Entegra Anthem Switch to Lithium Problems

[SouthTX]

Originally Posted by LvnMyBestLif

New here too, and special thanks to all contributors on this post. And extra special thanks to Jeff / Glamisfam for blazing this trail, and living into the IRV2 mission. I’m two steps behind you, but headed down the same path - 2022 Anthem, purchased from NIRVC in Feb 2023, AGM battery challenges, and decided to go lithium. In fact, my frustrations with our batteries (and 10 - 15 hours daily generator run time) finally drove me to purchase two 12v 460Ah batteries just last week, and I’m eagerly awaiting delivery. The batteries have on board BMS, heating, and Bluetooth, and comes with CANBUS Comms that will talk directly to Victron - pretty cool. I was actually knee deep in mapping out an upgrade with a used Tesla battery, but these batteries are such a clean & elegant solution that I jumped in and purchased two.

I tried contacting Firefly about compatibility but got no reply. When I called Entegra I found that 2022 is a milestone year for Lithium compatibility. Ironically, that’s also when the Anthem downsized from two Magnum 3000W inverters, to just one. That said, this stuff is overwhelmingly complex, and it is definitely NOT a drop in “plug & play” project, so I’m grateful to you and the others in this string for sharing your knowledge and experiences.

Based on your posts, it sounds like I’ll need to do several things to get these Lithium batteries to work properly.

1. Make sure that VT Firefly is updated to 1.5.11 or later
2. Switch the charging to Lipo in Firefly
3. Buy Magnum Remote Controller to override the Firefly from reverting to custom
4. On the Magnum Inverter, move Firefly Comm cable from Remote Port to Network Port
5. Plug in Magnum Remote Controller
6. Add Li-BIM 225 (Lithium Battery Isolation Manager)
7. Change the BIM to Li model
8. Add Victron battery shunt (?)

I want to do all this as cost effectively, yet as smartly, as possible so I am hoping these components play well together. Also hoping that I don’t have to take on the added expense of swapping out to all new Victron components.

Lastly, Jeff there is a vid online that demonstrates charging / discharging discrepancies across batteries when cables are not exactly the same length. Not sure if that’s your issue, but may be worth a check. You are clearly well informed, and I’m just learning, so please don’t be offended if this is super obvious. Just trying to help.

Again, extra special thanks. I hope to get this all dine before Tampa RV Super Show in January. I’ll let you know how it all goes if you’re interested.

Brian

Hi Brian, and welcome to the Entegra forum. This is the most patient group of people I've ever met and they don't mind sharing their years of knowledge. I would have dumped my coach long ago if not for all the help I've received here.

It sounds like you're on the right track - go lithium and you'll never go back. Lithium batteries actually are less complex than FLA and only as difficult as you make it. KIS.

I was lucky in that my first exposure to lithium batteries was in converting my old fifth wheel and I had well engineered drawings to go by. The nice part of that install was that all the components were separate and I didn't have to worry about the VT or an integrated inverter/charger. as that - IMHO - is where things get complicated. My second exposure to lithium batteries was a professionally installed conversion that allowed me to see how the pros do it on a Class A. Keep in mind that mine is not a VT coach so again I could see how things worked without that complication. There were also a few things they didn't do that make me wonder how necessary they really are.

For me, the icing on the cake was that I was recently forced to convert from Magnum to Victron equipment. The learning curve was steep because of the way Victron supports their equipment, but I love it and think you will, too. I'm no expert, but I'll be glad to share what I've learned about lithium battery systems and the first thing I learned is they ain't like FLA batteries. They are much simpler so don't make them complicated.

[Turbojack]

Brian
Please keep us informed as to how your project goes.

Do check cable length, 1ft can cause a greater load on one cable vs the other when they are run in parallel.

[stevlar]

Bought a new 24 Entegra Ethos LI 20t from La Mesa RV San Diego. I have owned this for approx. 6 weeks, two of which was in their Service Dept. Nothing but issues with the Renogy lithium system. The worst manuals I have ever uncounted. Filled with high Tech information, that only an electrical engineer would understand. Unit will not charge from the extra Eng. alternator, will not charge fully on land line, Since having a complete electrical failure with the first intended use, it seems the battery may be compromised.
Called Jayco, told me I was doing something wrong, no help, even acted annoyed I even called, I guess they think they have a bullet proof product. Ha. La Mesa RV has yet to explain anything on the coach related to the lithium system.
This is becoming a 120 thousand dollar nightmare.

[Glamisfam]

Originally Posted by LvnMyBestLif

New here too, and special thanks to all contributors on this post. And extra special thanks to Jeff / Glamisfam for blazing this trail, and living into the IRV2 mission. I’m two steps behind you, but headed down the same path - 2022 Anthem, purchased from NIRVC in Feb 2023, AGM battery challenges, and decided to go lithium. In fact, my frustrations with our batteries (and 10 - 15 hours daily generator run time) finally drove me to purchase two 12v 460Ah batteries just last week, and I’m eagerly awaiting delivery. The batteries have on board BMS, heating, and Bluetooth, and comes with CANBUS Comms that will talk directly to Victron - pretty cool. I was actually knee deep in mapping out an upgrade with a used Tesla battery, but these batteries are such a clean & elegant solution that I jumped in and purchased two.

I tried contacting Firefly about compatibility but got no reply. When I called Entegra I found that 2022 is a milestone year for Lithium compatibility. Ironically, that’s also when the Anthem downsized from two Magnum 3000W inverters, to just one. That said, this stuff is overwhelmingly complex, and it is definitely NOT a drop in “plug & play” project, so I’m grateful to you and the others in this string for sharing your knowledge and experiences.

Based on your posts, it sounds like I’ll need to do several things to get these Lithium batteries to work properly.

1. Make sure that VT Firefly is updated to 1.5.11 or later
2. Switch the charging to Lipo in Firefly
3. Buy Magnum Remote Controller to override the Firefly from reverting to custom
4. On the Magnum Inverter, move Firefly Comm cable from Remote Port to Network Port
5. Plug in Magnum Remote Controller
6. Add Li-BIM 225 (Lithium Battery Isolation Manager)
7. Change the BIM to Li model
8. Add Victron battery shunt (?)

I want to do all this as cost effectively, yet as smartly, as possible so I am hoping these components play well together. Also hoping that I don’t have to take on the added expense of swapping out to all new Victron components.

Lastly, Jeff there is a vid online that demonstrates charging / discharging discrepancies across batteries when cables are not exactly the same length. Not sure if that’s your issue, but may be worth a check. You are clearly well informed, and I’m just learning, so please don’t be offended if this is super obvious. Just trying to help.

Again, extra special thanks. I hope to get this all dine before Tampa RV Super Show in January. I’ll let you know how it all goes if you’re interested.

Brian

So the shunts don't work with the setup as far as i know (not a professional by any means), the items you list are the ones i did.

The pros and cons are there, the li take a long time to charge, but in reverse they last a long time. We run a honda 7k when we dry camp that will run all three ac units and charger. I do this to keep hours off coach gen, we dry camp primarily. My dog is usually with us so we have to run ac. I can run about 24 hours without a charge, tv's on coffee in the am with no issues, wife hair drier etc. Solar does help a little during the day but i don't have enough to maintain them, the solar did work better on the agm for some reason.

The remote controller is the main item to make it work, the BIM prevents the alternator from smoking itself.

I do NOT regret doing it. I hated not being able to make coffee in the am after shutting gen off at 10 pm. 500k coach and could not make coffee, first world problems for sure.

I do see, and my buddy that did it also who has a monaco, a % difference in the discharge on the BMS of the batteries, but it really makes no functionality difference, capacity is still capacity.

My coach has been at service for 8 weeks or more now, super awesome having a brand new coach in service more than its not. But when we used all winter it was great with the new setup.

Hope this helps and glad it inspired some people to do it.

[Mx7166]

Where did you install the BIM... Im currently looking to convert in my thor aria 4000 and i have a firefly also... Did you install it where the merge man is??]

Originally Posted by Glamisfam

I ended up ordering the Magnum remote controller, I moved the firefly comm cable to the network port and plugged the controller in. Set it up and we have been using it all week with no problems, batteries stayed full charged and the invert goes to float and maintains every thing in the coach while we are plugged in.

It did do a strange thing while it was getting close to 100% where the invert tripped a few times and went back to charging but never through a fault code. It seems to be getting close to the float charge voltage point, but it "worked itself" though it. The batteries I used have internal BMS with bluetooth so you can see what they are doing. They shut the charging off when the batteries are full so they don't go overcharged as well. You can also shut off the discharge too remotely if you want them "off" with out using the isolator. We installed two 400amp hour so if we wanted to only use one or charge one at a time, I guess this would be useful but not sure why we would.

It is interesting the batteries do no discharge and charge equal, they are a few percent off each other, at one point it was much more, but with the same voltage till they shut off this wasn't a problem.

I did add the Lithium battery isolator at the recommendation of someone, for the alternator charging while driving, it was said to save the alternator when using lithium batteries.

Firefly still works and reads everything no EMS issues or any draw backs that I can see yet. I will be out dry camping in a few weeks and thats what I really wanted this for so I will report back after. Thats the real benefit as we run a small generator to charge the batteries and we can run it at 100% charge till full now with the lithium, which reduces the generator run time and fuel.

Highly recommend the switch over.

When we got the coach with the AGM, I would run my generator till 10 pm till the batteries said full, and couldn't run the Keurig in the morning. I did not check the charge settings to see if that was the problem as others reported they were not getting full charge. With the lithium, I shut the generator off around 6 or 7 after we cooked and had 60% in the am left on the batteries. Once the solar kicked on it charged up and I could likely go another day without heavy use of lights and inverter.