Newbie Questions

[PJL]

Preparing to pick up our new Cornerstone in 3 weeks for full timing, trading in our 5th wheel. Trying to get my ducks in a row and have a few questions that I'm sure will seem basic to existing MH owners, but that I do not know the answer to:

1. Should I carry and use pads for use under the stabilizer jacks if parked on dirt/gravel sites or even hot asphalt? If so, are 2x12's in pressure treated lumber strong enough to hold the weight, or do I need to spend $150+ on 4 Hoss Pads or similar high strength product?

2. If you get in a spot where the hydraulic leveling system lifts a tire or two off the ground (assuming no other level site to move to), do you live with that or do you lower the jack to have the tire(s) reconnect with the ground and live with the un-level condition in the coach? Or, do you actually carry leveling boards for a coach this heavy?

3. Somewhat related, do you chock your wheels, or do the air brakes hold fine on a slope without wheel chocks.

4. How often do you get on the roof to inspect things. I am used to climbing on the 5th wheel roof as part of my departure checklist. With no rear mounted ladder, do I have to purchase and carry a telescoping ladder?

5. Are there any relative newbie 'OCD' Entegra owners out there that have built an excessively detailed pre-departure checklist that you would be willing to share (I will search the forum for this as well).

I know I consolidated a lot of different questions in a single post, but thought this would allow non-interested parties to simply bypass 1 post than having 5 different ones to skip.

Thanks

[hawgguy]

Early welcome to the family!

I don't carry pads for the jacks - in my 5th wheel days I did to help with leveling. I suppose if you have the pads already, and they don't take up much space. Besides which - because of where the jacks are located, placing the pads would mean crawling under the bus. I'd rather not.

If I am at a spot that unlevel - I will not use the automatic system, but either manually level so that it is good enough, or change position of the coach. I cracked a windshield on a previous MH by leveling with the wheel off the ground. That said, lots of peolpe seem to do it without problems.

I carry wheel chocks with my emergency stuff (road flares, triangles etc.). I used them once, for my CDL road test. That's it. The emergency (spring) brakes seem to work well for holding the coach for me. I don't park on slopes though.

I get on the roof periodically. Not as often as I did on previous units with a built in ladder. I carry a Little Giant for that reason.

Are you kidding? There are tons of OCD (cough, Chuck) Entegra people here (it's therapy).

Again - Welcome & Congratulations.

[757driver]

Congratulations on your soon to be new arrival.

With regards to jack boards yes I have used them in soft ground but a 2x12 will cup and break in half very quickly. Instead put two 2x8's together in a 3/8" plywood sandwich to hold it all together. Cut square to the size you want.

I don't like seeing tires off the ground so I will use the same leveling boards for the tires to keep contact.

Send me a PM with your email and I can send you what I have for a pre-departure checklist.

[MRUSA14]

Your Cornerstone will have air levelling so I would not use the jacks but the air to level on asphalt or soft turf. You can tolerate some amount of off level condition when the air levelling has too little range for your slope. With gas absorbtion refrigerators, this could not be tolerated as off-level would ruin the fridge, but with the residential fridge it is not a problem.

Since I don't have air levelling, I screwed together two 2X12X12's stacked with the grain at 90 degrees to each other. This gives me a solid platform for the jacks and I have used them for years in many situations and thry do not break.

[Gary.Jones]

PJL

Welcome to the Entegra family and the world of diesel pushers. Also, to iRV2 Entegra group.

Here are quick answers to your questions.

1.) Jack Pads. I made mine out of a pair of 2 x12 treated boards screwed together and with rotated grain 90 degrees. I have those on board since I bought the coach in February. Used them twice in campgrounds where I was on grass or soft ground. They fit nicely in a basement compartment just forward of the drive axle on the passenger side along with 2 DEF cans. They have been needed less than I thought before I bought the coach.

2.) No leveling boards. Also, no severe off level RV spots. That is one of the issues that I discuss with every RV park (I am long at 45', I want sat clear angle and no trees in the way, I need the spot to be pretty level, etc. etc.) and all of that is discussed up front. Once, I had to go back to the front office and get a different place.

3.) Never chocked. Worried about it before I bought the coach and everyone told me to not worry about it (including Bob who told you the same thing. )

4.) I bought the Harbor Freight 17' version of the ladder that Bob recommended. The harbor freight version is more than half the price and I think is just as good. Most important, it will stow in the basement on its side. It is wide on the top and bottom and narrow in the middle of the ladder and when it is folded up, it fits right in. There is a telescoping ladder and they look good and work well. The Harbor Freight ladder has never seemed flimsey to me and I have been up on the roof 4 or 5 times for various reasons.

5.) I certainly follow a clear mental checklist. The way it works for us is that I deal with all the outside stuff, and my DW deals with all the inside stuff with some cross checking. I have left the Trav-ler up once and put flat spots on my toad when I tried to get away from a semi idling right beside my bedroom slide in a Wal-Mart parking lot, and I will never make those mistakes again. I'm sure that you will get some lists..... my preference is to do it myself. Mine involves walking around the coach and toad 5 or 6 times in the entire process, looking, checking, and doing what needs to be done, with one final trip around looking at 4 ways, jacks, all nuts on all bolts on the tow bar, checking the air line for the Air Force One brake system is tight and won't come out, examining tire pressure on all tires (I have a TPMS system also), making the sure the antenna is down and not just turned off, etc. etc. You will develop your own.

Congrats on the great purchase. You will be thrilled with the Cornerstone, and it sounds like you are doing the right head work now to have minimal problems.

Gary

[Crippsfl]

Not really related to your questions but here is a suggestion for you before you pick up your coach.

Contact your dealer and tell him that you do NOT want them to wax your coach prior to delivery. The reason I suggest this is because, almost without fail, the "detailing crew" will apply wax and remove it with a rotary buffer and a wool pad. The end result is that they will turn your nearly flawless expensive paint job into a swirl covered mess that will takes hours to buff out with compound and a random orbital buffer. The wool pad will put scratches in the clearcoat that can only be removed with a LOT of effort and/or expense. I speak from experience


I have suggested to Entegra that they make this part of their training for how to prep a coach before delivery. If the dealers used random orbital buffers with foam pads, the end results would be great. However, it takes more time and effort.

[Gary.Jones]

Ralph

Good suggestion. My coach has some swirls. In a way worse. is that I discovered that some areas of the coach were waxed and other areas of the coach were clearly not waxed. A lot of it was not waxed (contrast between water beads on some areas and no beads on other areas made this easy to see). Alternately, you could stand/sit there and watch them do their job and point out all the mistakes that they are making (I'm sure they will love this strategy). All dealers want to do is watch you drive off the lot and then you become someone else's problem (with a small number of exceptions)

Gary

[Crippsfl]

Originally Posted by Gary.Jones

Ralph

Good suggestion. My coach has some swirls. In a way worse. is that I discovered that some areas of the coach were waxed and other areas of the coach were clearly not waxed. A lot of it was not waxed (contrast between water beads on some areas and no beads on other areas made this easy to see). Alternately, you could stand/sit there and watch them do their job and point out all the mistakes that they are making (I'm sure they will love this strategy). All dealers want to do is watch you drive off the lot and then you become someone else's problem (with a small number of exceptions)

Gary

Gary,

Here is what I have learned in the 20 months I have had my coach and caring for the paint. My coach is the Topaz paint scheme (mostly black) and it shows every water drop that dries. Using a deionizer to do the final rinse helps. However, the thing that I have found that has the best result is to give up wax altogether. Wax causes the water to bead up and only increases the number of water spots when the beads dry.
Instead, after I buffed out the swirls left by the dealer, I polish the coach with a glaze and follow it up with a paint sealant. I have used Chemical Guys products with excellent results, although there are numerous other quality products. They actually apply easily with a random orbital buffer and are easily removed by hand. Much easier than wax. The finish seems to shed water better than wax and seems to dry with fewer water shots. The paint sealant is supposed to last for up to a year, however, applying an additional coat is easy and I will probably do it in several months, if needed. Cost wise, a gallon each of both products cost about $100 total but is enough to do my coach 4 - 5 times.
Everyone has their favorite way to care for their coach exterior including paying someone else to do it for them. I guess I enjoy doing myself and need the exercise. Offered only as a suggestion

[PJL]

Thanks for the replies. Regarding swirl marks, I was thinking the paint was suppose to need 90 days to fully cure and we weren't supposed to apply any wax or sealant until then. So I was assuming (yep, a mistake) the dealer would only wash (not wax) the rig when I take delivery at NIRV. Am I mis-remembering the 90 day thing?

[Crippsfl]

Most of the modern clear coats don't really need the 90 day cure. The culprit is the rotary buffer with the wool pad. A paint job that is a year old will still be trashed if an inexperienced operator doesn't know what he is doing, and that pretty well describes most "Detailers" at RV dealers.

[TurboDaveTX]

Originally Posted by PJL

Preparing to pick up our new Cornerstone in 3 weeks for full timing, trading in our 5th wheel. Trying to get my ducks in a row and have a few questions that I'm sure will seem basic to existing MH owners, but that I do not know the answer to:



1. Should I carry and use pads for use under the stabilizer jacks if parked on dirt/gravel sites or even hot asphalt? If so, are 2x12's in pressure treated lumber strong enough to hold the weight, or do I need to spend $150+ on 4 Hoss Pads or similar high strength product?



2. If you get in a spot where the hydraulic leveling system lifts a tire or two off the ground (assuming no other level site to move to), do you live with that or do you lower the jack to have the tire(s) reconnect with the ground and live with the un-level condition in the coach? Or, do you actually carry leveling boards for a coach this heavy?



3. Somewhat related, do you chock your wheels, or do the air brakes hold fine on a slope without wheel chocks.



4. How often do you get on the roof to inspect things. I am used to climbing on the 5th wheel roof as part of my departure checklist. With no rear mounted ladder, do I have to purchase and carry a telescoping ladder?



5. Are there any relative newbie 'OCD' Entegra owners out there that have built an excessively detailed pre-departure checklist that you would be willing to share (I will search the forum for this as well).



I know I consolidated a lot of different questions in a single post, but thought this would allow non-interested parties to simply bypass 1 post than having 5 different ones to skip.



Thanks

There are a lot of good answers to your questions, most relate from the transition from a trailer to a top of the line motor coach. The first difference will answer most of your questions. This coach weighs about 50,000 lbs and has sophisticated air and hydraulic leveling systems. It is not a "camper" and you probably should consider parking it on hard paved and reasonably level parking area. You should avoid parking in the places you mentioned in #1 and if you must, rely on CS Hadley air leveling system. Trying to jack a 25 ton vehicle on any soft surface will likely result in problems you want to avoid. So you won't need blocks or pads for leveling.

although #2 is fairly common in RV Parks, it is not a safe practice on any sort of motorhome to use leveling Jack's to the point a tire clears the ground. You should never get yourself into this position. If the site is this in level, get another site. If none is available, your best choice is the nearest Walmart.

#3 relates to #2. If a site is that in level, it may be better suited for a trailer or much shorter motorhome. This is my 7th coach. Have not carried wheel chocks since I sold my travel trailer in 1972.

#4, there are those who are regulars on this site who will disagree with me on the ladder issue, but in my opinion, and the opinion of Entegra, if it was necessary to routinely walk around on the roof of a CS, Entegra would have shipped the coach with a ladder. It is not safe to be on the slick roof of a coach 13' off the ground. Non attached ladders are even more dangerous than attached ladders. If something up there needs service, take it to a qualified service facility and stay off the roof. Your wife will thank you!

#5 is a really good idea for someone new to coaches. It is a big jump from a trailer to a 45' luxury diesel pusher with the systems the CS has. One of those systems is the Trip Tek monitoring system which covers a lot of check point items. The books and manuals will keep you reading about the operation of specific systems for months. The CS is my fourth diesel pusher since 1998 and the systems and routines are different on everyone. One routine that is different is parking and leveling, what do you do, what do you do first, etc. and what do you do last, then the reverse. Entegra provides a card for your convenience to help with these steps. This is not OCD, just plan common sense to protect you, your family, and your investment in a luxury coach.

And use mediums such as IRV2, FMCA, and others when you have a question or a problem. There are no dumb questions!

Just don't let it overwhelm you! Enjoy your CS! Hope this helps. These are my experiences from owning a motorhome since 1972.

[Diesel Diva]

Assuming you have a Significant Other that will be traveling with you, DH and I originally split up the departure/arrival checklist. He did outside, I did inside (this was a great system until we bought a non towable toad - now it takes both of us to load the car onto a trailer). We sold our S&B and started out as fulltimers. This coach was our first RV of any kind and initially we checked and double checked each other. Not to say that we didn't still miss things (door awning, antennae, etc.) but looking back, these were all learning opportunities (sounds much better than calling them mistakes or screw-ups). IMHO one of the worse things you can do is to be in a hurry or rush to get into or out of a place.

Just learn to laugh with, not at, each other and you will do fine. This forum saved our bacon numerous times and will continue to do so as long as we are on the road. Welcome to the family! Deb

[Scatterbrain]

Originally Posted by PJL

Preparing to pick up our new Cornerstone in 3 weeks for full timing, trading in our 5th wheel. Trying to get my ducks in a row and have a few questions that I'm sure will seem basic to existing MH owners, but that I do not know the answer to:

1. Should I carry and use pads for use under the stabilizer jacks if parked on dirt/gravel sites or even hot asphalt? If so, are 2x12's in pressure treated lumber strong enough to hold the weight, or do I need to spend $150+ on 4 Hoss Pads or similar high strength product?

2. If you get in a spot where the hydraulic leveling system lifts a tire or two off the ground (assuming no other level site to move to), do you live with that or do you lower the jack to have the tire(s) reconnect with the ground and live with the un-level condition in the coach? Or, do you actually carry leveling boards for a coach this heavy?

3. Somewhat related, do you chock your wheels, or do the air brakes hold fine on a slope without wheel chocks.

4. How often do you get on the roof to inspect things. I am used to climbing on the 5th wheel roof as part of my departure checklist. With no rear mounted ladder, do I have to purchase and carry a telescoping ladder?

5. Are there any relative newbie 'OCD' Entegra owners out there that have built an excessively detailed pre-departure checklist that you would be willing to share (I will search the forum for this as well).

I know I consolidated a lot of different questions in a single post, but thought this would allow non-interested parties to simply bypass 1 post than having 5 different ones to skip.

Thanks

#1) If you want to crawl around under the rig to put pads down that's up to you. The jack feet are pretty large though, compared to what I've seen on trailers and gas coaches. You should be fine. If you feel the ground is too soft just use your air leveling system.

#2) As long as it's the front tires coming off the ground you should be fine. The rear tires should stay on the ground though.

#3) My wheel chocks are in my garage.

#4) The whole issue with the roof is making sure your sealants are still ok. Maybe twice a year depending on where you are. Keeping the roof clean isn't a bad idea either.

5) I'm probably not OCD enough for you to be happy with my "break camp" procedure. :lol: I start by bringing in my roof antennas (yeah, I've used my antenna to trim a few trees before) and retracting the front "cockpit" blinds. Then I put away the "patio", i.e., chairs, mat, table coverings. After that I drain the black and grey tanks, then flush the black tank and fill the freshwater tank. Flush the slinky and put everything away then move one to the awnings, then the slides. Once the slides are in I turn off the hot water, drop a treatment tablet in the toilet, and start the generator. Then it's time to disconnect the shore power and hook up the toad. At some point while walking around I'll peak under the rig to see if anything has started leaking.
Once the toad is hooked up I'll bring in the slides, retract the jacks, fire up the engine, and then turn on the lights to make sure everything works. In the meantime my wife will have finished and put away the laundry and dishes, then gotten a movie going for the kids. Then I make sure all the doors are properly closed and latched and that the A/C is set where I want it. The last thing I do before getting in the drivers seat is take out any remaining trash.
Once in the drivers seat it's time to make sure the pressures are right (air tanks, tires, oil, voltage, etc). Test the air brakes with a few quick pumps of the pedal and then we're off.

Every so often I check fluid levels and condition, check tire tread wear, look for leaks or damage under the coach, and generally give it a more thorough inspection, but that's not something that needs to be done every time you hit the road.

[hawgguy]

Sounds like a good overall departure plan. On an Entegra, you need to have the motor running air-up to ride height before retracting the slides. Kind a a bummer, but that's the way it is.