We'll just keep ours

[garysfb]

As in most things RV, not one size fits all. We all have different income/wealth numbers, different ages, retired and not retired. In our case we retired in mid 2017, sold our lake house to buy a new RV. We fully intend to drive it until we can't. So we don't give a darn what resale value is, nor do we care what new and fancy bells and whistles come along. We're entirely happy with our purchase especially now that we're almost three years into it and have smoothed out all (most) of the wrinkles. If we want to add or remodel it will be way less expensive, and time consuming, than buying a new RV.

So far we've spent about 1/3 of our time in the RV and still have a lot of places and people to see on our list. So here's to the good life!

[RVPioneer]

Originally Posted by Gary.Jones

no, you are wrong. I know this CEO very well and this person collects data like a scientist. Now, it is true that costs will differ and the cost of coaches varies greatly, and the depreciation depends a lot on whether the coach is bought new or used (where the original owners has taken the beating on depreciation more so than the second or third owner). I can assure you that he is making that statement based on people who buy new coaches, and the average cost of those new coaches is probably in the $400,000 - $600,000 dollar range. You can bet on those numbers. That is the general range of costs that are seen by owners of coaches that are represented on this specific forum. Is that $30,000 per year likely true for an owner of a 1990 Winnebago, or a 2005 Monaco, no.

I think that most people who buy coaches in that range have looked at the data and feel that they can afford to take that kind of loss for 4 or 5 years and still have enough money left to live the life they want to live for the rest of those remaining days. If you are still convinced that is an inaccurate number, I'd like to see your numbers and know where you derived your numbers.

Gary

I might be wrong, but I doubt it.

If you want to narrow it down to people who buy a $400-600K coach and keep it for 4-5 years, than the $30K/yr figure may be accurate. It may actually be higher. That is a very small subset of DP owners.

It doesn’t take years of collecting data or a scientific mindset to figure this out. As you’ve mentioned, the figure would not be accurate for someone who bought a 15 year old coach. It would, also, not be accurate for someone who bought a new Marathon.

It is a broadly inaccurate statement to say that the cost to operate a diesel coach is $30K/yr. That may be the average, for the average guy, buying the average coach.

[TXTiger]

Another thing to consider is are you living in your RV full time? If so you must take into consideration the savings you have by not living in a sticks and bricks home, like property tax, and other costs associated with home ownership. I had a landscaper, pool cleaner, maid etc that I now do not have to incur costs for. The saving on property tax alone covers the annual maintenance of my diesel pusher. So if you factor in these savings you almost break even. The only difference is the S&B will appreciate and the DP will depreciate, but you know this going in.

[Nowabeachbum]

Originally Posted by Gary.Jones

no, you are wrong. I know this CEO very well and this person collects data like a scientist. Now, it is true that costs will differ and the cost of coaches varies greatly, and the depreciation depends a lot on whether the coach is bought new or used (where the original owners has taken the beating on depreciation more so than the second or third owner). I can assure you that he is making that statement based on people who buy new coaches, and the average cost of those new coaches is probably in the $400,000 - $600,000 dollar range. You can bet on those numbers. That is the general range of costs that are seen by owners of coaches that are represented on this specific forum. Is that $30,000 per year likely true for an owner of a 1990 Winnebago, or a 2005 Monaco, no.

I think that most people who buy coaches in that range have looked at the data and feel that they can afford to take that kind of loss for 4 or 5 years and still have enough money left to live the life they want to live for the rest of those remaining days. If you are still convinced that is an inaccurate number, I'd like to see your numbers and know where you derived your numbers.

Gary

Wow, did someone steal your Christmas presents? Starting a post with “no, you are wrong” is kinda ridiculous without knowing much of anything about the situation. If you trade in the first year, you could lose close to $100,000 depending on the model. The longer you hold it the better it gets. Even the floorplan matters. Single bath is worth less. There are lots of facts and figures but the way you interpret them varies greatly! Just ask a politician.

[Gary.Jones]

Gary

Don’t get your pants on a wad!

My post was referring to the post before yours and you posted while I was typing my response, and I’m sticking by my comment. Wouldn’t change a word

My comment had nothing to do with you.

Gary

[Nowabeachbum]

I never thought it was directed at me. Again just commenting on the way you started your post.

[brobox]

Dave, that trade in is below wholesale. I just received a "sold" email from RVTrader, on an 14 RBQ that just sold for what I sold mine for 3 years ago, which was $124,000 more than you were quoted on trade in. The purchaser on mine hasn't lost a dime with the used market increase.

[DebbieMH]

I'm keeping my 2015 Anthem for as long as I'm "motorhoming". And ... I am actually "full time" now (well, will be as soon as the house in NOLA sells). Drove it to the AIM Fredericksburg rally two weeks ago after the coach had sat almost a year while Dan wasn't doing well. The only problem I had was the steps quit on me. E-Trailer order and a fellow Entegra owner got my steps fixed. Just drove to my stopover tonight on my way to St. Augustine for Christmas and the coach did great. It might not have all the great stuff that Entegra and their suppliers have put in the coaches ... but as of next week, I have owned her for 6 years and almost 60,000 miles. She is better today, than 6 years ago ... HWH, Lambright sofa, full house water softner ... etc. But, I really do want 360 cameras ... or better cameras ... any suggestions? Lynn

[dave&ginny]

Originally Posted by brobox

Dave, that trade in is below wholesale. I just received a "sold" email from RVTrader, on an 14 RBQ that just sold for what I sold mine for 3 years ago, which was $124,000 more than you were quoted on trade in. The purchaser on mine hasn't lost a dime with the used market increase.

Thanks Chuck! I thought I was "low Balled" and also thought about just selling it myself but I'm not sure I'd gain that much on a newer coach. Like I said before, my coach isn't hurt and I don't see the advantage to starting the depreciation over again. In business I always look at risk compared to reward. With a new coach I see too much unknown and risk and not enough reward.



Don't get me wrong, life is short and I've already had that conversation with the doctor about cancer in 2012. But I owe it to my wife to not be frivolous with money should my ticket get called before all debt is covered. It really helps that I have a climate controlled "man cave" for the coach and I enjoy being mechanical.

[dave&ginny]

Originally Posted by Gary.Jones

A well known CEO of a major RV company has been doing presentations on RV ownership and part of his presentation has been a section on cost of diesel motorcoach ownership. I first heard the presentation 3 or 4 years ago, and one of the most memorable statistics that he included in his presentation was that the data was clear that it costs about $30,000 a year to own a diesel motorcoach. That included depreciation and cost of ownership.

Your quote does not surprise me at all..... and it needs to be understood completely by every owner of a motorcoach. These things are not appreciating assets like a house.

Gary

Gary,


The nearest I can figure it costs me about $1800-$2000 per year to maintain the coach with me doing all the work myself. This includes the wear and tear on the tires, oil changes and other wearable items. The $35000 depreciation is on top of that.

[brobox]

Dave, no argument keeping your coach, nothing wrong with that. From the dollar standpoint, purchasing a couple of years preowned doesn't hurt that much. The buyer of my 14 has been enjoying it for 3 years and it has cost him nothing but maintenance.

[okcnewbie]

I've been shopping/researching for years.

You can pretty much plan on 5% depriation per year and that doesn't include maintenance and bad luck. I believe it's been this way for decades.

We just bought an older DP and it's possible we could actually sell it for 15k more than we paid. It's just a little better than luck IMO. If the maintenance man calls and says the turbo, or whatever needs work than all bets are off. We are a bit crazy to want to own a DP and I hope the "force is with us".

Good luck.

[Marta1907]

I subscribe to the 10% per year depreciation rule.
Based on a 300K coach....
10% of $300k the first year
10% of $270k the second year
10% of $243k the third year
and so on
and so on

[kevinantholt]

Originally Posted by dave&ginny

Ginny and I are looking at retirement and each year about this time we start considering our options on a different coach. Covid has hurt our business but we're okay, we're just not as flush as we were with cash.

We've looked at New Aspires and used Cornerstones but each time we get close something comes up in one of our buildings and we back away. After talking with our banker, I decided to go ahead and make another plunge until I found out what we'd get on a trade. I was offered $125k and I was shocked. This means I'm loosing about $35,000 per year on depreciation. Where's the bottom? My banker wants me to trade because he sells money and the dealership wants me to trade so they make money but this lifestyle has gotten out of hand and the coaches are unreliable to boot. Financing something for 15 years knowing it's loosing that much money and falling apart, is nuts.

I love RVs! My wife and I met camping when we were 12 years old and now we've been married for almost 43 years. We've built businesses, commercial buildings and numerous houses so we're not afraid of spending money. But the RV lifestyle has gotten crazy in my book and don't see the advantage of spending more just to see the money burn.

My 2015 Aspire still runs pretty good although it will require a little more maintenance but I think we'll keep it running as long as we can. I told Ginny that if it gets to the point where we can't keep it running, we'll just junk it and be money ahead over buying a new one. Then we'll buy a cabin on a lake and laugh at the memories. At least the cabin will appreciate over the years.

With the reliability going down, cost going up and depreciation falling like a fat kid off a cliff; the shine just isn't there anymore.

Dave, your Coach has a Low of $158,300 and a high of $190,750 (NADA) so 125K would be a steal for the buyer.
It's not as bad as you think. Plus it's a Sellers Market this year for RV's. Especially used because the product isn't as available as much as the previous years because of Covid.