Engine Size for New Class A DP

[PrincessLea]

I’m finally moving up to a class A this month. It is between the 2021 Anthem 44F and Cornerstone 45F. I live in the mountains at 7500ft and if I go east or west, I’m doing a lot of steep passes. I’m towing an F 150 with a golf cart in the bed (6500 lbs). My question - is the 450 of the Anthem enough to pull up these mountains without being the person in the truck lane with hazards on? In my current set up I can run up the mountain at 65 and if I get slowed down by trucks, I have enough torque so I can immediately get back up to speed. I would prefer to save the money from an Anthem to a Cornerstone (more toys to buy), so looking for advice from those that have had both the 450 and 605 and enjoy the mountain runs as much as I do. Thank you for your help.

[Rollin101]

Originally Posted by PrincessLea

I’m finally moving up to a class A this month. It is between the 2021 Anthem 44F and Cornerstone 45F. I live in the mountains at 7500ft and if I go east or west, I’m doing a lot of steep passes. I’m towing an F 150 with a golf cart in the bed (6500 lbs). My question - is the 450 of the Anthem enough to pull up these mountains without being the person in the truck lane with hazards on? In my current set up I can run up the mountain at 65 and if I get slowed down by trucks, I have enough torque so I can immediately get back up to speed. I would prefer to save the money from an Anthem to a Cornerstone (more toys to buy), so looking for advice from those that have had both the 450 and 605 and enjoy the mountain runs as much as I do. Thank you for your help.

Neither one of the above will go up the mountains at 65mph. I’ve owned both and been in and over the Rockies and they won’t go up them at 65 mph maybe at 45 mph. I’ve had three X15’s and none of them would do what you’re talking about. Maybe put the X15 in a go cart it’ll do 65 over the mountains otherwise you better keep what you’ve got.

[PrincessLea]

Originally Posted by Rollin101

Neither one of the above will go up the mountains at 65mph. I’ve owned both and been in and over the Rockies and they won’t go up them at 65 mph maybe at 45 mph. I’ve had three X15’s and none of them would do what you’re talking about. Maybe put the X15 in a go cart it’ll do 65 over the mountains otherwise you better keep what you’ve got.

Thank you for the quick reply. Not what I wanted to hear but great to know. I see you are in a new Cornerstone towing a Dodge. How big of a difference going over the Rockies with your new CS vs the previous coach that had a 450? I’m sure you love your new CS and don’t want to go back.

[GeezerViz]

Is going up hill fast a huge priority? I have the 450 towing 4500lbs and I go uphill faster than some trucks and slower than others. Living in WA I'm also surrounded by mountains. Never had to turn on the flashers but I also just bought a Jeep Grand Cherokee that I haven't towed yet and has a GVWR around 6500, so my speed might change. Of all the things I worry about, speed uphill is way down the list.

[brobox]

I lived Denver for 20 years, owned a lot of RV's, none which would do 65 on the passes. What do you currently own?
My Anthem would pull the hills OK, not the last one in line.
The Cornerstone, does have the power for the extra weight you plan on carrying, but more important is the 3 stage jake brake going down the other side vs the the two stage on the Anthem.
I purchase the Cornerstone, not so much for the power, but the heavier chassis and the ride.

[PrincessLea]

Originally Posted by brobox

I lived Denver for 20 years, owned a lot of RV's, none which would do 65 on the passes. What do you currently own?
My Anthem would pull the hills OK, not the last one in line.
The Cornerstone, does have the power for the extra weight you plan on carrying, but more important is the 3 stage jake brake going down the other side vs the the two stage on the Anthem.
I purchase the Cornerstone, not so much for the power, but the heavier chassis and the ride.

This makes sense. My original post was really meant to illicit a response of the difference between the drivetrains between the two. It isn’t so much about speed but I wanted to get my personality out there so others that have owned both would hopefully help me understand why they upgraded. I have often found myself spending a lot of money for “bigger is better” only to realize that my excitement overrode my ability to curtail my spending. I’m currently in a 41 foot 5th wheel with a new F 450 towing.

[Hayman]

Never had a 600 but have traveled w/600 owners and surprised them with keeping up with them under “ most “ situations the exception being on climbing grades if momentum is lost the 450 doesn’t have enough torque to regain speed. Example: hill climbing , catch up to a semi and can’t get out in the passing lane due to traffic so slow to trucks speed and then lane frees up you WILL NOT be able to pass !

If that’s your concern you’ll need the 605 but depending on the grade and amount of opening I’m not sure you’d get past. I’ve always felt it’s about the journey not the speed and we’ve put 50K on our Anthem with several long trips including steep western climbs, Canada, Rockies , Alaska and we got there and back.

The cost between the 450 Anthem to the 605 Cornerstone as you know is substantial and you’re the one footing the bill so I would suggest going to a dealer and drive both.

[Rollin101]

The 450’s were in two Anthems. They were probably 10-15 mph slower on steep mountain grades, but they always got there.
The Cornerstone with the X15 will pass any loaded truck in the hills/mountains, but it will not do 65 mph over them. We’re in Branson Mo. now and even some of these Ozark mountains will pull it down into the 45-50 mph range for a short distance.

[DirtRider]

Maybe you need a massive downsize? Everyone laughs at the little class C's. But my 305hp is maybe 200hp in the mountains. My fully loaded weight (with a trailer pulling a UTV and a motorcycle) is <15000 lb. So I'm at 75 lbs/HP. So, a little better weight/HP rating than that 605hp Cornerstone, assuming a 42,000# coach and a 6,000 lb toad.

I'm sure this is just what everyone in this thread wants to hear. [ducks]

[Gary.Jones]

...Lea

You gotta remember that my Cornerstone weighs in at 50,000# (25 tons). The Cummins X-15 engine is a true beast. And there is no doubt that I will climb any mountain faster and easier than any loaded semi in virtually any situation that I encounter. It also is clearly 10 mph faster on virtually any long haul hill than my 450 ISL was in my Anthem.

Now, you can do the world anyway you want, but you're not going to climb a Colorado mountain pass ascent at 65 mph in a motorcoach and why would you want to?? Even living in the mountains, you are not likely to spend more than 2-3% of your overall driving time on those ascents (these things will go down a hill at 65, but you are a fool to do it.... -- )

You are driving a beast when you own one of these things and it simply is not going to compete with a Ford 150 with a big V8 in it. And a lot depends on what speed you are doing at the bottom of the grade....If you are already safely doing 65 at the base hill, you will still be doing a nice clip at the top, but if you start out on an on ramp at 35, you will be climbing the whole hill a whole lot slower with either engine. I was visiting a small town north of Phoenix and came out of the town and onto the on ramp without knowing that a very long climb was ahead of me and I dogged it getting up to speed. Then I rounded the corner and saw the hill in front of me and tromped the pedal to the floor with this ISX-605 behind me, and I was amazed how slow it climbed and accelerated up that hill. Now if I was doing 65 when I hit the bottom of the same hill, I would have climbed it at 50 lets say and smartly passed any truck encountered.

Remember, these are very big heavy rigs... If you climb everything encountered at 45, you should be very happy. Speed is not what Class A motorcoaching is all about... You've got the wrong expectation!

Gary

[Busskipper]

Originally Posted by PrincessLea

I’m finally moving up to a class A this month. It is between the 2021 Anthem 44F and Cornerstone 45F. I live in the mountains at 7500ft and if I go east or west, I’m doing a lot of steep passes. I’m towing an F 150 with a golf cart in the bed (6500 lbs). My question - is the 450 of the Anthem enough to pull up these mountains without being the person in the truck lane with hazards on? In my current set up I can run up the mountain at 65 and if I get slowed down by trucks, I have enough torque so I can immediately get back up to speed. I would prefer to save the money from an Anthem to a Cornerstone (more toys to buy), so looking for advice from those that have had both the 450 and 605 and enjoy the mountain runs as much as I do. Thank you for your help.

Interesting dilemma - 16 years ago when we had our Coach built by the Original Entegra company - Travel Supreme - they wanted to put a new 600 hp engine in it - I had to pay extra to have the Coach put on the MM chassis with the “Smaller” 400 engine - I pull a GX470 - 5,500 #’s - and have made it over every Pass in Colorado with no issue.

As has been said you will not go over the passes at 65 no matter what engine you have - I was a heavy equipment/truck contractor in my past life we hauled every day all day with 237 Mack engines - yes 65,000 pounds to 150,000 pounds and we did fine - so IMHO - go for the 450 - keep some money in your pocket and go See the country not race by it.

We have also found that we Pass a lot of fuel stations that the big engine are needing to stop at - - $$$ - that also helps make up the time they went up that 5 miles of mountain at 10 miles per hour faster -

IMHO the focus needs to be on the Floorplan more than the big engine.

JMHO,

[DebbieMH]

If you are used to going up mountains at 65 mph ...you may not be happy with either the Anthem or Cornerstone. But, if you go with an Anthem, I'm sure you will not be happy. I'm happy with my Anthem, but I have no interest in going up mountains at 65 mph. I'm content with getting to my destination in one piece, not stressed and enjoying the scenery on the way up. Curious why you want to change to a motorhome since you have a "new F450"? You probably have more living space in your 41 ft 5th wheel ... less maintenance, etc. 5th wheels and motorhomes are two different species.

[Rollin101]

Someone mentioned fuel economy above. I’ve owned a 400, two 450’s and the X15 and I don’t see a half mile difference in any of them. In decent driving mine all got between 7 and 8.5. DEF usage on the big engine is a different story it will use a gallon of DEF appropriately 175 miles while the 450 will go 350 on a gallon. That’s the biggest difference I see other than the X15 holds 50-52 quarts of oil compared to 25-26 for the 450.

[Gary.Jones]

Yes, lots more oil...... if you are gonna change the oil in that engine, you need a really LARGE oil catch reservoir.... I prefer to let that chore be done by Speedco.

Gary