National Parks - Why were they even closed? When/How will they Open?

[RVPioneer]

It could all be part of Bill Gates’ plan to have everyone chipped like our puppies and kitties. That would make it easy to keep track of who is or isn’t in compliance with what our leaders have determined is best for us.

Oh wait, I’ve been watching too many Sci-Fi movies. That could never happen.

[MRUSA14]

Originally Posted by grindstone01

Can you name any society or group that exist with out a leader/government? The country examples you cite may not be yours or mine best choices to live in, but they are successful civilizations.
Social animals/people have to have structure to exist and that is in the form of a leader or government. A weak leader/government will result in a weak group/tribe/country. The strong leaders (human or animal) have the ability to excel and expand their tribes, however all groups will eventually decline and cease to exist, as proven throughout the worlds history.

When you mention "strong leaders" my mind jumps to Hitler, Stalin, and Kim Jong-Un. There has to be some limitation on leaders, or they will lead you off a cliff. I fear that some of that is happening now.

[MRUSA14]

Originally Posted by Highway 4x4

I have also gotten the feeling that the NPS would prefer that we just stay out. Like it's their back yard that they allow us to visit. Their job is so much easier with all tlose pesky people gone. No traffic, trash, people parking everywhere, walking where they should not be, and their dogs gone. Problem is, we are the ones paying them to keep it nice for us. It is ours and they just keep it nice for us, like gardeners. When it's closed they still get paid. They should want us there for us to see the great job they have been doing for us but it sure doesn't feel like that sometimes.

Besides, if they close the parks they get to relax instead of hustle. Some of them will get an extended paid vacation. Why would they not want the parks closed?

[docj]

Originally Posted by MRUSA14

Besides, if they close the parks they get to relax instead of hustle. Some of them will get an extended paid vacation. Why would they not want the parks closed?

We have several friends who are NPS employees, one of whom is even a superintendent at one of the NPS sites. They have a passion for their sites and jobs that is rarely seen these days. A key element of that passion is sharing "their" parks with visitors. None of the people we know would prefer an extended vacation to being able to share their knowledge of their parks with others.

Joel (AKA docj)

[GBB]

From a constitutional lawyer: Current Federal and State law:

You do NOT have to stay home.
You do NOT have to close your business.
You are NOT restricted in your travels.
You are NOT banned from religious assembly.
These are NOT laws, as a law must be passed by your state legislature. And, of course, this has not happened in any of our 50 states.
These following orders are UNLAWFUL “orders”:
Stay at home,
Close your business,
Don’t go to church,
Practice social distancing,
Wear a mask,
No interstate travel etc etc.

These are NOT laws that can carry any kind of criminal penalty for violation. They are at best ONLY guidelines for "suggestion". These "orders" carry NO legitimate force of law with which to back them up.

NO governor nor mayor may craft a law and assign a punishment for its non-compliance. They can't. And, even if one of these tyrants tries to do so, such orders or actions would then be profoundly unconstitutional and a solid basis for compensation to "anyone affected" by them.

The Free Exercise Clause of the First 1st Amendment firmly establishes freedom of religion as a fundamental liberty, and the Due Process Clause of the Fifth 5th Amendment firmly establishes your right to purchase a lawful product in interstate commerce from a willing seller as "fundamental".

Fundamental liberties are in the highest category of liberty, akin to freedom of conscience and speech and press and privacy and travel.

Right to Congregate/Assemble
Per the First 1ST Amendment to the United States Constitution:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Right to Travel:
DESPITE ACTIONS OF POLICE AND LOCAL COURTS, HIGHER COURTS HAVE RULED THAT AMERICAN CITIZENS HAVE A RIGHT TO TRAVEL!!!
Per our 14TH Amendment to the United States Constitution (abridged):
"The right of a citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon in the ordinary course of life and business is a common right which he has under his right to enjoy life and liberty, to acquire and possess property, and to pursue happiness and safety. It includes the right in so doing to use the ordinary and usual conveyances of the day."

Stopping a tyrannical overthrow of the United States AND the WORLD, the stripping of our Liberties & Freedoms BEGINS with YOU. Do your part and STAND UP for yourSELF before you no longer have a self to stand up for!!!

These are the facts.. Stop letting tyrants lie to you. Call them what they really are = Tyrants. 🇺🇸✊🏼🗣
Feel free to copy and share!

[RickNC]

Originally Posted by docj

It's a sad fact that many of those who flaunt the social distance rules and refuse to wear masks will eventually end up contracting the virus and passing it to other people they associate with, both friends and family.



At this point, I've decided to accept that fact and only worry about protecting myself and my spouse. We live in a semi-rural environment. We can avoid contact with people except the once a week or so that we shop to buy groceries and we do that early in the morning when there are few people in the stores. And when we do that we wear masks. Our freezer and storage shed are full of supplies.



I figure we can do that for the ~6-9 months that it may take for the virus to burn itself out, possibly even through a second wave. It will be a somewhat boring lifestyle, but I'd rather be alive than go to a restaurant or bar. Sure, I would love to take the MH out and go someplace, but nothing seems scarier than being on the road and getting ill.



Having been full-timers for more than 9 years, I can look back at the incredible adventures we've had throughout our >65k miles of touring around North America. I hope there will be more such journeys in the future, but, for now, I'd rather be alive and bored than dead and buried!



Joel (AKA docj)

We are on the same page, except we will travel this summer. There is another 300+ places in the NPS than the dozen or so parks that are always crowded. Plus there is a plenty to see and experience elsewhere. We have worked out how to distance ourselves from all these armchair Libertarians and maintain a rigid regimen of hygiene.

[Yosemite77]

Originally Posted by RickNC

…We have worked out how to distance ourselves from all these armchair Libertarians….

Those armchair libertarians are getting tougher to avoid. Some of them are now on the move.
[ATTACH]

[twogypsies]

Originally Posted by MRUSA14

Besides, if they close the parks they get to relax instead of hustle. Some of them will get an extended paid vacation. Why would they not want the parks closed?

From our experience of working closely with National Park employees the typical NP employee wants the parks to stay open. They are proud of their jobs and the parks. That's why they go into the field with such low pay.

[Busskipper]

- - - -

Holy Cr*p - Guys My Mistake, let's get this back to the RV'ing discussion - I just want to Get out of the House and Have a Place to Park the Coach when looking at all these Amazing Places. For the life of me after the first 30 days I could see no reason to continue to keep the National or State Parks Closed.

A comment on the National Park Employees - In my 70+ Years of visiting our National Parks I have not once spoken to - Met or Experienced a Park Ranger that did not treat me with Respect and that was not Willing to Help and Steer me in the Right Direction, Yes, most of them Love their Jobs and the Parks they are in - and Yes many treat them Like they are their Homes - Thank Goodness - And Yes I have seen people in the Parks that are Clueless and that may need someone to give them a little Guidance. (Some need a Kick in the A$$) -

Sorry if I have gotten people to look for the Bad - as that was never my Intent. I just want to see the Parks Open - do we need to start a campaign? send Emails - Make Phone calls - Write letter?...........

I just want to see the Country start to Open - slowly if need be but at least let's get this thing started. The National Parks would be a Great Place to Start.

- - - -

[Busskipper]

Originally Posted by twogypsies

From our experience of working closely with National Park employees the typical NP employee wants the parks to stay open. They are proud of their jobs and the parks. That's why they go into the field with such low pay.

[TXTiger]

Originally Posted by GBB

From a constitutional lawyer: Current Federal and State law:

You do NOT have to stay home.
You do NOT have to close your business.
You are NOT restricted in your travels.
You are NOT banned from religious assembly.
These are NOT laws, as a law must be passed by your state legislature. And, of course, this has not happened in any of our 50 states.
These following orders are UNLAWFUL “orders”:
Stay at home,
Close your business,
Don’t go to church,
Practice social distancing,
Wear a mask,
No interstate travel etc etc.

These are NOT laws that can carry any kind of criminal penalty for violation. They are at best ONLY guidelines for "suggestion". These "orders" carry NO legitimate force of law with which to back them up.

NO governor nor mayor may craft a law and assign a punishment for its non-compliance. They can't. And, even if one of these tyrants tries to do so, such orders or actions would then be profoundly unconstitutional and a solid basis for compensation to "anyone affected" by them.

The Free Exercise Clause of the First 1st Amendment firmly establishes freedom of religion as a fundamental liberty, and the Due Process Clause of the Fifth 5th Amendment firmly establishes your right to purchase a lawful product in interstate commerce from a willing seller as "fundamental".

Fundamental liberties are in the highest category of liberty, akin to freedom of conscience and speech and press and privacy and travel.

Right to Congregate/Assemble
Per the First 1ST Amendment to the United States Constitution:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Right to Travel:
DESPITE ACTIONS OF POLICE AND LOCAL COURTS, HIGHER COURTS HAVE RULED THAT AMERICAN CITIZENS HAVE A RIGHT TO TRAVEL!!!
Per our 14TH Amendment to the United States Constitution (abridged):
"The right of a citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon in the ordinary course of life and business is a common right which he has under his right to enjoy life and liberty, to acquire and possess property, and to pursue happiness and safety. It includes the right in so doing to use the ordinary and usual conveyances of the day."

Stopping a tyrannical overthrow of the United States AND the WORLD, the stripping of our Liberties & Freedoms BEGINS with YOU. Do your part and STAND UP for yourSELF before you no longer have a self to stand up for!!!

These are the facts.. Stop letting tyrants lie to you. Call them what they really are = Tyrants. 🇺🇸✊🏼🗣
Feel free to copy and share!

GBB you are absolutely correct. Unless Martial Law is declared the Constitution is the law of the land and only POTUS or a State Gov can declare Martial Law. A City Mayor, or County Sherriff/Chief of Police can not pass laws. The Mayor is the part of the Executive Branch of government, not the Legislative. Law enforcement enforces laws not makes laws. However a County Health Department can issue health regulations that law enforcement can enforce, like closing business.

[RickNC]

Originally Posted by yosemite77

those armchair libertarians are getting tougher to avoid. Some of them are now on the move.
[attach]

🤣🤣🤣

[RVPioneer]

Originally Posted by Yosemite77

Those armchair libertarians are getting tougher to avoid. Some of them are now on the move.
[ATTACH]

They may be Couch Potatoes, tough to identify without seeing their eyes.

[RickNC]

Originally Posted by RVPioneer

They may be Couch Potatoes, tough to identify without seeing their eyes.