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Old 10-07-2022, 07:22 AM   #99
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Exploding electric vehicles

The EVs caught in Ian in FL are now having their batteries explode from getting wet and corroding. Doesn't sound very environmentally friendly when you consider that these actually run on coal and natural gas, the fossil fuel just gets burned on the back end instead of the front end. Not to mention the consumption of fossil fuels required to mine and produce battery materials. And the fact that all the plastic in them is made from....oil, a fossil fuel.

Firefighters report that the vehicles burn for days. Water doesn't put out lithium fires.
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Old 10-07-2022, 07:37 AM   #100
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This has been coming for awhile. Final approval to fund EV charging stations every 50 miles along highways happened yesterday.



https://news.yahoo.com/states-final-...130035102.html

OH thank God!! FinallyÖ..canít wait to drive by in my 2010 F-150 gas 4WD truck and see my fellow Minnesotans outside to charge there over priced vehicles when its -30 and the wind is 30 mph. With the heater going full blast how many hours will it take???? Now thats funny.
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Old 10-07-2022, 07:40 AM   #101
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The Cybertruck with 500+ miles of EPA range, only needs 180 miles of towing range from 10% to 80% of the battery capacity. Then you can travel 360 miles / day for approximately $90 with only one charging stop for just over 30 minutes. That is 1/3 the cost of a diesel rig @$5/gallon. Perfect national park rig. Also donít forget that travel while at a destination will be 100% free. And before everyone else starts complaining about the camp ground energy usage, most campgrounds already charge more for 50 amp circuits and no one charges Class A motor homes more for use of their third A/C unit. Extended stays already have meter usage charges, which would then also apply.
You are grossly exaggerating the cost of diesel towing. A diesel can tow 360 miles for under $100. I assume you are also exaggerating the cost per KWH of charging the Cybertruck. The diesel will do the trip for less.
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Old 10-07-2022, 08:28 AM   #102
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LOL, except California who doesn't even have enough electricity to handle homes and businesses. We retired and were able to flee. CA has been tearing down power generation facilities for years and now it's paying the price.

BTW, as of 2023, you will not be able to buy ANY RV there with a generator, motor homes included.

So glad we're gone.
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Old 10-07-2022, 08:34 AM   #103
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Agreed, but you never recognized that the long distance charging infrastructure is only for 5% of the total usage of EVís, therefore, most of your arguments about the grid not being able to handle it are pure junk. Also Solar and Wind have excess capacity during the day, which also negates the grid canít handle it misinformation being spread.
As I said, this thread is about long distance and/or others that will be charging during the day. It has nothing to do with charging at home. All the nonsense about home charging is just trolling this thread and isn't applicable.

I can only speak about the Midwest but I can tell you that we have a serious power capacity issue here. Wind is almost worthless and solar is not enough to make up for all the generation plants they are closing. Our utility is VERY worried about simply trying to keep up with existing loads. They will NOT be able to add anything additional for EV charging.
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Old 10-07-2022, 08:51 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by medarwin View Post
The EVs caught in Ian in FL are now having their batteries explode from getting wet and corroding. Doesn't sound very environmentally friendly when you consider that these actually run on coal and natural gas, the fossil fuel just gets burned on the back end instead of the front end. Not to mention the consumption of fossil fuels required to mine and produce battery materials. And the fact that all the plastic in them is made from....oil, a fossil fuel.

Firefighters report that the vehicles burn for days. Water doesn't put out lithium fires.
Might want to check the source of that information. It's coming from one story about one Tesla and the warning is coming from the CFO and State Fire Marshall of Florida. One guy is the Fire Marshal and CFO and they're not in favor of EVs.

As far as water putting out lithium battery fires you might want to to a quick search. Water can extinguish a battery fire but it does take significantly more water. Also, EVs are significantly less like to catch fire than traditional vehicles.

Why is so hard for people to verify this information?
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Old 10-07-2022, 09:10 AM   #105
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Might want to check the source of that information. It's coming from one story about one Tesla and the warning is coming from the CFO and State Fire Marshall of Florida. One guy is the Fire Marshal and CFO and they're not in favor of EVs.

As far as water putting out lithium battery fires you might want to to a quick search. Water can extinguish a battery fire but it does take significantly more water. Also, EVs are significantly less like to catch fire than traditional vehicles.

Why is so hard for people to verify this information?

It isn't. And I did.



https://cameochemicals.noaa.gov/chemical/999


And there IS the possibility that the State Fire Marshall has a good reason not to like cars that catch on fire and cannot effectively be put out with current firefighting technology and equipment. Most cops are against criminals having lethal weapons. I suppose they're biased as well?
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Old 10-07-2022, 09:19 AM   #106
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EVs have voltage and ground sensing at the charge plug. They obviously won't work if the car is submerged, but then, neither will a gas or diesel work well if the filler neck is submerged eh?

So many naysayers here, it's kind of discouraging. It'll be interesting to see what these folks are posting when they're surrounded by EVs and even bigger EVs like HD trucks and such.

I imagine folks heard this all 125 years ago when they were replacing the horse and buggy with EVs, and then later replacing the EVs with gas or diesel engines.
EV may be a city slash heavy suburb answer but it doesn't help those on the outside. Need to put more money into different technology. Saying naysayers isn't helpful when most realize that we can't support EV technology without leaps and bounds in the innovation process. Throwing billions of taxpayer dollars at 3% of the vehicles on the road is wasteful spending...at least until it is ready.
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Old 10-07-2022, 09:33 AM   #107
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Might want to check the source of that information. It's coming from one story about one Tesla and the warning is coming from the CFO and State Fire Marshall of Florida. One guy is the Fire Marshal and CFO and they're not in favor of EVs.

As far as water putting out lithium battery fires you might want to to a quick search. Water can extinguish a battery fire but it does take significantly more water. Also, EVs are significantly less like to catch fire than traditional vehicles.

Why is so hard for people to verify this information?
You have to admit the irony in complaining about the dangers of a lithium battery fire while riding around on a 30 gallon molotov cocktail.
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Old 10-07-2022, 09:35 AM   #108
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It isn't. And I did.



https://cameochemicals.noaa.gov/chemical/999


And there IS the possibility that the State Fire Marshall has a good reason not to like cars that catch on fire and cannot effectively be put out with current firefighting technology and equipment. Most cops are against criminals having lethal weapons. I suppose they're biased as well?

The Tesla in the only story about EV fires after the hurricane was indeed put out by water. And the only source for that single story was a tweet.

Tesla, Nissan, and Volkswagen all recommend water to put out battery fires. It does take large amounts of water but water is the recommended method.
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Old 10-07-2022, 09:43 AM   #109
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You have to admit the irony in complaining about the dangers of a lithium battery fire while riding around on a 30 gallon molotov cocktail.
Especially since an EVs are far less likely to be involved in a fire.

https://www.kbb.com/car-news/study-e...est-car-fires/


Hybrid cars had the most fires but gasoline compared to EV there really is a clear winner.

Gasoline-powered cars, about 1,530. Electric vehicles (EVs) saw just 25 fires per 100,000 sold.

That's of cars sold of each type so it is a fair comparison. .03% to 1.5%.
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Old 10-07-2022, 09:47 AM   #110
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As I said, this thread is about long distance and/or others that will be charging during the day. It has nothing to do with charging at home. All the nonsense about home charging is just trolling this thread and isn't applicable.



I can only speak about the Midwest but I can tell you that we have a serious power capacity issue here. Wind is almost worthless and solar is not enough to make up for all the generation plants they are closing. Our utility is VERY worried about simply trying to keep up with existing loads. They will NOT be able to add anything additional for EV charging.
We can't forget we are transitioning in fuels. There's going to be imbalances for various reasons

On the matter of utilities not being to keep up capacities required for EV charging, it's complicated right? I mean even the great energy state of Texas can't keep the power on.

And I wonder what the net capacity difference really is. What I mean by that is with EV the fossil fuel supply chain for gas requires alot of electrical capacity. Sure, EVs need electric capacity to charge - but is overall electric capacity really increased with EV?
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Old 10-07-2022, 10:14 AM   #111
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This is going to fun and funny to watch. We are so far away from being able to make this viable it's pitiful. California just went through a period and told people NOT to charge their EV's because the power grid could not handle it and it did cause blackouts.

So by all means, put the little charging stations all over and see what happens, MELTDOWN.
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Old 10-07-2022, 10:26 AM   #112
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The EVs caught in Ian in FL are now having their batteries explode from getting wet and corroding. Doesn't sound very environmentally friendly when you consider that these actually run on coal and natural gas, the fossil fuel just gets burned on the back end instead of the front end. Not to mention the consumption of fossil fuels required to mine and produce battery materials. And the fact that all the plastic in them is made from....oil, a fossil fuel.

Firefighters report that the vehicles burn for days. Water doesn't put out lithium fires.
It is nice when you only report half the story. The same gas cars are spewing oil and gasoline into the environment. Even in the dirtiest energy state in the nation EV’s are 25% cleaner overall than gas cars which is also fact. For most they are many time cleaner. As far as fires go, Tesla’s have 10 times less fires than gas cars and all the data is there to prove, so basing any long term decisions on aftermath of a catastrophe because the corrosion fires are more dramatic does not make any common sense.
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