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Old 07-10-2022, 06:12 AM   #85
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NowGo,
So the brake controller needs a signal from the stop light switch to apply the trailer brakes and the fact the engine brake sends this signal also is the problem.

How about installing another brake pressure switch and sending its signal to the brake controller. That way the brake controller would only apply the trailer brakes when the service brakes were apply.
Spartan’s brakes light switch is located on the outside fire wall opposite the brakes pedal, you probably know this.
Space is pretty limited in there perhaps the switch could be located here if you could tap into delivery side of the pressure switch. As you know there are two pressure switch, I believe one for the front and rear brakes.
12 volt power would be available in this area also.

Safe travels there in BC.

Richard
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Old 07-10-2022, 10:03 AM   #86
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Or just leave it the hell alone and let the brake lights come on a little on the way down the hill.......... -- What is the problem?

Gary
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Old 07-10-2022, 10:18 AM   #87
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Or just leave it the hell alone and let the brake lights come on a little on the way down the hill.......... -- What is the problem?

Gary
For the OP it is applying his trailer brakes which he is trying to avoid going down a long grade.
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Old 07-10-2022, 10:20 AM   #88
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Or just leave it the hell alone and let the brake lights come on a little on the way down the hill.......... -- What is the problem?

Gary
Not that simple Gary.Jones.

This is a significant matter for anyone travelling down long/mountainous grades. I totally agree that is to each his own but we don't want folks reading this thread to be thinking this is only about brake lights coming on "a little" (not sure what that means).

If you like please see page 48 of this thread for my logic. You can agree or disagree with the logic but there are some realities in that post.

Anyway, not to argue but I believe it is important for folks to understand the full implications.

Thanks for engaging Gary.Jones.
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Old 07-10-2022, 10:49 AM   #89
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Gary you might look at this the same way as you felt you needed additional turn signal lights on the side of your coach.

I sure some would say you don’t need those, but the important part “you” did.

NowGo lives in Alberta and I’m sure he has many mountain passes to go over so he feels a need for this mod.

Alway appreciate your post Gary.

Richard
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Old 07-10-2022, 11:09 AM   #90
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Gary you might look at this the same way as you felt you needed additional turn signal lights on the side of your coach.

I sure some would say you don’t need those, but the important part “you” did.

NowGo lives in Alberta and I’m sure he has many mountain passes to go over so he feels a need for this mod.

Alway appreciate your post Gary.

Richard
Thanks for your post Gasman 2.

I a previous post I gave a shout out to both Gary.Jones and yourself for being a big part of the signal light resolution.

As does Gary.Jones I feel this is very important.

I now have mid point and front side signal lights, as well as my mirror lights also functioning as signal lights, thanks to you folks and the other posters who contributed.

Very much appreciated.
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Old 07-10-2022, 01:51 PM   #91
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Or just leave it the hell alone and let the brake lights come on a little on the way down the hill.......... -- What is the problem?

Gary
Not only the trailer brake problem Gary, I have found 2 brake light socket's/bulb base that were starting to melt due to those HOT bulbs being on so long on long grades using the engine brake.........
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Old 07-10-2022, 06:28 PM   #92
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Not only the trailer brake problem Gary, I have found 2 brake light socket's/bulb base that were starting to melt due to those HOT bulbs being on so long on long grades using the engine brake.........
Check to be sure the correct bulbs are in them. There are multiple bulbs that will fit most sockets, and each has a different wattage. A high-wattage bulb in a lower-wattage socket might well melt it.
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Old 07-11-2022, 12:21 AM   #93
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But the proper size bulb should not harm any socket....... If it does, there is something wrong.

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Old 07-11-2022, 07:13 AM   #94
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But the proper size bulb should not harm any socket....... If it does, there is something wrong.

Gary
Sorry, but this is not correct. Every fixture has a maximum rated wattage. The number on the bulb matters. There are various bulbs that physically fit various automotive sockets, and for incandescent bulbs (with filaments) they can use markedly different amounts of power. I must admit that I didn't realize this, either, until I put a handy spare higher-wattage brake light bulb into a taillight socket (IIRC) and melted the lens, also deforming the fixture behind it. This was a long time ago, but it was an expensive lesson.

You can put a low-wattage bulb in a high-wattage fixture if it fits without hurting anything, but it won't be as bright as it's supposed to be. This isn't good either, but can be better than nothing until you can get the right bulb. But you should *never* go the other way.

This is probably less important with LEDs, which do not get nearly as hot as incandescent bulbs, but even then you should use the right ones. For example, you don't want to blind people with your taillights or have your brake lights too dim to notice quickly.
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Old 07-11-2022, 08:59 AM   #95
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What precisely in my comment immediately above led you to believe that I somehow was arguing to stick any size bulb into any socket???????????????????

I'd love tp know.... Feel free to quote !

Gary
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Old 07-11-2022, 09:18 AM   #96
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What precisely in my comment immediately above led you to believe that I somehow was arguing to stick any size bulb into any socket???????????????????

I'd love tp know.... Feel free to quote !

Gary
I already included the quote in my post, right at the top. It's not just size. It's power rating too. Or did you mean "size" to mean "wattage"? They're not the same. You might know that, or have meant "size" to represent both form factor and wattage, but it could be read both ways and others might not read it the way you meant it. Sorry if I misinterpreted your intent.
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Old 07-15-2022, 04:18 PM   #97
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For those of us who don't drive 18-wheelers, could somebody explain some of the terms being used here?

What, exactly, is a "Jake brake" and how does it differ from an "engine brake"?

In my little Ford E450 6-speed, I notice that I can't free-wheel downhill when the Tow/Haul button is engaged. I believe that is because overdrive is disabled and the wheels are pushing the engine in 6th gear. I can do the same thing, but much slower, by shifting into 4th. That is as close as I will get to an "engine brake". AFAIK, my brake lights don't illuminate in this condition.

If I'm "engine braking" with my tow dolly or boat trailer, the taillights don't come on when the surge brakes activate. How is that any different from what the OP is trying to accomplish?
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Old 07-15-2022, 07:15 PM   #98
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For those of us who don't drive 18-wheelers, could somebody explain some of the terms being used here?

What, exactly, is a "Jake brake" and how does it differ from an "engine brake"?

In my little Ford E450 6-speed, I notice that I can't free-wheel downhill when the Tow/Haul button is engaged. I believe that is because overdrive is disabled and the wheels are pushing the engine in 6th gear. I can do the same thing, but much slower, by shifting into 4th. That is as close as I will get to an "engine brake". AFAIK, my brake lights don't illuminate in this condition.

If I'm "engine braking" with my tow dolly or boat trailer, the taillights don't come on when the surge brakes activate. How is that any different from what the OP is trying to accomplish?
Cummins invented the engine compression brake and a company named Jacobs was the first to manufacture them. They still make them. Basically, the valve timing is changed so that the pistons do work to compress air that's released just before top center. That work is used to slow the vehicle through the transmission. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compre...e_engine_brake

Some coaches, like ours, illuminate the brake lights when the engine brake is engaged. The OP wants to not have this happen, because it activates the brakes on his trailer via the brake controller. This partially negates the benefit of the engine brake for speed control when it's sufficient by itself, and heats up and wears the trailer brakes when they are not needed to control the speed of the tow vehicle and trailer. The engine (jake) brake is usually plenty effective for speed control all by itself even with a trailer or (in our case) a toad.

The OP wants to have the trailer brake lights (and thus the trailer brakes) come on only when he uses the service brakes by pressing on the brake pedal, which I think is perfectly reasonable.

Hope this helps...
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