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Old 10-05-2021, 12:33 PM   #1
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Towing a 23DBS question...how much truck do I need?

I recently sold my house, bought a trailer (https://www.outdoorsrvmfg.com/timber-ridge-23dbs/), and now the wife and 2 year old are going to live in it while we search for the perfect home. I can borrow my dad's truck to move the trailer initially but need to get a truck for towing it around and also as a daily driver. The trailer is 28' long, 6400# dry weight, max trailer weight of 10,000#, and dry hitch weight of 700#.

So I had just about decided that I was going to get a Ram 2500 diesel but then was reading more about the F150 3.5L PowerBoost Full Hybrid engine. It sounded like a great option for camping with the built in battery and since I'll also be using this as my around town car I love the better gas mileage (24 mpg) and lower price tag in the Ford vs Ram diesel.

Ford lists the specs on this motor at 570 lb torque, 12,700 max towing, and 2120 max payload. These numbers go down at the trim level I was looking at slightly.
https://www.ford.com/cmslibs/content..._F150_Dec3.pdf

Here's what I'm hoping to get some opinions on, from folks with more experience.

1. I don't want to be anywhere near my max towing capacity. Can the F150 handle this load in real world towing? I know the Ram 2500 is overkill for the job.

2. If the Ford can handle it, and I wanted to build it out closer to a Platinum trim, are there any options to avoid or add? Website doesn't really show how options effect payload, etc....

Asked this question on a Ford F150 forum and got mixed answers ranging from no problem towing to it's super risky. I'm hoping some folks on here would have real world advice/experience with this size trailer.
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Old 10-05-2021, 01:07 PM   #2
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I towed my 280 RKSB at 10,100 lb's for a couple years all over the western U.S. with a loaded for towing 2015 F150 Ecoboost . Was overweight on the GAWR for rear Axle for sure. In 2018 we decided to head across the continent and I was pretty sure I wanted a bigger truck. Got a F-350 loaded for towing and ,,,,,, wished I had got it off the start. Towed the trailer like it was not there , did not notice wind or Semi blow by's anymore and did not have to worry about loading too much stuff in truck or trailer. This summer we traded in on a new orv 20BD which we pick up in a couple weeks and I am still glad we have the F-350 as I can run the trailer up loaded and not worry about weight.
We ran the 280 RKSB with no water , empty grey and black and only took what we needed. With the 20BD and F-350 I can run full water and take whatever I want.
Also the F-150 was working hard at 10,000 lbs and in 3 years we went through a front seal on the motor and ball joint issues . F350 6.7 is just coasting all the time.
After towing the 20 BD at 7500 lbs all over r the Kotenays for 3 weeks Im glad I have the 350 with engine brake. Made towing a non issue. New F350 rides like 150 just taller.
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Old 10-05-2021, 01:12 PM   #3
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Depending on the options the 23DBS comes with the as-delivered dry weight will be a bit more than the listed 6400. Our Mountain Series 23DBS as-delivered dry weight based on the stickers is 7269. ORV's are also known to be tongue heavy. Our normal loaded trailer weight runs between 8000-8500 with an average tongue weight of 1200. I think any of the Timber Ridge class and up ORV's are best handled with a 250/2500 or higher.

As for the F-150 - the higher the trim level the lower the payload. I suspect with a Platinum trim you wouldn't be close to the 2120 payload. When we decided to upgrade to the 23DBS I didn't bother looking at 150/1500. I certainly understand the desire to have the smaller truck and the better unloaded mpg, but in my opinion they just aren't up to the task of safely towing the Timber Ridge models. Interesting that you mention the F-150 hybrid. A couple of weeks ago we were camped across from one of those that was towing an ORV Creek Side 21KVS. Unfortunately I didn't get an opportunity to have a conversation about the truck, but they were using that for their generator.

Since you mentioned the RAM 2500 diesel I would offer this - if you are looking to go with a diesel skip the 250/2500 and move up to the 350/3500 series. The diesel engine in the 250/2500 costs a lot in payload - most that I've seen run around 2200-2400 payload compared to the gas engine. A higher trim level may even dip downwards of 2000 or even a little less. My gas F-250 XLT trim comes in over 3200 which provides a very healthy margin of capability and safety for our 23DBS.
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Old 10-05-2021, 03:05 PM   #4
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See below in Red.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tad12 View Post
I recently sold my house, bought a trailer (https://www.outdoorsrvmfg.com/timber-ridge-23dbs/), and now the wife and 2 year old are going to live in it while we search for the perfect home. I can borrow my dad's truck to move the trailer initially but need to get a truck for towing it around and also as a daily driver. The trailer is 28' long, 6400# dry weight, max trailer weight of 10,000#, and dry hitch weight of 700#.

So I had just about decided that I was going to get a Ram 2500 diesel but then was reading more about the F150 3.5L PowerBoost Full Hybrid engine. It sounded like a great option for camping with the built in battery and since I'll also be using this as my around town car I love the better gas mileage (24 mpg) and lower price tag in the Ford vs Ram diesel.

Ford lists the specs on this motor at 570 lb torque, 12,700 max towing, and 2120 max payload. These numbers go down at the trim level I was looking at slightly.
https://www.ford.com/cmslibs/content..._F150_Dec3.pdf

Here's what I'm hoping to get some opinions on, from folks with more experience.

1. I don't want to be anywhere near my max towing capacity. Can the F150 handle this load in real world towing? I know the Ram 2500 is overkill for the job.

No, the F150 will run out of payload before running out of towing capacity for 23DBS. Three-quarter ton truck like F250 or Ram 2500 is optimal. The 350/3500 are best.

2. If the Ford can handle it, and I wanted to build it out closer to a Platinum trim, are there any options to avoid or add? Website doesn't really show how options effect payload, etc....

Platinum trim is only available as SuperCrew. With no twin pane moonroof, you will be looking at payload of 1,500lbs or less depends on other options.

Asked this question on a Ford F150 forum and got mixed answers ranging from no problem towing to it's super risky. I'm hoping some folks on here would have real world advice/experience with this size trailer.
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Old 10-05-2021, 03:12 PM   #5
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Although the ecoboost 'may' have the tow rating for your trailer the weight of the truck is a lot less then a diesel so you will be more susceptible to sway from crosswind and passing traffic. WAY more enjoyable to tow with diesel power. Also if you do go the diesel route I agree to move up to a 350/3500 unit with SRW.
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Old 10-05-2021, 03:25 PM   #6
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All great advice.

I would add that for a 10K GVWR trailer you could also consider an F250 gasser, as you would obviously regain the payload capacity lost with the heavier diesel engine. However, also think to the future. Already having a 1-ton diesel in the garage would be great if you decide to upsize trailers in a couple of years. You can never have too much truck.

As a side note, I briefly towed our 8300 lb (loaded) TT with a '19 F150 max tow, 3.5 Ecoboost. Plenty of power but living on the edge with regard to payload capacity and rear axle rating. You could special order an F150 equipped with the heavy duty payload package (HDPP), which would give you 300-500 lbs more payload, but it's only available in certain (fairly low level) trim packages. And even then, it's still not giving you the beefier frame, axles, brake etc. that a Super Duty would give you.
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Old 10-05-2021, 05:43 PM   #7
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What they said; way too much trailer for any half ton......it isn't about the power, or even the tow rating, it's about payload. ORV's are very heavy on the tongue (my much smaller 21RBS weights 1,000+ lbs) which makes them tow very well but they require a truck that has a hefty payload rating. I agree 100% that all ORV Timber Ridge series trailers should be considered as requiring a 3/4 ton truck as the minimum TV....most of the Creeksides too.

.....my advice; just say NO to the F150 and stick with your original plan - you will be much happier.


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Old 10-05-2021, 10:51 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ttavasc View Post
Since you mentioned the RAM 2500 diesel I would offer this - if you are looking to go with a diesel skip the 250/2500 and move up to the 350/3500 series. The diesel engine in the 250/2500 costs a lot in payload - most that I've seen run around 2200-2400 payload compared to the gas engine. A higher trim level may even dip downwards of 2000 or even a little less. My gas F-250 XLT trim comes in over 3200 which provides a very healthy margin of capability and safety for our 23DBS.
^^^^^^
This...

When I ordered my lightly-optioned F-350 6.7L Lariat earlier this year it was less than $1,000 to move up from a similarly equipped F-250. I don't know what the price difference is now but it certainly was an easy decision in February.
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Old 10-06-2021, 10:00 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tad12 View Post
I recently sold my house, bought a trailer (https://www.outdoorsrvmfg.com/timber-ridge-23dbs/), and now the wife and 2 year old are going to live in it while we search for the perfect home. I can borrow my dad's truck to move the trailer initially but need to get a truck for towing it around and also as a daily driver. The trailer is 28' long, 6400# dry weight, max trailer weight of 10,000#, and dry hitch weight of 700#.

So I had just about decided that I was going to get a Ram 2500 diesel but then was reading more about the F150 3.5L PowerBoost Full Hybrid engine. It sounded like a great option for camping with the built in battery and since I'll also be using this as my around town car I love the better gas mileage (24 mpg) and lower price tag in the Ford vs Ram diesel.

Ford lists the specs on this motor at 570 lb torque, 12,700 max towing, and 2120 max payload. These numbers go down at the trim level I was looking at slightly.
https://www.ford.com/cmslibs/content..._F150_Dec3.pdf

Here's what I'm hoping to get some opinions on, from folks with more experience.

1. I don't want to be anywhere near my max towing capacity. Can the F150 handle this load in real world towing? I know the Ram 2500 is overkill for the job.

2. If the Ford can handle it, and I wanted to build it out closer to a Platinum trim, are there any options to avoid or add? Website doesn't really show how options effect payload, etc....

Asked this question on a Ford F150 forum and got mixed answers ranging from no problem towing to it's super risky. I'm hoping some folks on here would have real world advice/experience with this size trailer.
It's been said already, but I'll add my 2 cents in. We towed similar weight with our old KZ Connect 281BH. Our TV is an F350 Crewcab 6.7 diesel. It's a beast. We got that because we knew we'd eventually be towing more. If we weren't going to be towing more, we would have went with a Ford superduty with the 7.3L gas. hands down the best gasser set up.

The F150 will tow it, but it will be a white knuckle experience and camping will become a burden instead of a joy. We used to tow with our suburban which meant hours or driving (Seattle to yellowstone on one trip) on top of the tach and reving so high you couldn't talk in the car.

if you have the means, go for a 3/4 or 1 ton.
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Old 10-07-2021, 02:03 AM   #10
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Funnily enough, we hauled our 25RTS down a wet nasty marked 20% grade gravel forestry road here on Vancouver Island with our F350 Limited 6.7 last week, and if that confidence and full cobtrol inspiring downhill haul didn't seal the deal for me on choosing the right truck for the job... then pulling it back up the same grade this morning sure did. And the only reason I even mention the Limited trim is that even though I fell into finding this, specific truck... the 350 doesn't care what trim level you choose or desire, it still pulls like a rabid freight train anywhere and everywhere. People comment on this all the time, and I'll add my name to the list.... you never ever see anyone complain that they bought too much truck for the job.
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Old 10-07-2021, 06:51 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tad12 View Post
I recently sold my house, bought a trailer (https://www.outdoorsrvmfg.com/timber-ridge-23dbs/), and now the wife and 2 year old are going to live in it while we search for the perfect home. I can borrow my dad's truck to move the trailer initially but need to get a truck for towing it around and also as a daily driver. The trailer is 28' long, 6400# dry weight, max trailer weight of 10,000#, and dry hitch weight of 700#.

So I had just about decided that I was going to get a Ram 2500 diesel but then was reading more about the F150 3.5L PowerBoost Full Hybrid engine. It sounded like a great option for camping with the built in battery and since I'll also be using this as my around town car I love the better gas mileage (24 mpg) and lower price tag in the Ford vs Ram diesel.

Ford lists the specs on this motor at 570 lb torque, 12,700 max towing, and 2120 max payload. These numbers go down at the trim level I was looking at slightly.
https://www.ford.com/cmslibs/content..._F150_Dec3.pdf

Here's what I'm hoping to get some opinions on, from folks with more experience.

1. I don't want to be anywhere near my max towing capacity. Can the F150 handle this load in real world towing? I know the Ram 2500 is overkill for the job.

2. If the Ford can handle it, and I wanted to build it out closer to a Platinum trim, are there any options to avoid or add? Website doesn't really show how options effect payload, etc....

Asked this question on a Ford F150 forum and got mixed answers ranging from no problem towing to it's super risky. I'm hoping some folks on here would have real world advice/experience with this size trailer.
I haven't read any of the other replies but I'll give you my opinion. I'm picking the same trailer up in two weeks and had a 2019 F150 3.5 eco boost with the max tow package. I live at 6000' and every trip we take goes over the Ike (10k') with a pretty serious grade. We also have a 7 week old and although we aren't full timers we plan to spend 50-60 nights a year in our trailer with an annual trip to British Columbia. After doing a TON of research, I bought a new F350 6.7 Diesel. The payload sticker in my 2019 F150 XLT with max tow package was 1900lb. With real world tongue weights of these trailers in the 1200-1300lb range, plus 200lb for me, 150lb for my wife, we now have 250 pounds of available payload. I would exceed that in gear easily and not have any buffer.

I started looking at new trucks and looked at a Ram 2500 Cummins Laramie mega cab. When I opened the door and looked at the payload sticker it said 2070lb. Ridiculous! That's what brought me to one tons. Pick the truck of your choice but my F350 loaded Lariat short bed has a payload of 3300lb. I think it's much better to have a decent margin for hauling/towing in the mountains and forced induction does much better than a naturally aspirated motor at elevation. Good luck with your search! There's no way I would buy a half ton to tow one of these trailers though, if you already own it you could probably make it work but if you're buying a new truck anyways buy the right tool for the job.


Edit: Also FWIW with 30k on the odometer my F150 averaged just over 21mpg combined. That was a 3.5 eco boost with 10 speed. With 1500 miles on my new F350 I'm averaging 19.6 combined, probably 70% highway/30% city. 6.7l power stroke also with 10 speed. My new truck also has 35" Goodyear Duratrac A/T's.
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Old 10-10-2021, 10:08 AM   #12
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All good info here. Dont buy a truck just so you can charge your batteries. We have a 28dbs.
Backcountry series. Our TV is a ram 3500 dually.
If you buy one used with low miles it doesnt sting
So bad. This things a tank. And i feel very safe
Pulling the trailer. 5600lb payload.
The Dry weight on your tounge of 700 is when you
Pull it off the dealers lot. You will never be that light again. 2200 minus 700minus the cargo weight you and your family and your dog in the
Truck you will be immediatly overweight.
You will wear that truck out in short time.
A 2500 diesel will get 20mpg not towing and best
The ecoboost while towing.
The cost of jumping from a 2500 to a 3500
Is minimal. And youll love the diesel in hill country.
If your going to use this trailer after you buy a new house then you may want to upgrade the trailr in
The future . And you wont have to buy another truck. If not just borrow/rent a truck to
Move it. Youll save thousands.
There are plenty of dually owners that hire out that service.
if you want a genny and a daily driver get a prius.
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Old 10-11-2021, 09:47 AM   #13
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We have a 23DBS and tow with an F350 diesel. As noted above it tows like the trailer is not there and we generally have a TW of ~1200 to 1300 lbs. On our previous F150 that would have put us within 200 to 300 lbs of our total payload! We did trade up to the F350 before we acquired the 23DBS.
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Old 10-11-2021, 08:24 PM   #14
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if you want a genny and a daily driver get a prius.
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