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Old 12-08-2016, 09:27 PM   #1
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Retro-fitting engine brake switch on an Anthem

Cruzer mentioned in the modifications thread that the 2017 Cornerstone engine brake rocker switches have an extended paddle on it to make it much easier for tactile feedback and not having to look at the switch to use it. He retrofitted both of the switches for the Cornerstone engine brake without problem

This was a modification/retrofit I really wanted to do as I really have a problem with locating the engine brake switch especially in the dark. Ordered the 2017 paddle style single switch required for our Anthem and received it (PN 0269273). Pulled the switch panel and discovered that this mod is NOT a direct plug and play on an earlier Anthem (and Aspire I presume)

The 2017 switch has 10 electrial pin positions with one spot being vacant with no lug on the switch. The OEM switch has 8 electrical pins with one spot vacant with no electrical lug.

The harness for the 2013 we have will not accept the 2017 switch due to the two extra electrical lugs on the switch and the location of the connector lock tab.

Talked with Spartan about the harness to that switch and Entegra about retrofitting the switch. Originally got the word from Entegra that the switches were interchangeable but this was bad info. Spartan is sending me the pin outs for both switches so I can hopefully decipher what wire goes where and how to either jumper the switch connection(s) to make the harness look like a 2017 or if the newer switch will even work.

PJ is also in on the conversation and indicated he will look at the switch and determine if it is possible to do on an Anthem.

Based on the pin locations and blank cavity on the two switches they do look to be similar with two more pins added. You can plug the 2013 harness onto the 2017 switch by trimming the lock tang off but when finished the two extra lugs on the 2017 switch will be hanging out in space.

I will post any further findings but be aware you cannot just get the new switch and R&R it like the Cornerstone Cruzer did.
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Old 12-08-2016, 11:51 PM   #2
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Have you tried changing the switch position to make it easier to find without looking down when driving? I have exchanged the mirror heat and engine brake switches which now places the engine brake switch beside the mirror adjustment switch, but it is now very easy to turn on/off the engine brake by reaching and feeling. It was in an awkward spot originally, close to the arm of the drivers seat.
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Old 12-09-2016, 12:54 AM   #3
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If you get the pin-outs from Entegra, I would like them also (or the results of your analysis that describes the correct pin out). If it can be done (and I would be surprised if it cannot), I am fairly confident that I will figure it out. Carling switches are pretty straightforward, extra pins are usually for grounds and B+ for internal lighting (indicator and backlight). I also ordered the switch, it should be here Saturday.


Gizmo's suggestion is also a good one, I already did that, and it is better. I also glued a piece of cork to it so it has a tactile feel to it. Not a very elegant solution, I am looking forward to the new switch.
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Old 12-09-2016, 05:47 AM   #4
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Sorry that change over is not going smoothly Al. I changed the switch to the 2015 red brake switch and thankfully it was plug & play. Much easier to see at a glance. If I need to I'll add a round screw plug that covers the screws in our wood trim. Then the round bump can be felt at night, I did that on the TS and it worked great. They can be painted any color to match.
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Old 12-09-2016, 06:53 AM   #5
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I stuck a drawer bumper felt pad on the front of the switch. It is easy to feel and easy to remove if needed.
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Old 12-09-2016, 07:37 AM   #6
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The Cornerstone has the same extra two pins. It appears they are for an on-off indicator light and are a standard pinout. you can plug the switch in and let the two bare tabs hang out over the end of the connector and it will work just fine. I don't recall having to trim any tabs off of my connector though when I installed the switch.

Our 2004 Allegro Bus was on a Freightliner chassis. It had a nice switch with the raised tab. Our 2007 Bus came on a Spartan and didn't have that kind of switch so I ordered a 2004 Freightliner switch from my Tiffin dealer and installed it in our Spartan Bus. But this time everything was different so I needed to make a bunch on new pigtail whips to cross all of the wires around to connect the existing harness to the new switch. Everything got taped up good to keep it from falling off and it worked great. I was pretty happy when I didn't have to go through all of that on the Cornerstone.
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Old 12-09-2016, 10:30 AM   #7
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Thanks for the replies!

I've tried hook side velcro, a rubber bumper, etc. and I still have difficulty putting my hand on the switch with 100% confidence. Just me and the lack of hand coordination and feeling and some numbness I have in my left hand...long story.

I did get the pin outs from Spartan using my VIN for a 2013 Anthem and a VIN Entegra gave me for a 2017 Anthem. The pin outs and diagrams are basically identical, have the same part number for the switches(!) and do not show 10 pins on the (supposed)2017 switch. Either there is a mistake, the VIN I used was actually built as a 2016, I have stumbled onto an anomaly with the Spartan wiring diagrams or all of the above. In any case I have a reasonable background with automotive type wiring diagrams and schematics and it does not make any sense to me.

I only have the switches with me and am not at the coach. When I get to the coach and look at the wire colors in the coach harness and the cavity numbers on the female connector (the part Spartan provides) it may make more sense.

I am doing a functionality comparison between the two switches using jumpers and a test light and they seem to be the same.....just the two extra pins are not used. So, it may work fine just to plug it in with the two pins/lugs/tabs exposed as Cruzer suggested. I just want to be a little more sure before I drive off with it that way.

I am going to relocate the switch, yes, just wanted to let anyone else doing this know there was a hitch and to solicit the type of input you guys have provided. THANKS!

I'l let you know what I've found or if any more input comes in from PJ.

If anyone with a 2017 Entegra that has the new engine brake switch will PM me the last 10 of their VIN I can use that to get another pinout from Spartan to see if it is different.
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Old 12-09-2016, 11:33 AM   #8
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Compression Brakes Selector Switch 0269273

Quote:
Originally Posted by jestal View Post
Cruzer mentioned in the modifications thread that the 2017 Cornerstone engine brake rocker switches have an extended paddle on it to make it much easier for tactile feedback and not having to look at the switch to use it. He retrofitted both of the switches for the Cornerstone engine brake without problem

This was a modification/retrofit I really wanted to do as I really have a problem with locating the engine brake switch especially in the dark. Ordered the 2017 paddle style single switch required for our Anthem and received it (PN 0269273). Pulled the switch panel and discovered that this mod is NOT a direct plug and play on an earlier Anthem (and Aspire I presume)

The 2017 switch has 10 electrial pin positions with one spot being vacant with no lug on the switch. The OEM switch has 8 electrical pins with one spot vacant with no electrical lug.

The harness for the 2013 we have will not accept the 2017 switch due to the two extra electrical lugs on the switch and the location of the connector lock tab.

Talked with Spartan about the harness to that switch and Entegra about retrofitting the switch. Originally got the word from Entegra that the switches were interchangeable but this was bad info. Spartan is sending me the pin outs for both switches so I can hopefully decipher what wire goes where and how to either jumper the switch connection(s) to make the harness look like a 2017 or if the newer switch will even work.

PJ is also in on the conversation and indicated he will look at the switch and determine if it is possible to do on an Anthem.

Based on the pin locations and blank cavity on the two switches they do look to be similar with two more pins added. You can plug the 2013 harness onto the 2017 switch by trimming the lock tang off but when finished the two extra lugs on the 2017 switch will be hanging out in space.

I will post any further findings but be aware you cannot just get the new switch and R&R it like the Cornerstone Cruzer did.
Could you please post a photo of the top and bottom of the Compression Brake Selector Switch?
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Old 12-09-2016, 11:43 AM   #9
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Some time ago I just put one of the small clear silicone door bumpers on the switch so I can locate it by feel. No need to change to a different switch that way.
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Old 12-10-2016, 12:37 PM   #10
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After reviewing all the pinouts and wiring diagrams for the engine brake circuits on the 2013 and 2017 Anthems and doing some comparison continuity checks on the switches themselves my conclusion is as Cruzer described. The 2017 switch is essentially the same as the older switch. The additional two pins/tabs are indeed for an indicator lamp in the new switch that is not used. The back light lamp works just the same (but better) as the original and dims with the dash lights.

Plugged the 2017 switch into our 2013 harness leaving the two end pins hanging in the breeze and all is good. Did not have to trim the lock tab off as it turns out. It barely clears the end of the female connector and actually helps stabilize and align the connectors despite the switch being slightly longer than the original switch at the connector. The new switch mounts perfectly into the panel as is.

Took it for a drive and the engine brake works as it is supposed to. The new switch with the paddle cover is much easier to locate without looking over. If you do glance over the improved illumination of the new switch and the color makes it much easier to differentiate from the other switches.

Defintely a big improvement for driving comfort level and ease of operation.
Thanks again to Cruzer for the idea and Rubicon for putting anther set of eyes on the diagrams and confirming my conclusions!

As the mods progress the coach gets easier and easier to drive and is approaching more towards the fun side. With more turn signals and lights that actually work and switches and controls improved it is a lot safer, too!
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Old 12-10-2016, 02:50 PM   #11
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Gizmo123316 has the right idea. I exchanged my switch positions and now my brake switch is exactly where my hand naturally falls.

If you need tactile confirmation try a poor man's paddle switch: put a piece of Velcro on your existing switch. Then feel for the Velcro, and you have the right switch. As for a red switch, that is of no value to me because I will not take my eyes off the road to look at it.
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Old 12-10-2016, 03:07 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MRUSA14 View Post
As for a red switch, that is of no value to me because I will not take my eyes off the road to look at it.
I have already changed the surface of my switch with a cork bumper, and moved it to the forward bank where it is intuitive to hit it.

That being said, I ordered the same switch as Jestal. Why? Because it is a distinctly different shape that feels very different than the other switches, not simply because it is red. To each his own, I like things to look clean and "factory". The cork works fine, I just like the switch idea better.

You're welcome, Al, thanks for the consult. I'm looking forward to getting the switch UPS today.

John
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Old 12-10-2016, 04:36 PM   #13
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I would really like to have the paddle switch.

Anyone know of a reason this would not work on a 2016 Anthem?

What was the source for the switch?

Thanks

Mark
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Old 12-10-2016, 05:05 PM   #14
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You can order is it from Entegra, about $45, or I ordered mine through my dealer, Beaver Coach Sales, about $25. Part number is 0269273.


It should work on your 2016 no problem.
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