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11-27-2019, 08:44 AM
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#113
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Bryan, TX
Posts: 310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary.Jones
David
Are you going to run this forward to some government agency that needs to be made aware of this count (and of course, this is one forum, with a small subset of owners on it.
As I said much earlier, it is my understanding that a lawsuit was filed (most likely in a Michigan court) against the OEM manufacturer to get the OEM to pay for all the radiators that Spartan has had to replace. If one could find that lawsuit, then the exact numbers are probably right in the suit to cover some period of time..... all the information is probably laid out fully there. Now, the suit may be a rumor, but it was floating around strongly about 17 or 16, and makes a good deal of sense.
Gary
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Gary- i sent follow up photos as requested yesterday. Amazing that after sitting in storage for two weeks there is still a lot of Final Charge fluid along the bottom of the radiator housing gasket ( seen looking between the outside fins) and inside the housing gasket is soaked. Reservoir is once again below sight glass.
Once I hear back from Spartan I will determine course of action. Am going to consult an attorney on recommendations too and then bring Joyce Skinner into the loop.
Bet Spartan wouldn’t treat a Foretravel customer this way. Maybe I should see about taking my CS to Nacogdoches for the repairs!
__________________
David and Andi
2016 Cornerstone 45A
Bryan, Tx
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11-27-2019, 02:37 PM
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#114
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Bayfield, Ontario
Posts: 5,456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilV
No word on maintenance here though. In severe service, which is what a motor home chassis is considered to be in, coolant should be flushed and replaced at 1 or 2 year intervals regardless of how many miles are put on it. Some chassis sit for a year at the Coach Builders with their original coolant before the house is built and then for another extended period of time at the dealers. Part of this could be defective radiators while the rest could just be that the coolant needed to be changed before the coach was finished being built and then that the dealer failed to change it before it was sold. How many owners then actually flush and replace coolant every 1 or 2 years on their coaches? Without a full root cause analysis though it will be hard to say on the coolant flush part of the equation.
Electrolysis is another issue that can happen due to all the high current electrical components in today's coaches so poor electrical grounding of the engine and radiator to the chassis could also be part of the problem which may be further impacted if the epoxy bonding of the metal cooling tubes to the end caps of the radiator electrically isolates the three parts.
Some also mentioned incorrect coolant being used which could also be a mistake made by a dealer or owner even if they did flush the systems regularly.
Sounds like it could be a multi-part issue with nobody rolling up their sleeves to get fully to the bottom of it except perhaps for the mechanic mentioned as taking ownership of the issue having a welded lifetime warrantied aluminum radiator made up and installing it.
Just some random thoughts from one who did industrial maintenance and has dealt with a number of these kinds of issues over the years. Its sad how many times that a good part of the root cause is simply lack of positive grounding of the engine block/alternator housing/radiator or waiting too long between coolant flushes.
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The coolant installed in the radiators in question is OAT extended life coolant that is good for 6 years (with the appropriate coolant extender added at 3 years).
__________________
Don & Gerri
2014 Entegra Anthem 44B
2014 Honda CRV Touring
1300W Solar, 1200AH LiFePO4 FMCA F443497
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11-27-2019, 02:54 PM
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#115
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 185
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2013 Anthem replaced 2015 under warranty
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11-27-2019, 11:03 PM
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#116
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 790
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 757driver
The coolant installed in the radiators in question is OAT extended life coolant that is good for 6 years (with the appropriate coolant extender added at 3 years).
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Don,
Any idea where to get this “extender”? I asked this question in another thread earlier and someone sent me a picture of “Final Charge Extender”. I’ve googled it, stopped at several auto parts stores but no one carries it. I was told (I forget who) told me they stopped making it. Even the Mobile Lube company who did my oil change (20+ years in business ) couldn’t help. I plan to circle back with Spartan and Cummins after the holidays. Maybe the “extender” is just an urban legend (-: Thanks
__________________
Senior Member
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11-28-2019, 05:33 AM
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#117
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Windsor Colorado
Posts: 435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grower15
Don,
Any idea where to get this “extender”? I asked this question in another thread earlier and someone sent me a picture of “Final Charge Extender”. I’ve googled it, stopped at several auto parts stores but no one carries it. I was told (I forget who) told me they stopped making it. Even the Mobile Lube company who did my oil change (20+ years in business ) couldn’t help. I plan to circle back with Spartan and Cummins after the holidays. Maybe the “extender” is just an urban legend (-: Thanks
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Spartan sells the coolant extender.
__________________
My other RV !
2017 Anthem 44B
2016 Ram 4x4 via Blue Ox
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11-28-2019, 10:09 AM
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#118
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 790
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les1951
Spartan sells the coolant extender.
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Thanks. I will call them after the holidays.
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Senior Member
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11-28-2019, 12:09 PM
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#119
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Bayfield, Ontario
Posts: 5,456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grower15
Don,
Any idea where to get this “extender”? I asked this question in another thread earlier and someone sent me a picture of “Final Charge Extender”. I’ve googled it, stopped at several auto parts stores but no one carries it. I was told (I forget who) told me they stopped making it. Even the Mobile Lube company who did my oil change (20+ years in business ) couldn’t help. I plan to circle back with Spartan and Cummins after the holidays. Maybe the “extender” is just an urban legend (-: Thanks
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Purchased mine from Spartan a few years ago. They show it on their retail website.
https://www.rvchassisparts.com:8443/...is/runApp?id=5
__________________
Don & Gerri
2014 Entegra Anthem 44B
2014 Honda CRV Touring
1300W Solar, 1200AH LiFePO4 FMCA F443497
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11-29-2019, 09:24 AM
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#120
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 11,531
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Don
I'm pretty sure that my last purchase of OAT said on the bottle that it was good for 500,000 miles (or some huge number). No?
Gary
__________________
Gary and Dee, Zowie and Bowie (traveling cat sibs)
2019 Cornerstone 45B, X15-605hp, Imperial, Spartan K3,
2013 Honda CR-V toad, Demco Excali-Bar II,
Demco Baseplate, Demco Toad Light system, 73 de W5FI
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11-29-2019, 11:10 AM
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#121
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Bayfield, Ontario
Posts: 5,456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary.Jones
Don
I'm pretty sure that my last purchase of OAT said on the bottle that it was good for 500,000 miles (or some huge number). No?
Gary
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Gary,
The 6 year change interval was from Spartan school. On their website Peak’s warranty shows 1,000,000 miles or 8 years.
__________________
Don & Gerri
2014 Entegra Anthem 44B
2014 Honda CRV Touring
1300W Solar, 1200AH LiFePO4 FMCA F443497
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11-29-2019, 11:23 AM
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#122
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 11,531
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Don:
Might we guess that there may be a self-serving aspect to all this?
Now Spartan is also telling us that the air filters need to be changed every year, and tranny fluid every year or every other year??????????
Gary
__________________
Gary and Dee, Zowie and Bowie (traveling cat sibs)
2019 Cornerstone 45B, X15-605hp, Imperial, Spartan K3,
2013 Honda CR-V toad, Demco Excali-Bar II,
Demco Baseplate, Demco Toad Light system, 73 de W5FI
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11-29-2019, 12:29 PM
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#123
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Bayfield, Ontario
Posts: 5,456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary.Jones
Don:
Might we guess that there may be a self-serving aspect to all this?
Now Spartan is also telling us that the air filters need to be changed every year, and tranny fluid every year or every other year??????????
Gary
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Gary,
To a degree I think so. Since at least 2014 Spartan has been saying change the air filter every year which I also think is too often. Transmission fluid with prognostics turned ON has been at 5 years with Spartan since at least 2014. The rear differential fluid change every year (as preached by Spartan) also seems to be too frequent for motorhome use BUT is the same interval as mentioned by the differential manufacturer.
Leaving Final Charge fluid in an engine for 8 years seems a little too long for my liking so I will use the 6 year change interval.
__________________
Don & Gerri
2014 Entegra Anthem 44B
2014 Honda CRV Touring
1300W Solar, 1200AH LiFePO4 FMCA F443497
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11-30-2019, 08:11 AM
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#124
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 823
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Cruzer has an article in Family RV magazine about Allison maintenence, with the following reference: "Then, go to the Allison website and visit the My Transmission page at http://www.allisontransmission.com/p...y-transmission. Enter your transmission’s serial number to display the service requirements."
__________________
[COLOR="Blue"]Doug, Robyn, Ross & Ryan
06 Travel Supreme Select 45'
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12-19-2019, 06:10 PM
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#125
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Bryan, TX
Posts: 310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidH2
Gary- i sent follow up photos as requested yesterday. Amazing that after sitting in storage for two weeks there is still a lot of Final Charge fluid along the bottom of the radiator housing gasket ( seen looking between the outside fins) and inside the housing gasket is soaked. Reservoir is once again below sight glass.
Once I hear back from Spartan I will determine course of action. Am going to consult an attorney on recommendations too and then bring Joyce Skinner into the loop.
Bet Spartan wouldn’t treat a Foretravel customer this way. Maybe I should see about taking my CS to Nacogdoches for the repairs!
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UPDATE: My 16 CS is at Cummins Coach Care in Houston as of Tuesday. 95 mile drive. Stopped in their service lane, unhooked my F150 and waited for Justin to be free. We walked out to the coach, and lo and behold there was a large pink puddle under the left rear corner! Mine was the second Entegra in line that day.
Spoke with Joyce the following day. In my opinion, she is a bit “put out” with Spartan on this EPIDEMIC PART FAILURE.
She had her counterpart at Spartan call me. He repeated the company line, “ its out of warranty” so send in all your bills and we will” take a look”. My next correspondence will be with Daryl Adams, the CEO.
Of note, the Svc Mgr at Cummins Houston said he has had one tech basically full time on Spartan radiator replacements for 1.5 years. If that is not the definition of EPIDEMIC PART FAILURE I don’t know what is. Sure wish there was a “whistleblower” at Spartan [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23].
Going to start the search for a corporate law expert who will take this on contingency. I don’ t want any damages just my out of pocket, lawyer can keep the rest. In Texas, fraud often gets treble damages I am told.
__________________
David and Andi
2016 Cornerstone 45A
Bryan, Tx
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12-20-2019, 04:20 AM
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#126
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Fort walton Beach Fl
Posts: 1,059
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidH2
UPDATE: My 16 CS is at Cummins Coach Care in Houston as of Tuesday. 95 mile drive. Stopped in their service lane, unhooked my F150 and waited for Justin to be free. We walked out to the coach, and lo and behold there was a large pink puddle under the left rear corner! Mine was the second Entegra in line that day.
Spoke with Joyce the following day. In my opinion, she is a bit “put out” with Spartan on this EPIDEMIC PART FAILURE.
She had her counterpart at Spartan call me. He repeated the company line, “ its out of warranty” so send in all your bills and we will” take a look”. My next correspondence will be with Daryl Adams, the CEO.
Of note, the Svc Mgr at Cummins Houston said he has had one tech basically full time on Spartan radiator replacements for 1.5 years. If that is not the definition of EPIDEMIC PART FAILURE I don’t know what is. Sure wish there was a “whistleblower” at Spartan [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23].
Going to start the search for a corporate law expert who will take this on contingency. I don’ t want any damages just my out of pocket, lawyer can keep the rest. In Texas, fraud often gets treble damages I am told.
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Ill be watching this for sure, have not had a failure yet, But???
__________________
Larry
2016 Entegra Cornerstone
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