Water pressure - regulars vs our toilets

[tesseract]

DW and I are at our wits end trying to understand how to effectively manage water pressure after our first year of full time RV'ing.

We have a 2022 Entegra Anthem 44F with 2 toilets. We started off using a "fancy" one with a gauge: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This seemed to work fine for a couple of months, then are water pump started kicking on in addition to city water whenever we would use any water source. After about 2 weeks, the water pump died. We replaced it, and after a week, the second one died.

We had a tech come out, who said that our regulator was starving the pump of water, which was causing them to burn out, so he removed the regulator and everything was fine. (too fine, we developed a leak inside due to excessive pressure).

After doing some research, I dropped some dough on a watts unit: https://www.watts.com/products/plumb...560/lfh560g-34

We IMMEDIATELY noticed that water pressure was HORRIBLE with this set at 55 PSI. Fearing burnout of yet another water pump, we promptly removed and returned the device.

After more research, we ended up with both the stainless and brass versions of this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003YJJHI0

Now we find that under different circumstances, some of which we cannot explain, one seems to work better than the other for delivering water into the coach. Sometimes the stainless is better, sometimes the brass is better, and sometimes we have to switch mid trip without moving the coach.

No matter which one we use, unless the water pump kicks on, our toilets WILL NOT add enough water to cover the exit hole. No matter how many times we "reprogram" the water level, it never fills. I can hold the two buttons for 10 minutes, but it only puts so much water in, and it's never enough to cover the hole. This same behavior exists on both toilets. This means we end up leaving the water pump on all the time to help flush toilets.

The park we are at now, the pressure is "just" high enough to not kick on the pump, so our toilets NEVER fill up appropriately. We have to go outside and turn off the water, then flush, then go turn it back on. Every. Single. Time.

This does not feel luxury to me, but I don't hear anyone else complaining.

Can someone educate me on how to get the toilets to fill properly, and what water pressure regular we should be using?

[alank]

Don’t know what you have for toilets, but it sounds like the supply lines are starving them of a good flow of water. You should have owners manuals, read them to see what’s required for good operation. Is the water pressure and flow of water adequate in the rest of the coach?

[Mgtv53]

Originally Posted by tesseract

DW and I are at our wits end trying to understand how to effectively manage water pressure after our first year of full time RV'ing.

We have a 2022 Entegra Anthem 44F with 2 toilets. We started off using a "fancy" one with a gauge: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This seemed to work fine for a couple of months, then are water pump started kicking on in addition to city water whenever we would use any water source. After about 2 weeks, the water pump died. We replaced it, and after a week, the second one died.

We had a tech come out, who said that our regulator was starving the pump of water, which was causing them to burn out, so he removed the regulator and everything was fine. (too fine, we developed a leak inside due to excessive pressure).

After doing some research, I dropped some dough on a watts unit: https://www.watts.com/products/plumb...560/lfh560g-34

We IMMEDIATELY noticed that water pressure was HORRIBLE with this set at 55 PSI. Fearing burnout of yet another water pump, we promptly removed and returned the device.

After more research, we ended up with both the stainless and brass versions of this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003YJJHI0

Now we find that under different circumstances, some of which we cannot explain, one seems to work better than the other for delivering water into the coach. Sometimes the stainless is better, sometimes the brass is better, and sometimes we have to switch mid trip without moving the coach.

No matter which one we use, unless the water pump kicks on, our toilets WILL NOT add enough water to cover the exit hole. No matter how many times we "reprogram" the water level, it never fills. I can hold the two buttons for 10 minutes, but it only puts so much water in, and it's never enough to cover the hole. This same behavior exists on both toilets. This means we end up leaving the water pump on all the time to help flush toilets.

The park we are at now, the pressure is "just" high enough to not kick on the pump, so our toilets NEVER fill up appropriately. We have to go outside and turn off the water, then flush, then go turn it back on. Every. Single. Time.

This does not feel luxury to me, but I don't hear anyone else complaining.

Can someone educate me on how to get the toilets to fill properly, and what water pressure regular we should be using?

at one time when i got the motor home there was too much water in the toilet I made some some adjusting by holding the 2 buttons like the direction said I think may be water pressure bit low

[tesseract]

Originally Posted by alank

Don’t know what you have for toilets, but it sounds like the supply lines are starving them of a good flow of water. You should have owners manuals, read them to see what’s required for good operation. Is the water pressure and flow of water adequate in the rest of the coach?

We have the factory macerator toilets that came with the coach.

Everything functions fine with the water pump. If there were supply line issues to the toilets, then wouldn’t it be a consistent problem?

Originally Posted by Mgtv53

at one time when i got the motor home there was too much water in the toilet I made some some adjusting by holding the 2 buttons like the direction said I think may be water pressure bit low

I figured this to be the case too, however no matter how long I hold the buttons, it eventually “times out” and never fully fills the bowl - unless the water pump is on, then it’s totally fine.

[B-Man49]

Try turning your back flow valve. Item #7

[bevandtomH]

I agree with B-man. And would guess you know all this….
We like using city water vs. our tank water.
When on City, Fill valve should be on City. No water pump should be needed.
We use a Camco 55psi. Used Valterra and a off brand version with little success. Most places carry the Camco 45psi. I carry one of those as a back up. The 55psi I get on Amazon. We’ve been all over the country and usually find campground water pressure to be good.

If you are filling your tank and relying on that for your water, then your pump should be on. It should only cycle when you call for water.
Like B-man said, verify your valves in your wet bay are turned correctly. Any time I set up camp, I double check I didn’t move one accidentally. It will cause your pump to cycle or run non-stop.
We have the 4048 pump. I am not sure if EC installed the 4008 on your coach but the 4048 has more overall pressure. Everything seems to work better.
As for the toilet water level, if we are not level, the rear toilet water level tends not to cover the hole. You can tweak your coach level quite a bit and still be level.
I use my iPhone level, and our half bath door to get level and tweak from there. My auto level works pretty good but some prefer to do it manually.

[tesseract]

Originally Posted by B-Man49

Attachment 394272

Try turning your back flow valve. Item #7

It says to keep it one way if using city, and the other if using water pump. What if you are using city with water pump to supplement flow problems? I’ve seen quite a few folks here posting that they do this.

Originally Posted by bevandtomH

I agree with B-man. And would guess you know all this….
We like using city water vs. our tank water.
When on City, Fill valve should be on City. No water pump should be needed.
We use a Camco 55psi. Used Valterra and a off brand version with little success. Most places carry the Camco 45psi. I carry one of those as a back up. The 55psi I get on Amazon. We’ve been all over the country and usually find campground water pressure to be good.

If you are filling your tank and relying on that for your water, then your pump should be on. It should only cycle when you call for water.
Like B-man said, verify your valves in your wet bay are turned correctly. Any time I set up camp, I double check I didn’t move one accidentally. It will cause your pump to cycle or run non-stop.
We have the 4048 pump. I am not sure if EC installed the 4008 on your coach but the 4048 has more overall pressure. Everything seems to work better.
As for the toilet water level, if we are not level, the rear toilet water level tends not to cover the hole. You can tweak your coach level quite a bit and still be level.
I use my iPhone level, and our half bath door to get level and tweak from there. My auto level works pretty good but some prefer to do it manually.

Good to know about the camco 55, I’ve never heard of or seen it in any of my research, only the 45 you mentioned. I’m going to look into ordering one of those now. We’ve got the fill valve set correctly, and the pump rarely turns on at this park, which is kinda the problem. With the park supply and the valterra 55, we don’t get enough flow to fill the toilet. The pump NEVER turns on without calling for water.

We do have the 4048. The pump we had that died in a week was the 4008.

We are super meticulous about leveling, and do a “door swing” check with both the mid bath and shower doors, as well as using a real level in three different places within the coach to ensure we are fully level during setup.

[Mwoodofd]

Sounds like something is blocking the water supply to the toilet. Not sure if there is a screen where the water supply line connects to the toilet, but I would look there to see, if other faucets are working fine in the coach. I don't know if the newer coaches have a water valve to the toilet, the older units did not, and if it does, make sure it is completely.

The $29 water pressure gauge in one of your images is very low quality for the price shown (typical Amazon product) The ones I used to buy that were good were about $60, and may not be available anymore due to the higher price.

[Flanz]

After trying all the over priced junk out there listed for RV’s, I plumbed this in our coach over four years ago -

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Watts-1-2-I...PSI/5001883903

Been working fine with no issues. This pressure reducer can be rebuilt, if needed, for less than buying the RV piece of junk listed in this thread.

[RVFunlovers]

Maybe I am just getting lucky but I am not having any issues just using city water.
When connected I leave the pump off and my pressure reg set to just under 50. Majority of rv parks have plenty of pressure.

When traveling or not connected I use the pump. I think I am getting similar pressure from either pump or city one at a time.

I am not sure I want more pressure than that. I don’t want to cause a leak and my darling wife fills the gray tank plenty fast enough with the pressure we have.

In all cases (pump or park water) both macerator toilets are adding enough water to the toilet. Even when another water source is being used.

On my two Entegra’s I have not needed to use the pump when connected to park water.

I don’t know much about the toilets.

Good Luck.

[tesseract]

Originally Posted by Mwoodofd

Sounds like something is blocking the water supply to the toilet. Not sure if there is a screen where the water supply line connects to the toilet, but I would look there to see, if other faucets are working fine in the coach. I don't know if the newer coaches have a water valve to the toilet, the older units did not, and if it does, make sure it is completely.

The $29 water pressure gauge in one of your images is very low quality for the price shown (typical Amazon product) The ones I used to buy that were good were about $60, and may not be available anymore due to the higher price.

How would something be blocking the water supply to the toilet when on City water, but NOT on the pump? They do indeed have valves, and they are for sure on. I did double check, but if they were off, then it wouldn't be working on the pump. My only issues is on city water when using a pressure regulator. If I remove the regulator, everything is fine, and I've tried 4 different regulators, including a watts unit. It just seems like the regulators are restricting too much flow.

Originally Posted by Flanz

After trying all the over priced junk out there listed for RV’s, I plumbed this in our coach over four years ago -

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Watts-1-2-I...PSI/5001883903

Been working fine with no issues. This pressure reducer can be rebuilt, if needed, for less than buying the RV piece of junk listed in this thread.

This looks like the same unit I tried above but minus the gauge. I spent over $100 on it, and it restricted flow more than the valterra's do. Pressure on the camp side was enough to make my fittings under the sink leak without a regulator, but with the watts unit, the shower was also SUPER weak.

Originally Posted by RVFunlovers

Maybe I am just getting lucky but I am not having any issues just using city water.
When connected I leave the pump off and my pressure reg set to just under 50. Majority of rv parks have plenty of pressure.

When traveling or not connected I use the pump. I think I am getting similar pressure from either pump or city one at a time.

I am not sure I want more pressure than that. I don’t want to cause a leak and my darling wife fills the gray tank plenty fast enough with the pressure we have.

In all cases (pump or park water) both macerator toilets are adding enough water to the toilet. Even when another water source is being used.

On my two Entegra’s I have not needed to use the pump when connected to park water.

I don’t know much about the toilets.

Good Luck.

What regulator are you using? I really have a feeling that my issue is due to flow rate through the regulators I'm using.

I don't want any more pressure than the pump provides, I just want my city water to function like my pump with a regulator installed for safety. It seems like no matter what regulator I get, it's always worse than the pump, despite city water being perfectly fine with no regulator.

[bevandtomH]

https://www.amazon.com/Camco-Stainle...s%2C185&sr=8-3


Amazon link to Camco 55psi regulator.

[Old-Biscuit]

Your water pumps would not be damaged by city water.....city water 'T's into same cold water line pump discharge goes to.
City water could not 'starve' the pump

Why you have to replace couple of pumps????
Could have been wrong valving, debris from fresh water tank, incorrect adjustment to pump bypass etc but city water wasn't the culprit

The Shurflo 4048 is rated at 4 gpm and 55 psi

Regulators on city water can be 55 psi but the FLOW Rates are typically LOW...in the 2.5 gpm

FLOW rates is more important then PSI

You have a a good pump..........use it
Consistent pressure and flow regardless of where you go and no regulator required.

We haven't used City Water since 2008..exclusively use the fresh water tank & pump

[RVFunlovers]

Originally Posted by tesseract

How would something be blocking the water supply to the toilet when on City water, but NOT on the pump? They do indeed have valves, and they are for sure on. I did double check, but if they were off, then it wouldn't be working on the pump. My only issues is on city water when using a pressure regulator. If I remove the regulator, everything is fine, and I've tried 4 different regulators, including a watts unit. It just seems like the regulators are restricting too much flow.

This looks like the same unit I tried above but minus the gauge. I spent over $100 on it, and it restricted flow more than the valterra's do. Pressure on the camp side was enough to make my fittings under the sink leak without a regulator, but with the watts unit, the shower was also SUPER weak.

What regulator are you using? I really have a feeling that my issue is due to flow rate through the regulators I'm using.

I don't want any more pressure than the pump provides, I just want my city water to function like my pump with a regulator installed for safety. It seems like no matter what regulator I get, it's always worse than the pump, despite city water being perfectly fine with no regulator.

I use an adjustable unit. I like to keep my pressure below 50.
Valterra Water Regulator, Lead-Free Brass Adjustable Water Regulator with Pressure Gauge for Camper, Trailer, RV Plumbing System