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Old 07-21-2021, 11:18 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by brobox View Post
My personal credit check.
Mark Quasius, Cruzer, the OP. One of the most knowledgeable persons I know in the RV world. I have followed his articles in FMCA as well as online publications for years. I have never seen any of his writing one sided for profit, he calls them as he sees them and has readily shared his knowledge with others.

Rettrobands, Brett Davis President. I have followed Rettrobands thanks to Brett's invitation, all through testing before they were put on the open market, I was sold! They work as shown. Brett Davis, President and CEO of NIRVC treats all of his customers like family. The last thing I could ever see Brett do is a publicity stunt to sell a product. As many know he has done a recall on all of the first addition Rettrobands, 100% out of pure honesty and as he has said many times, "so I can sleep at night"

dizcom that made the statement "I’m calling BS" is entitled to his opinion, like I am mine. I know the two people mentioned above, but I do not know dizcom or any qualifications other than an opinion. Statements are easy to make without documentation. I have seen the documentation and testing videos of Rettrobands, they work.


Exactly Chuck! Count me another believer in facts, Mark and Brett. I have seen the video(it is on YouTube for all to see) of the overloaded Motorhome blowing a tire at speed without damage or loss of control. I believe the hard data enough that I put them on my coach.
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Old 07-22-2021, 12:06 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by dizcom View Post
Alright, I’m calling BS. There’s no damage to the tire? That blew out on the highway at speed? And was driven to a tire shop to be replace? After it blew out? And there’s not the slightest bit of track on the asphalt leading to the tire? This is nothing more than an ad, pretending to be a legitimate post.


Good evening Dizcom,

My name is Brett Davis, and I’m with National Indoor RV Centers (NIRVC). I’m currently here in your “neck of the woods” at the Newmar International Rally in Lewisburg, West Virginia. After reading your three posts here in my hotel room this evening (one on the Newmar Forum, and two on the Entegra Forum), I thought I’d take a stab at answering your questions, but unfortunately, I will be ignoring your opinions, as there’s no way to answer an opinion with a fact. For convenience and clarity, I’ll lump similar comments from your three posts together, and then answer each group as one question.

First Set of Questions:
1) ”Are you sure this was from a reputable source?”
2) “Who cites the testing in Nevada in a Facebook post?”
3) “It performed exactly as it did at the Nevada test?”
4) “Who talks like that?”

Answer: I’m sure you can appreciate how word spreads on social media like a wildfire. And, I’ll confess, I’ve never had a Facebook account. I can barely keep up with all my calls, texts, and emails as it is. However, I was the person who received the call from the driver of the 2018 King Aire yesterday afternoon. I was also the one who gave the tire company our UPS account number in order to have the tire shipped to us. I am also the person who spoke directly with Mark Quasius (Cruzer on IRV2), as he, and I speak frequently. I felt Mark would be interested in this blowout given he investigated, and wrote an article about Rettrobands for FMCA’s Family RVing Magazine (see link to the article below)

https://familyrvingmag.com/2020/06/0...1-7c00f0299d39

In addition to being an avid RVer who owns an Entegra Cornerstone 45A, which is also equipped with Rettrobands, and which floor plan he designed for Entegra, Mark is also a former IRV2 moderator, a current administrator of the Tiffin RV Network, publisher of RVTechMag, has written extensively for Motorhome Magazine, Country Coach Owners Magazine, is the former Midwest Editor for the Original RV Magazine, and a regular (monthly) contributing writer to FMCA’s Family RVing Magazine, where he does hands on road test reviews of motorhomes, and tech articles. Mark has been writing about RVs for over 18 years.

“Who talks like that?” I guess I’d have to say a professional writer like Mark who writes for a living. When Mark was doing his research for the article he wrote on Rettrobands, he was privy to all Nevada Auto Testing Center’s test results. Nothing was withheld from Mark. He had total access, which is why he could authoritatively make the statement in his post that “Rettroband performed exactly as intended and exactly as it did during testing at the Nevada Auto Testing Center.”

Second Set of Questions:
1) “There’s no damage to the tire?”
2) “That blew out on the Highway at speed?”
3) “And was driven to a tire shop to be replaced?”
4) “After it blew out?”
5) “And there’s not the slightest bit of track on the asphalt leading to the tire?”
6) “That tire is in really good shape for having blown out at highway speeds and then being driven on to an exit, bands or not”

Answer: In a sidewall blowout there is a hole blown in the sidewall. Instantaneously, all of the air leaves the tire, the tire and coach drop all the way down to the rim, the rim cuts into the asphalt jerking the coach hard to the right, or left depending on which tire blew, and then the rim shreds the tire.

Rettroband sits 4.5” above the rim, and fills most of the cavity between the wheel well and the tire. When there’s a hole blown in the sidewall all the air leaves the tire, but the coach, and the tire only drop a couple of inches down to the Rettroband. The tire is now riding on the Rettroband, the rim never comes in contact with the asphalt, and therefore does not jerk the coach left or right, nor does it shred the tire.

The link below is to a short video describing how Rettroband works. The video of just one of the many tires we have blown at speed at the Nevada Auto Testing Center begins at the 7:03 mark. The coach in the video was chosen because we believe it to be the most unstable coach on the road due to the large overhang behind the drive axle, and its short wheel base. In addition, we loaded the coach with ballast, so much so, the driver couldn’t get the coach above 65mph, which is the speed all tires were blown at. Intentionally, this was a severely overweighted coach for blowout testing purposes. We wanted the most unstable coach possible to see how Rettroband would perform. At the 7:14 mark of the video the tire is blown. Notice the coach never jerked, or even swerved. Also notice at the 7:16 mark the driver’s hands on the steering wheel at the moment the tire was blown, they didn’t move either. Then pause, and zoom in at the 7:30 mark. The driver had been driving for 6.5 miles after the blowout, and still the tire is on the rim with zero shredding. It looks exactly like the King Aire’s tire. There’s just a hole in the sidewall exactly like the King Aire’s, except the hole is on the outside sidewall instead of the inside sidewall.

https://youtu.be/ujVVWz-Wxjo

The reason the damage to the tire looks minimal is because Rettroband performed as it was supposed to. There was in fact a hole blown in the inside sidewall. In speaking directly to the driver yesterday, when the wheel was taken off the coach at the tire shop, and then turned over, the driver estimated the hole to be “5 or 6 inches”. Regardless, we will have the tire in our possession in a few days, we will send it to the lab, and we will have an exact measurement of the hole, along with a lot of other data.

FWIW, this driver has lived through the harrowing experience of a front tire blowout without Rettrobands. As result, he gratuitously offered to give his testimonial. After reading your posts, I‘ve been persuaded to take the driver up on his offer. You, and others can look forward to seeing a short video in the near future, featuring the driver explaining what he experienced during both his front tire blowouts, along with the actual tire, Rettroband, and lab results from this King Aire blowout.

The reason there are no tracks on the asphalt leading up to the tire is because the picture was taken by the driver of the coach at the tire shop. But regardless, there would not have been any tracks left on the interstate where the tire blew, because the tire was riding directly on the Rettroband. As the driver said, he didn’t know he had suffered a blowout, because the coach never jerked or swerved, which means it would not have left any tracks.

Third Question:
“What would have happened to the coach without them?”

Answer: You are correct. No one knows for certain what would have happened without Rettrobands. However, we have had enough customers killed after a front tire blowout, and done enough collision work on coaches which survived a front tire blowout to say the odds are extremely high the coach would have fallen instantly onto the rim, been jerked violently one or two lanes to the left, if there were two lanes. If there weren’t two lanes, the coach would have probably rolled in the median. Please see the link to the video below:

https://youtu.be/kTufMmcqSwY

The blowout occurs at the 42 second mark, and the rollover occurs at the 1:06 mark. In all likelihood the rim would have gripped the asphalt, and shredded the tire.

Fourth Question:
“If they really thought these made motorhomes safer they wouldn’t sell them exclusively through NIRVC”

Answer: I partnered with Rob Craig 5.5 years ago to form Rettroband. FWIW, we held an online competition to come up with a name for our product, and our new company. We received hundreds of name, and submitted a list of 300 names to see which ones we could receive a Federal Trademark on. As it turned out, none of the 300 names could be trademarked. However, thanks to a very sharp trademark attorney, it turns out more often then not, you can trademark your own names because they are unique to you. So, we started with BrettandRob on a whiteboard. Then went to RettandRob. Then we put the “and” at the end to form Rettroband, and because it was a derivative our both our names we were successful in receiving a Federal Trademark.

Dizcom, the simple answer to your question of why Rettroband is exclusively marketed through NIRVC is because I don’t want to market Rettroband through my competition. Why would I? I suspect if you developed, trademarked, and patented a unique product, you probably wouldn’t be willing to help your competition out by giving your product to them to market, and profit from.

I hope I’ve adequately addressed all your questions, but if I have not, please feel free to Private Message me with any additional questions, and I will endeavor to get you the answers.

All the best,
Brett Davis
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Old 07-22-2021, 05:58 AM   #17
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Brett, thank you for the very factual and educational documentation. There is one King Aire driver that is taking that to the bank, literally. Looking forward to the shipment arriving so my new coach will be protected as well.
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Old 07-22-2021, 07:43 AM   #18
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One lesson I learned a long time ago, was be very careful before calling something or someone bullsh*t when you are talking about something you have no expertise with or knowledge about. It makes you look like a fool to all the people who DO know what they are talking about.

To me, the fundamental misunderstanding made by Diz ... is his first statement in this thread and that was: "Alright, I’m calling BS. There’s no damage to the tire? That blew out on the highway at speed?" No one ever said there was no tire damage. My assumption is that even if the Retrobands worked as designed, one would assume that the tire would look in pretty bad shape by the time the coach was at a service center miles later, but that is exactly what the Retrobands are designed to do. Exactly. The tire would be good for nothing, but laboratory examination. I would also assume that the tire would NOT be shreaded by the rim as the coach is not then riding on the rim and that is the whole logic of the product!

And before I called any person or what they say "Bullsh*t" I'd be damn careful I really knew what I was talking about, which I am afraid is not the case in this case.

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Old 07-22-2021, 07:58 AM   #19
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As I read the posts yesterday I knew Brett would respond in some fashion, either by PM or publicly as he did. His response was clear, calm and factual. Thanks for that, and the information for us all to see in your post. Now - when are they coming?
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:00 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by BrettDavis View Post
Good evening Dizcom,

My name is Brett Davis, and I’m with National Indoor RV Centers (NIRVC). I’m currently here in your “neck of the woods” at the Newmar International Rally in Lewisburg, West Virginia. After reading your three posts here in my hotel room this evening (one on the Newmar Forum, and two on the Entegra Forum), I thought I’d take a stab at answering your questions, but unfortunately, I will be ignoring your opinions, as there’s no way to answer an opinion with a fact. For convenience and clarity, I’ll lump similar comments from your three posts together, and then answer each group as one question.

First Set of Questions:
1) ”Are you sure this was from a reputable source?”
2) “Who cites the testing in Nevada in a Facebook post?”
3) “It performed exactly as it did at the Nevada test?”
4) “Who talks like that?”

Answer: I’m sure you can appreciate how word spreads on social media like a wildfire. And, I’ll confess, I’ve never had a Facebook account. I can barely keep up with all my calls, texts, and emails as it is. However, I was the person who received the call from the driver of the 2018 King Aire yesterday afternoon. I was also the one who gave the tire company our UPS account number in order to have the tire shipped to us. I am also the person who spoke directly with Mark Quasius (Cruzer on IRV2), as he, and I speak frequently. I felt Mark would be interested in this blowout given he investigated, and wrote an article about Rettrobands for FMCA’s Family RVing Magazine (see link to the article below)

https://familyrvingmag.com/2020/06/0...1-7c00f0299d39

In addition to being an avid RVer who owns an Entegra Cornerstone 45A, which is also equipped with Rettrobands, and which floor plan he designed for Entegra, Mark is also a former IRV2 moderator, a current administrator of the Tiffin RV Network, publisher of RVTechMag, has written extensively for Motorhome Magazine, Country Coach Owners Magazine, is the former Midwest Editor for the Original RV Magazine, and a regular (monthly) contributing writer to FMCA’s Family RVing Magazine, where he does hands on road test reviews of motorhomes, and tech articles. Mark has been writing about RVs for over 18 years.

“Who talks like that?” I guess I’d have to say a professional writer like Mark who writes for a living. When Mark was doing his research for the article he wrote on Rettrobands, he was privy to all Nevada Auto Testing Center’s test results. Nothing was withheld from Mark. He had total access, which is why he could authoritatively make the statement in his post that “Rettroband performed exactly as intended and exactly as it did during testing at the Nevada Auto Testing Center.”

Second Set of Questions:
1) “There’s no damage to the tire?”
2) “That blew out on the Highway at speed?”
3) “And was driven to a tire shop to be replaced?”
4) “After it blew out?”
5) “And there’s not the slightest bit of track on the asphalt leading to the tire?”
6) “That tire is in really good shape for having blown out at highway speeds and then being driven on to an exit, bands or not”

Answer: In a sidewall blowout there is a hole blown in the sidewall. Instantaneously, all of the air leaves the tire, the tire and coach drop all the way down to the rim, the rim cuts into the asphalt jerking the coach hard to the right, or left depending on which tire blew, and then the rim shreds the tire.

Rettroband sits 4.5” above the rim, and fills most of the cavity between the wheel well and the tire. When there’s a hole blown in the sidewall all the air leaves the tire, but the coach, and the tire only drop a couple of inches down to the Rettroband. The tire is now riding on the Rettroband, the rim never comes in contact with the asphalt, and therefore does not jerk the coach left or right, nor does it shred the tire.

The link below is to a short video describing how Rettroband works. The video of just one of the many tires we have blown at speed at the Nevada Auto Testing Center begins at the 7:03 mark. The coach in the video was chosen because we believe it to be the most unstable coach on the road due to the large overhang behind the drive axle, and its short wheel base. In addition, we loaded the coach with ballast, so much so, the driver couldn’t get the coach above 65mph, which is the speed all tires were blown at. Intentionally, this was a severely overweighted coach for blowout testing purposes. We wanted the most unstable coach possible to see how Rettroband would perform. At the 7:14 mark of the video the tire is blown. Notice the coach never jerked, or even swerved. Also notice at the 7:16 mark the driver’s hands on the steering wheel at the moment the tire was blown, they didn’t move either. Then pause, and zoom in at the 7:30 mark. The driver had been driving for 6.5 miles after the blowout, and still the tire is on the rim with zero shredding. It looks exactly like the King Aire’s tire. There’s just a hole in the sidewall exactly like the King Aire’s, except the hole is on the outside sidewall instead of the inside sidewall.

https://youtu.be/ujVVWz-Wxjo

The reason the damage to the tire looks minimal is because Rettroband performed as it was supposed to. There was in fact a hole blown in the inside sidewall. In speaking directly to the driver yesterday, when the wheel was taken off the coach at the tire shop, and then turned over, the driver estimated the hole to be “5 or 6 inches”. Regardless, we will have the tire in our possession in a few days, we will send it to the lab, and we will have an exact measurement of the hole, along with a lot of other data.

FWIW, this driver has lived through the harrowing experience of a front tire blowout without Rettrobands. As result, he gratuitously offered to give his testimonial. After reading your posts, I‘ve been persuaded to take the driver up on his offer. You, and others can look forward to seeing a short video in the near future, featuring the driver explaining what he experienced during both his front tire blowouts, along with the actual tire, Rettroband, and lab results from this King Aire blowout.

The reason there are no tracks on the asphalt leading up to the tire is because the picture was taken by the driver of the coach at the tire shop. But regardless, there would not have been any tracks left on the interstate where the tire blew, because the tire was riding directly on the Rettroband. As the driver said, he didn’t know he had suffered a blowout, because the coach never jerked or swerved, which means it would not have left any tracks.

Third Question:
“What would have happened to the coach without them?”

Answer: You are correct. No one knows for certain what would have happened without Rettrobands. However, we have had enough customers killed after a front tire blowout, and done enough collision work on coaches which survived a front tire blowout to say the odds are extremely high the coach would have fallen instantly onto the rim, been jerked violently one or two lanes to the left, if there were two lanes. If there weren’t two lanes, the coach would have probably rolled in the median. Please see the link to the video below:

https://youtu.be/kTufMmcqSwY

The blowout occurs at the 42 second mark, and the rollover occurs at the 1:06 mark. In all likelihood the rim would have gripped the asphalt, and shredded the tire.

Fourth Question:
“If they really thought these made motorhomes safer they wouldn’t sell them exclusively through NIRVC”

Answer: I partnered with Rob Craig 5.5 years ago to form Rettroband. FWIW, we held an online competition to come up with a name for our product, and our new company. We received hundreds of name, and submitted a list of 300 names to see which ones we could receive a Federal Trademark on. As it turned out, none of the 300 names could be trademarked. However, thanks to a very sharp trademark attorney, it turns out more often then not, you can trademark your own names because they are unique to you. So, we started with BrettandRob on a whiteboard. Then went to RettandRob. Then we put the “and” at the end to form Rettroband, and because it was a derivative our both our names we were successful in receiving a Federal Trademark.

Dizcom, the simple answer to your question of why Rettroband is exclusively marketed through NIRVC is because I don’t want to market Rettroband through my competition. Why would I? I suspect if you developed, trademarked, and patented a unique product, you probably wouldn’t be willing to help your competition out by giving your product to them to market, and profit from.

I hope I’ve adequately addressed all your questions, but if I have not, please feel free to Private Message me with any additional questions, and I will endeavor to get you the answers.

All the best,
Brett Davis
I just love facts. Thanks for the honest and accurate post. Put me down for a set. I will be down to Atlanta this winter for the install
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:02 AM   #21
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And before I called any person or what they say "Bullsh*t" I'd be damn careful I really knew what I was talking about, which I am afraid is not the case in this case.

Gary

I will point out that that is exactly what you just did.


I never said that the Rettroband wasn't a decent product, I said that the FB post seems extraordinarily unlikely. I choose not to believe a word of it. Attacking me does not make your point and does not change how good a product the Rettroband is or isn't.



I would encourage others to face this, and any other endorsement with a healthy dose of skepticism. We've all been victim of scams of one type or another. I've watched too many of my friends, particularly the older, liquid variety, spend money on things they didn't need because someone convinced them, usually through fear, that they needed it. I see a lot of posts on IRV2 that look to me like product endorsements, market research and opinion polls disguising themselves as friendly posts. You do what you want. I'm going to be careful, and I'm going to call these like I see them.
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:06 AM   #22
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Thank you for this post. I had not heard of this product and took a look at their webpage yesterday. I get how and why it works.

I am guessing balancing the tires after install might be challenging, but other than that it looks like a great solution.

I am curious after the front rim is examined if that is any damage to the rim after they remove the retroband. I would assume that the coach weight and the pressure directly on the middle of that rim might render it dangerous to continue to use. Any data on that from the testing?
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:08 AM   #23
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Let’s please get back on topic here and not a back and forth between each other. Every member is entitled to voice their opinion and courteous responses to them are permitted but personal attacks are not.
Also take any discussion about ordering this product to the Company and not in the open Forum.
Thanks for understanding.
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:10 AM   #24
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I will point out that that is exactly what you just did.


I never said that the Rettroband wasn't a decent product, I said that the FB post seems extraordinarily unlikely. I choose not to believe a word of it. Attacking me does not make your point and does not change how good a product the Rettroband is or isn't.



I would encourage others to face this, and any other endorsement with a healthy dose of skepticism. We've all been victim of scams of one type or another. I've watched too many of my friends, particularly the older, liquid variety, spend money on things they didn't need because someone convinced them, usually through fear, that they needed it. I see a lot of posts on IRV2 that look to me like product endorsements, market research and opinion polls disguising themselves as friendly posts. You do what you want. I'm going to be careful, and I'm going to call these like I see them.

I guess all I can say to this is WOW.

Let's move on now
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:28 AM   #25
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I hope I’ve adequately addressed all your questions, but if I have not, please feel free to Private Message me with any additional questions, and I will endeavor to get you the answers.

All the best,
Brett Davis

Thanks for that great response! I've looked at the Rettrobands and the competing products out there. The last dealer to try to sell me even had that roll over video playing on his desk on repeat. It's pretty scary. And I immediately decided that if he felt he needed fear to sell me on his product, I was not going to buy it. First thing out the gate: fear.



You and your company have a lot of respect out there. That's very impressive. That convinces me to consider doing business with you more than a video is going to. I meant no disrespect to you or your company. You'll have to forgive me for being a skeptical consumer.
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:44 AM   #26
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If Brett Davis has a product that he has researched and is safety related, I would consider purchasing it, not because of the advertising, but because I know he had done all the research and safety engineering before selling the product. It isn't all about money for Brett, he treats his customers like family! Brett Davis would never put his customers in harms way, just for profit. All the people that know Brett, trust and like him, and that says volumes about the man!
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Old 07-22-2021, 08:48 AM   #27
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You and your company have a lot of respect out there.
My fellow Virginian, that may well be the understatement of the year. Hang around here long enough and you will reach the same conclusion a great many of us have. Integrity, transparency, and to repeat myself, integrity, are uncommon virtues in this industry. Brett and his businesses have them in spades.
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Old 07-22-2021, 11:10 AM   #28
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Wow...this has been a very interesting thread.

I've seen the video and heard of Retrobands for a few years now, but since I only had a small rig (32' RexAir) I never gave it much thought, other than revisualizing that same rollover video over and over again. So much so that when we left Spokane to head to Florida for our 1st Snow-bird trip last season I decided to buy new front tires 'just in case'.

Now that I've joined the family of Big-rigs, I am interested in learning more about these and went to their site yesterday and singed up to be notified of when they're available.

So that's my 1st question...why are they not available? (Duh..just googled it) A design flaw: It's here in this post, quick answer is on post #14.

Okay, now the BIG question...how much will the new designed unit cost? (Yup..Google again) The old ones were "$3,500 for 3/15 sized rims and $4,500 for larger rims."....Not sure what a 3/15 rim is? My tire size is 315/80R22.5, so is that the same? So will the newly designed ones be more?

Gulp...hmm yeah...that's a lot..BUT...might be worth it.

And now I understand from this post that they're on their way but no news as to when.

Okay then...I'm all caught up with everyone else here.

So let me speak this out loud as that's how I figure out what I'm gong to do sometimes...seems to help.

Uhhmm (clearing throat)..."We bought this 2005 Essex two weeks ago because we're full-timers and plan on doing this for perhaps 10 years...maybe more (66 now....) The tires on the front are 7 years old (Michelin) I plan on updating them....soonish (was thinking of using them one more season...maybe that's a gamble..they do look in great shape...but don't know their history other than we just drove them from NC to Spokane and I 'said' I wasn't going to go over 65 but wow...I always seemed to creep up to 70 as it drove so well...and then I'd picture that rollover and slow down to 63 - the sweet spot on my old RexAir.

So where was I? Oh yeah, need to update the tires all around (let's do some math)...carry the one, divide by 8....gulp, THAT's A LOT OF CASH!...so let's say it's around 7K out the door..oh wait...I need to add the retrobands..so let's say it's 11K all said and done...wow..okay, then divide that by 10 years, so $1100 a year (only doing the front with retrobands right?)...so yeah..that's not too bad. Especially when you look at the front of the rig and realize all the weight being supported by those two skinny tires.

I told my DW that when we buy the DP it's going to cost a LOT MORE to maintain than the little-old gas rig, but..it's a house, not a weekend getta-way rig. So...going to sleep on it for a bit...

Thanks for another thread on how to spend my retirement. LOL!
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2005 Newmar Essex 4502
1997 Suzuki Sidekick JX, Spokane, WA (Hoping to replace this soon)
1997 RexAir 32' Ford F53 Chassis, Banks system.
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