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Old 12-14-2016, 03:43 PM   #15
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I suggest you guys put your feelings in writing to Bob Martin at Thorindustries.
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Old 12-14-2016, 04:25 PM   #16
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well...first of all, that is what I'm suggesting. I certainly don't feel sorry for the other dealers. But you have to recognize that Entegra needs two things to happen...happy owners and happy dealers, not necessarily in any order. That depends on your perspective.

Personally, I'd like to see all the dealers approach the business similarly to NIRVC. A few have tried, perhaps not to the same degree. I would would also surmise that any dealer, including NIRVC, approaching the business with support to rallies and gatherings HAS to factor that into their pricing. The only difference with NIRVC as their business model views sales as a gateway to service and storage. This Nisan important differentiation (I think it is useful to say "customer for life" but that really is simply an outcome out of their business model which centers on storage, that in turn creates service opportunities. Sales feeds both. And BTW, this model is not my speculation). Not so much the other dealers.
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Old 12-14-2016, 04:29 PM   #17
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I am also reminded that Lazy Days, Tampa, at one time valued their sales as a stream to service...to the point that they put a LOUDLY touted Crown Club that went along with mid-an high level coaches. That was in 2013/4. When RV business took off big time a couple years after the 2008/09 recession, and came into full swing in 2013....and there are a lot of folks who bought into this and touted it on this forum...well, how has that worked out in 2014-2017. I hear very few touting Crown Club and Lazy Days (and it had a price in coach pricing then as it does now). They can't service their sales and deliveries worth a darn.

BTW, some have alluded to same with NIRVC lately.
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Old 12-14-2016, 06:25 PM   #18
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I am also reminded that Lazy Days, Tampa, at one time valued their sales as a stream to service...to the point that they put a LOUDLY touted Crown Club that went along with mid-an high level coaches. That was in 2013/4. When RV business took off big time a couple years after the 2008/09 recession, and came into full swing in 2013....and there are a lot of folks who bought into this and touted it on this forum...well, how has that worked out in 2014-2017. I hear very few touting Crown Club and Lazy Days (and it had a price in coach pricing then as it does now). They can't service their sales and deliveries worth a darn.

BTW, some have alluded to same with NIRVC lately.
Your last two posts are on target with one caveat that I will get to. LD let me down totally after the sale. It is also not my speculation about the NIRVC sales model - they are totally customer focused and want LT relationships.

I am not sure who is suggesting that NIRVC is having problems with service other than those who - like me - see that Jayco/Entegra is holding up the parts/warranty cycle.

In fact we met at least one couple who bought elsewhere but were taken under NIRVC's wing. Their next coach will be bought from NIRVC but more importantly from NIRVC's POV - they are storage and service customers
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Old 12-14-2016, 06:28 PM   #19
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Dave that statement is 200% correct. I fell victim to Lazy Days over sell on service and it's worse today. I found out the hard way, dealers can run out of real estate and properly trained technicians to be able to service large amounts of sales.
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Old 12-14-2016, 06:38 PM   #20
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Emerson, Don't get me wrong...what I saw was a comment within w larger thread and concerned availability of service at NIRVC...it certainly has to be a out on the periphery the norm. My point was, and I believe this was the case with Lazy Days (based upon what I read here), that a side that serves to increase sales dramatically also creates challenges with the increased demands of warrantee service, which at the dealer level I don't believe Entegra has worked out kinks that create delays with approvals and delivery of OEM parts. JMHO
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Old 12-14-2016, 07:06 PM   #21
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Dave, I spent about 45 minutes with Brett from NIRVC in Dallas about three weeks ago. My take away is that he is focusing on service first, storage second and sales third. His mantra was consistent. Their service business is growing, only held back by the availability of qualified techs.

I asked specifically about how they handle folks that didn't buy from them. His answer was that they try to have enough service capacity to handle someone that shows up with an issue while on the road. Of course there needs to be some common sense. Burned out interior bulbs probably doesn't have the priority of a driving safety issue. But his response was about taking care of customers, through service, whether they buy from NIRVC (of course they would like you to buy from them) or you have a service issue while you are on the road.

They really are working to set a new level of customer satisfaction through a total RV customer focused model.
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Old 12-14-2016, 07:21 PM   #22
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I agree with both of you - Gary and Dave. My conversations with various folks - NIRVC and their customers - at least to me show their commitment to their strategy. I also agree that Entegra is a hindrance to NIRVC's strategy because of the parts/warranty issues. Those issues don't bother many other dealers since they are sales volume focused and not customer focused.

As you said - JMHO
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Old 12-14-2016, 09:42 PM   #23
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After reading the last several posts and thinking about it for a couple of days, I think it would be good if we reviewed the history of Rallies and Fests and clear up some perceptions. Please understand, this is from my history with Entegras, Tadd, Brett, NIRVC, fests and other dealers and is NOT directed at any posts or posters on this forum, only an attempt to put it all in perspective.

First, the fests were and are an idea and invention of Brett Davis and NIRVC, they have been hosting customer appreciation rallies since they they first openned their doors for business, they are part of the business plan and model that the business was founded on. Their primary interest is in service and getting a customer for life. A part of that process is selling coaches, establishing a relationship with coach owners and getting them in the door to try the service experience. They want the sales staff to sell the customer the first coach, then service and the rest of the entire organization to provide such a positive experience that the customer will keep returning as long as he enjoys the rv lifestyle, contrary to many dealers in the industry that must spend huge amounts on advertising to keep selling one coach to a customer and then move on to the next customer. I am almost positive that I was present when the fests were born. I was at the ECOA rally at Kerrville in May of 2014. I knew Tadd Jenkins and he knew that I wanted to meet Brett Davis because of what I had heard about his business model and his customer service. Tadd and Brett were visiting after a break out session at the rally and Tadd motioned me over. He introduced me to Brett and we had a long visit. In the course of the conversation Tadd asked how can we get Country Coach and other owners converted to Entegra? Brett immediately responded with rallies, we are supplying techs to this rally (ECOA rally) at no charge for labor. We want to establish a relationship with owners and show them the quality of work that we offer. Tadd then says, I am in, I want to be one of your sponsors! My point being that these fests are a NIRVC function with other vendors signing on as sponsors. The fests will continue, if Entegra chooses to drop sponsorship NIRVC will replace them with other sponsors and continue to offer these high quality events to coach owners . Brett has designed the model to be the owners pay 1/3 of the cost, the sponsors pay 2/3 of the costs with NIRVC being the largest sponsor plus all of their costs of providing techs (they always provide free labor with the owner paying only for the parts). This, as has been pointed out is built into the cost we pay for coaches (the NIRVC part) BUT it is figured as marketing costs. Instead of spending a lot of money on internet web sites, magazines, radio, cable TV, newspapers ads and other advertising venues their marketing dollars are spent on the fests. Because of this 1/3-2/3 formula the fests will never make money, if more sponsors are obtained the cost for each sponsor will go down but the formula between owners and sponsors will remain the same. There is probably less marketing expense with this model than the traditional model so our cost to buy a coach does not go up because of the fests. With the service model they believe if they do the service right, an owner will keep coming to them and that repeat business will result in selling several coaches to an owner over his rv lifetime without constantly having to find new buyers because 1. they find out you overcharged them for their first coach or 2. they could not get quality service when they had issues. All of these dealers crying that NIRVC is selling to low or below cost 1. refuse to accept there is level pricing from Entegra to all their dealers, (all dealers pay Entegra the same price for coaches ordered)2. are spending much more on marketing per unit, 3. are not turing their inventory fast enough, 4. might just get bigger margins because they are focused only on the sale of coaches to turn a profit, or 5. they just may be more greedy than NIRVC. Any dealer that so chooses can adopt this model and sponsor rallies to get owners together and establish a relationship with them, therefore I do not understand why they would think the current fests are unfair to them. I know Entegra holds a couple of rallies per year also. The first of those was the ribbon cutting when the new plant was dedicated and the 2016s were introduced. Entegra sent an email out to all of their dealers (as per Tadd Jenkins) asking them to send techs so all attendees could get issues fixed while at the ribbon cutting. NIRVC was the ONLY dealer to follow through and send techs and tools to assist with this event, where were all the other dealers then? NIRVC did not get preferential treatment at that event, they did Entegra a favor by sending techs when asked for help. Another important point at our house, NIRVC fests are unlike other rallies we have attended. They include much catered food, great entertainment, service of our coaches and coach care seminars conducted by experts in servicing and maintaining our coaches, they are much more valuable to us than the typical bingo and pot luck rallies, not that there is not a need for both. They are events where we look forward to seeing old friends, meeting new ones, and socializing at a very nice rv park in a location with several interesting things to do and places to see.

As usual ALL JMHO


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Old 12-14-2016, 10:03 PM   #24
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Gene,

I'll only take exception to your points WRT rallies; only because credit is due to a very nice couple. The first rally, and the second, were organized by by a gentleman and lady who purchased their Anthem about the same time as Beth and I. Tom and Regina, of then Phoenix, and of Oregon of late, originated the Entegra "Fest" rallies with the first Summerfest in Hearthside Grove in Michigan, and the second, at Paso Robles in CA. Both events were thoroughly planned out, with excursions/activities, and some catered meals (or meals as a group at venues). Each of the sites were thoroughly evaluated in person by these two folks prior to putting out the flier. Each was attended by over 50 coaches (and in 2103/2014 this represented approx 20% of the total coaches having been produced at that time). They were not done under the ECOA auspices, because Tom didn't want to have to require membership in FMCA to attend. Since then Pat/ECOA has worked diligently to assure that all that buy an Entegra have a ECOA membership.

These were OUTSTANDING events, as I would expect any that attended to agree; after the second, Entegra (and Tadd Jenkins) indicated that future "Fests" would be sponsored by Entegra. And that has morphed into the current fests.

I relay this, because in our Entegra history, Tom and Regina deserve the credit for starting in motion the gatherings that we have today. They don't RV any more. Don't know if Tom still reads the iRV2 forum; he used to be very active. He also intro'd some of us to the game "Right-Center-Left". I miss both of them at rallies today, and thank them for the start.

I think it has been very valuable for Entegra to pick up the assistance from NIRVC to hold the "seasonal" rallies as Brett has done; as any know, it takes more than one person to put these things together. I know at least one other dealer has tried to pick up the challenge of sponsoring these events...so let's not give up on the other dealerships. Otherwise, I agree to much of what you have offered. JMHO
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Old 12-14-2016, 10:14 PM   #25
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MISTY have you considered Mr Bontrager may be shy some ahmish are. Or maybe hes tired of people who are brown nosing hm or just plain jealous now that hes holdin a half a billion. Clams there is more than meets the eye with successful business men such as Mr Bontrager. Just Saying
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Old 12-14-2016, 10:20 PM   #26
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Thanks Dave, Tom and Regina do and should get all the credit for the first big Entegra rallies that serve as the forerunners to what we now enjoy. I do however, respectively disagree that NIRVC is the assistant here. Entegra has assisted NIRVC by agreeing to pickup some of the sponsorship expenses. And yes, a couple of dealers have been exploring this experience for owners and I sincerely hope many more will embrace this concept and business model. For us as owners, the more the better and we and the industry will profit from it. All JMHO


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Old 12-15-2016, 04:59 AM   #27
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Just anther historical correction: Lazydays Crown Club was opened in 2003, not 2013. I know because I was at the grand opening with my then new 2003 Beaver purchased from LD. At that time, LD was using the "Customer for Life" slogan. Too bad they did not back it up with good service like NIRV apparently does.
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Old 12-15-2016, 05:27 AM   #28
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Excellent post Gene. I have had the flip side experience with Lazy Days and "their" rallies.....more like attending a "free time share" weekend with no techs on hand.....Step over here to book for a paid service appointment.

From what I have seen posted, NIRVC has an excellent business plan. I hope they do not exceed the real estate and technicians to be able to give the fantastic service they are now. Ride that wave as long as it's there. I can only speak from my LD experience, it was the best on the forum at the time.....look at it just 2 years later.
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