a helper to walk around inside while you manage the winterizing tube (those jugs drain fast).
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The jugs do drain fast. I poor five gallons into a five gallon pail. Saves a lot of trips in and out of coach when doing it yourself.
__________________
Tigerfan1
2016 DSDP 4369, Freightliner Chassis, AF One brake system, 2016 Chevy Equinox
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03-03-2021, 07:50 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Pine, CO
Posts: 766
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26 feet of copper coiled around the burn chamber inside the Aquahot. That’s why Aquahot recommends using RV Antifeeeze. The fear is that you may not get all the water out using air. If you’ve done it, and it works, that’s great. In Colorado where the temps can easily be below zero, I choose to use RV antifreeze, as I’m not so confident in doing the air method myself. At below 0 temps, a small mistake is now a costly mistake.
Oh, if you crack the coil inside the Aquahot, it’s a $10k mistake. Antifreeze is cheap and I have a process that gets the antifreeze out of the lines to my liking.
Cheers
__________________
Rusty & Pam
2012 Entegra Aspire RBQ
2007 Harley Street Glide
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03-03-2021, 07:50 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Highland NY
Posts: 3,905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seeg
I pay a local dealer to blow out the lines. He adds antifreeze to the traps and drains. He also winterizes my aqua hot. Price is usually around $150.00 Did I mention he hates doing aqua hots but does ours as a favor. I suspect he got burned once. Never had a problem with either of our Entegra’s or our first coach, a Berkshire.
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I know there is a way to isolate the AH with respect to anti freeze. I just don't recall how it's done.
__________________
Bruce, Lisa and the pups, Charlie, Opie and Rebel
2021 Cornerstone Y Azure
2018 Anthem, Victory Blue Sold, 2019 Ram Laramie 1500
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03-03-2021, 08:14 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 442
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwaynesmith
Yes, if you are doing it alone, empty the jugs into a 5 gal pail first.
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For others doing this, check the pail after the first or second fixture. I think I needed more than 5 gallons.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddy110
The trick is making sure you blow out every line multiple times. including and especially the low point drains. [...] The process takes about an hour+. [emphasis added]
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That's why I used antifreeze. With DW helping, it was about 15 minutes.
We clean/sanitize the fresh water system in spring regardless, just as a matter of policy, so the extra steps to flush out the antifreeze aren't a problem for us.
__________________
2019 Entegra Reatta 39BH
2018 Winnebago Minnie Plus 27BHSS, "Raspberry" (retired)
2017 Ford F-150
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