Why Switch From Tiffin To Entegra?

[rhusak]

Originally Posted by tvolk

We have had many, many RV's of every type over the years. Travel trailers, popups, A, B, C, 5th wheel. Gas, diesel. DP (3 of these so far). Fleetwood, Tiffin, Forest River, Coachman, Winnebago, Coleman, Jayco, Newmar, and several other brands I can not remember !

Now have entegra anthem. sold 2010 40' Phaeton to get 2013 Anthem. Took delivery of Entegra late Dec 2012.

In last 24 months --Toured Tiffin, Newmar, Entegra, thor DP factories .

Tiffin did have product problems for a while. I suspect that they now have their problems solved and their quality is back on par with others.

After a lot of research (same as most DP buyers have done) , I wanted to solve a few problems that the Phaeton had--and I also knew my 'list' of things I wanted on any upgrade in RV for me. Main Phaeton issues were--1.)slightly worse than expected overall quality resulting in a few too many real problems, 2. ) Not able to heat or cool unit to any reasonable level of satisfaction. Cooling was due to only having 2 roof air units when this unit clearly needed three. 3.) 8K generator not big enough for the coach even with only 2 air units (Tiffin goes to 10K generator if you get the third air unit)

Critical List of things I wanted in next coach --

all electric
tag axle--43' unit
Independant front suspension
Washer, Dryer, Dishwasher
150 Gallon fuel tank
Flush windows
Flush slide floors
Gerard awning
plus a lot more things I will not list here

I wanted a unit that had good build quality and plenty of insulation in walls and roof. Spartan chassis preferred.

Anyway--Entegra hit all the buttons PLUS a lot more (12.5K generator, heated floors, better awning, dual acting jacks, etc). I looked at Newmar Dutch star, and Mountain aire. Anthem had more good 'features' than even Mountain Aire --at $60-80K less--and entegra has 2 year warranty (this is actually a very big deal in my opinion). Newmar quality is outstanding and their construction method is the same as Entegra (Cruiser points out the advantages very well) .
Looked at Tiffin Bus--but construction was same as Phaeton (better chassis and all electric however vs phaeton)--but no comparison with entegra on quality, features, value, and insulation. Did not look very hard at American coach or Winnebago or Thor products. (previous bad product and customer service experiences led me away from Winnebago)

For 2014 --Tiffin has upped their game for the Bus. They have added another layer of insulation around the whole coach (I think they did that for all their product line?) and added some of the features the entegra has. Clearly--Bus sales were hit very hard by entegra over the last 12-24 months. Tiffin is a good company and has responded.

I do not know the relative pricing of entegra and Tiffin Bus right now. Perhaps the Bus is price comparable now to the Anthem? Entegra has been pretty aggressive with price increases so their price advantage has perhaps been narrowed a bit?

As far as floor plans/space usage--Tiffin is the best there is in my oipinion. They do so may things 'right' that if they have solved their quality issues --and fixed their basic construction problems--they are worth a serious look again.
I suspect, however, that Entegra still offers a better overall 'package' and value vs Tiffin at this point (Aspire, anthem,cornerstone vs Phaeton, Bus, Zepher). Also--Service at Tiffin could remain a problem for many years as they have quite a large population of products out there that will continue to need to get fixed at the factory. Entegra is putting out a lot of units--but they do not have many thousands of units covering several previous model years needing fixes .

As has been stated by numerous people on this board--Tiffin service is excellent---but Entegra has proved to set a new standard in customer care.
All units have some problems--it is the nature of the beast!
Obviously, entegra is only selling to the higher end RV market--so they do not have to deal with the wide variety of product 'quality/values' that Tiffin has to deal with. Since Entegra is making enough units to apparently be financially viable on their own--and they share whatever component part purchasing volume adantages of Jayco--they can be very good at servicing their customer base.

Anyway--these are just my thoughts. At this point (2014 products) I suspect that Tiffin, Entegra, Newmar (and American Coach?) all offer good products and there would be no bad choice.


Tom Volk
2013 Anthem DEQ

Hi all..
Well, please understand just my .02!!! I am not in the same category as most others on this list.. I can't afford a new coach! Early this year during our annual trip to Lake Havasu my DW and I decided we wanted more interior space than our 97 Eagle could give us.. That meant slides! We looked around some while we were down there and were really impressed with the Phaetons and looked at several in campgrounds around while talking with enthusiastic owners.. So I had made up my mind that would be on my short list!
I started my research on line and talking with other owners.. I should note here that I would have bought another Eagle with 4 slides but they were out of my price range!
I found out about the wet bay issues, the drivers front slide soft floor and the wet bays.. I also noted the cracking of the rear portion of the bodywork on the tag axle coaches.. That wasn't an issue for me as I didn't want anything bigger than 40'.
I found many owners were not even aware of these issues and were surprised when I pointed them out.. And coaches that had these issues had a very good bargaining point for negotiations! I was very close on a coach so I decided to call Red Bay to see what their position was on repairs as the coach was 5 years old! They said that they would consider the repair after an inspection but would not give a reservation as after warranty repairs were first come first served.. And could expect to wait up to 3 months.. So I was a bit skeptical..
I then became aware of Travel Supreme from a friend who was in the RV business for over 10 years.. He said I should have a look at what was available.. That is lots easier said than done.. I found some coaches but some were VERY highly priced and some just didn't fit.. I also became aware of Cruizer through his reviews and mentions on the Tiffin lists.. I saw reviews on Entegras by him so I knew he followed the brand.. I wrote him for his honest opinion..
He told me that he considered Travel Supreme and Entegra a higher quality unit even though he owned a Tiffin unit.. That was a big factor in my decision to buy my 04 40DS04. I am very happy with it.. Sure there are some things that could be better.. But overall I am impressed.. Do I wish it were a Select.. Sure and maybe f I am able in a few years I may be able to "Move Up" to a Entegra..
Thanks for letting me tell my story!
Ron Husak

[HarleyDriven]

Originally Posted by Saltydog44

I suspect that we all would have slightly or even significantly different reasons for our choices. For us, we loved our 2010 Phaeton, but we had nagging issues that seemingly couldn't be resolved at the dealers - leaking bay (Not good when it is the electric bay), sagging floors were beginning a few other things.

When we started looking we assumed we'd say in the Tiffin line. It's hard to sever the umbilical cord to Bob Tiffin, but we'd been to Red Bay once and after the Coon Dog Cemetery it's a pretty desolate place with very little nearby.

Then we noticed the 2 Year Warranty sign on an Entegra at Lazy Days. That was a big deal for us since we'd had a few things start to go on the Phaeton. Then we found a floor plan we liked a lot. The cab forward design and the IFS made the test drive a mover. We heard about the customer service bu doubted it could match Bob.

As Dave says, the value proposition - all the stuff that is an option on other coaches - pretty much sealed the deal. I also agree with tvolk on most items. This coach feels very homey to us. I'm not sure the slides are wider but it feels more open.

Are there issues or things we'd change - sure. But the Customer Service under Joyce has exceeded not only my expectations, but my wildest imagination.

If we buy again, it will be an Entegra almost certainly.

Recently we attended good sams rally in Atlanta . RvOne was representing entegra. We talked with Joyce, she was very cordial an took time to explain there program, she told us she'd give us her personal cell phone number an she DOES answer every call, I believe her sincerity in really making entegra work as a company. Every motor home breaks down, knowing your not alone out there is everything...we're looking at the aspire 44B...an best place to buy.

[Saltydog44]

Amazingly Joyce often answers her phone so no need for a message, but when you do she always calls back - usually very quickly. I don't know how she keeps up given the increasing number of Entegras on the road.

[hogdriver]

Joyce told me last week at the Atlanta show they had manufactured 1079 Entegras. I'm guessing 6-8 more this week. She has a daily count and a spreadsheet with every single VIN with owner's name, address, phone etc.., and they try to keep it current with used Entegra sales.

[rklow13]

Originally Posted by bbott

I'm noticing that quite a few new Entegra owners are former Tiffin owners. Is their a reason why you switched from Tiffin to Entegra? Were you just looking for something new, was it floor plan or did you have a problem with your Tiffin coach or Tiffin in general? And would you own another Tiffin or Entegra after what you know.

Just curious as my husband and I are weighing the differences between the two.

Don't even look at a Tiffin product!!!! Run unless you want to spend all your travel time sitting in repair shops. Our 08 Phaeton is thrown together. We have spoken to many people who are Tiffin product owners & as of yet not one is happy that we spoke to. This is why they are getting rid of them as we are going to do the same. We have no intention of spending more money on this pile of junk to keep it repaired.

Engine & running gear is absolutely satisfactory but from there up, is a total different story!!!

[DSL417]

Originally Posted by rklow13

Don't even look at a Tiffin product!!!! Run unless you want to spend all your travel time sitting in repair shops. Our 08 Phaeton is thrown together. We have spoken to many people who are Tiffin product owners & as of yet not one is happy that we spoke to. This is why they are getting rid of them as we are going to do the same. We have no intention of spending more money on this pile of junk to keep it repaired.

Engine & running gear is absolutely satisfactory but from there up, is a total different story!!!

Welcome to iRV2...and welcome to the Entegra forum.

I am sorry you've and a bad experience with Tiffin...there are 2013-14 Tiffin owners out there that are very happy with their happy with their coaches, so hopefully some of the bad is past. Certainly, Bob Tiffin backs his product, but too many returns to the service bay is a drag.

Don't know what you are looking for, or if you're looking, but you'll find many very happy Entegra owners on this forum. They'll be happy to answer your questions about the good, bad, and ugly (not too much) of our brand. One thing for certain you'll find here...everyone is extremely pleased with customer service, a price point for what is delivered that is second to none, and an industry leading 2 year warrantee.

Good luck in your search.

[kewag]

Originally Posted by rklow13

Don't even look at a Tiffin product!!!! Run unless you want to spend all your travel time sitting in repair shops. Our 08 Phaeton is thrown together. We have spoken to many people who are Tiffin product owners & as of yet not one is happy that we spoke to. This is why they are getting rid of them as we are going to do the same. We have no intention of spending more money on this pile of junk to keep it repaired.

Engine & running gear is absolutely satisfactory but from there up, is a total different story!!!

Oh my goodness,your post is way off the norm. We and many Tiffin owners are very happy with our coaches and service. We couldn't be happier with our Zephyr. I hope your problems will be fixed and you will enjoy the RV experience that the rest of us do.

[DoggieDaddy]

Originally Posted by kewag

Oh my goodness,your post is way off the norm. We and many Tiffin owners are very happy with our coaches and service. We couldn't be happier with our Zephyr. I hope your problems will be fixed and you will enjoy the RV experience that the rest of us do.

I think you are experiencing the difference between an entry level coach (Phaeton) and the top of the line coach (Zephyr). There is a reason for the price difference. Depending on the manufacture and the price point they are trying to hit. That can very between manufacturers and years of manufacture. I have more experience with Winnebago and the difference between a Journey (entry level) and a Horizon (top of the line) used to quit a bit. The Horizon was an excellent coach. They used real wood for example. In the Journey they used a lot of "wrap" and plastic. The craftsmanship even seemed different. Unfortunately now the difference between a Journey and a Tour (current top of the line) doesn't seem that great and not for the better. The reason we chose Entegra.

[757driver]

Originally Posted by DoggieDaddy

I think you are experiencing the difference between an entry level coach (Phaeton) and the top of the line coach (Zephyr). There is a reason for the price difference. Depending on the manufacture and the price point they are trying to hit. That can very between manufacturers and years of manufacture. I have more experience with Winnebago and the difference between a Journey (entry level) and a Horizon (top of the line) used to quit a bit. The Horizon was an excellent coach. They used real wood for example. In the Journey they used a lot of "wrap" and plastic. The craftsmanship even seemed different. Unfortunately now the difference between a Journey and a Tour (current top of the line) doesn't seem that great and not for the better. The reason we chose Entegra.

Robert & Holly

I see your delivery date is fast approaching. We are looking forward to hearing of your experiences and comments on the Anthem 44B when it arrives. We have the same model on order. April 30, 2014.

[HDrider]

Oh I don't know,,, our 2007 Tiffin Phaeton has been very good to us. Only visited Red Bay 1 time and had the wet bay floor replaced. Only spent one day at a repair shop for a awning motor. And we have lived in it fulltime 2 years of that time. So it has been tested.
They all have there issues and after reading forums on 3 major brands as we are searching for a new coach I can tell you I am almost more confused than ever. But I would hardly run from another Tiffin.
And a heck of a first post I might add LOL!!

[wnytaxman]

Originally Posted by rklow13

Don't even look at a Tiffin product!!!! Run unless you want to spend all your travel time sitting in repair shops. Our 08 Phaeton is thrown together. We have spoken to many people who are Tiffin product owners & as of yet not one is happy that we spoke to. This is why they are getting rid of them as we are going to do the same. We have no intention of spending more money on this pile of junk to keep it repaired.

Engine & running gear is absolutely satisfactory but from there up, is a total different story!!!

I've got a feeling that the post may be a troll post. Every so often a post shows up that is a first and only post that is bashing this brand or that brand with no real details about the issues.

Tiffin has a very loyal following and many seem to take the trip to Red Bay as a pilgrimage to Mecca rather than an inconvenience. For us trips to Red Bay would be out of the question while we are still working. As we get older and have a finite number of days left I would opt to spend them somewhere other than waiting for service at an RV manufacturing facility, but not everyone has had to make the Red Bay pilgrimage. Entegra is still at the top of our list and Tiffin would have to have better track record to get onto that list. Just my humble opinion.

[DSL417]

I don't think troll, although it is interesting the original OP hasn't followed up. At least the discussion is civil with some legitimate concerns and differences highlighted. The interior storage space is an interesting perspective...just don't know how true it is...many times the different arrangement give a differing perspective of storage...who knows.

[Whatnobeer]

Originally Posted by DSL417

I don't think troll, although it is interesting the original OP hasn't followed up. At least the discussion is civil with some legitimate concerns and differences highlighted. The interior storage space is an interesting perspective...just don't know how true it is...many times the different arrangement give a differing perspective of storage...who knows.

I don't think the OP were trolls, it was the guy in the middle that literally threw Tiffin under the Bus (pun intended) and then backed over them. The OP had issues with a Winnebago Tour that has been well documented and I follow their blog to see how everything is going.
The misses and I narrowed our original search to Tiffin, Entegra and Newmar and then narrowed again to just Entegra. We believe in the Entegra brand and what they stand for. We have talked to Joyce in person and have toured the factory and were completely blown away by how things are done. We have never owned a RV in our entire lives and are doing this with the fly by the seat of our pants attitude.

[MRUSA14]

Originally Posted by DSL417

The interior storage space is an interesting perspective...just don't know how true it is...many times the different arrangement give a differing perspective of storage...who knows.

When we moved from our 40 foot Beaver into our 45 foot Anthem, at first we complained to each other that we were moving to a bigger coach but losing storage space! This was an illusion. We were used to storing things certain ways in the old coach, and we had to re-think our storage based on the layout of the Entegra. One we adjusted to the differences, we find that we have much more space in the Anthem, it is just located differently from what we were used to. As a matter of fact, I can't fill it up! For example, the kitchen cabinets are much deeper than we had before, and the over-sofa cabinets are much taller, allowing way more storage.

I think the OP may have had a similar impression to ours, based on his unfamiliarity with all the storage nooks and crannies on the Entegras.