Tesla Semi - What say ye?

[radar]

Originally Posted by moisheh

The power in a CG is not already there. For starters the power to the truck will be metered. The transformers in the CG and the cables could not handle multiple draws. Billions will have to be spent by public utilities to handle the demand from all the vehicles that need power. If a CG put in just a few sites with the power what would you do if your batteries were low and no place to get a charge.

Other than high powered L2 I don’t think you’ll see L3 charging in campgrounds. Or at least not in the next couple decades. I can see campgrounds putting in a half dozen 100 amp L2 EVSE’s on site. KOA is already installing 50 amp L2 EVSE’s on some pedestals on some sites in some campgrounds. It wouldn’t be enough for an overnight charge on a semi but many people stay a few days in an area before moving on. That would work.

But generally speaking I think the mega charger sites are probably a decade away from becoming common at travel plazas etc. Having said that at least Teslas semi’s are able to charge at common Superchargers although that’s only 250 kw. And most are poorly set up for longer vehicles. Ask me how I know. . We manage to make it work most times but sometimes we still have to unhook, and we are only 34 feet long. .

Oh well. Growing pains.

[DrivingDan]

Originally Posted by Marine359

IMO, Musk is not the only innovator in the ev field. There are thousands of engineers smarter than Musk, and millions of dollars being poured into R&D for OTR EV technology.

Tesla actually doesn’t have that great R&D engineering - it’s all production engineering and design. Even more software. The architecture is rather pedestrian, cylindrical batteries (nobody remembers when Steve Jobs went from cylinders to pouches for about a million reasons?) are great for spinning up a production line quickly, and there’s very little R&D required, but it’s not a great battery. And their motors are actually magnet wire wound for gods said - that’s so 1800’s tech! Everybody else is using bar wires. GM did the R&D in the 90’s after the EV1, but it should be obvious that when you’re pushing many amps you want a big wire over many small ones.

Anyhow Teslas are designed for the sole reason of that 30% margin they enjoy - GM has the best R&D in EV’s.

[moisheh]

Here is link to what is happening in Canada. Parcel delivery vehicles should all be electric.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/tru...soll-1.6674348

[Joe Ogiba]

Originally Posted by DrivingDan

Tesla actually doesn’t have that great R&D engineering - it’s all production engineering and design. Even more software. The architecture is rather pedestrian, cylindrical batteries (nobody remembers when Steve Jobs went from cylinders to pouches for about a million reasons?) are great for spinning up a production line quickly, and there’s very little R&D required, but it’s not a great battery. And their motors are actually magnet wire wound for gods said - that’s so 1800’s tech! Everybody else is using bar wires. GM did the R&D in the 90’s after the EV1, but it should be obvious that when you’re pushing many amps you want a big wire over many small ones.

Anyhow Teslas are designed for the sole reason of that 30% margin they enjoy - GM has the best R&D in EV’s.

Is that a joke or what. Do your research before posting clueless crap like that.

[DrivingDan]

Originally Posted by Joe Ogiba

Is that a joke or what. Do your research before posting clueless crap like that.

You should take your own advice. Not trying to start a flame war by any means, but if you don’t like what I say then calm down and respond with something intelligent at least.

• Fact - Tesla uses magnet wire, electronics 101 tells you that’s an inferior engineering design to bar wires and they are one of the few doing so, hint P=IV and skin effect.
• Fact - Tesla uses cylindrical mini cells, unlike all the others using pouches
• Fact - Tesla had a good reason for doing this, but it wasn’t engineering design, but production design
• Fact - The heavy use of aluminum is not for better engineering, it’s for quickly spinning up a production line. A better engineering solution is a mix of metals which is why all the others do it this way - there are some amazing alloys available these days
• Fact - we all owe a huge debt of gratitude to Tesla.
• etc etc …

Tesla is a market leader and has done fantastic work, and they made the right choice for prioritizing making a car that can be produced from zero, but it’s not the case that their engineering design is better (except in software) - that’s a myth the fan boys have perpetuated.

[jharrell]

Originally Posted by DrivingDan

[*]Fact - Tesla uses magnet wire, electronics 101 tells you that’s an inferior engineering design to bar wires and they are one of the few doing so, hint P=IV and skin effect.

I believe Tesla is starting to use hairpin designs, its a 1-2% efficiency gain at most for increased production complexity, but the 3d6/3d7 motor in the 2022 Model 3 and Y is hairpin and I am sure the semi will get a hairpin design at some point.

[Joe Ogiba]

Originally Posted by DrivingDan

You should take your own advice. Not trying to start a flame war by any means, but if you don’t like what I say then calm down and respond with something intelligent at least.

• Fact - Tesla uses magnet wire, electronics 101 tells you that’s an inferior engineering design to bar wires and they are one of the few doing so, hint P=IV and skin effect.
• Fact - Tesla uses cylindrical mini cells, unlike all the others using pouches
• Fact - Tesla had a good reason for doing this, but it wasn’t engineering design, but production design
• Fact - The heavy use of aluminum is not for better engineering, it’s for quickly spinning up a production line. A better engineering solution is a mix of metals which is why all the others do it this way - there are some amazing alloys available these days
• Fact - we all owe a huge debt of gratitude to Tesla.
• etc etc …

Tesla is a market leader and has done fantastic work, and they made the right choice for prioritizing making a car that can be produced from zero, but it’s not the case that their engineering design is better (except in software) - that’s a myth the fan boys have perpetuated.

https://youtu.be/LtOqU2o81iI?t=845






https://youtu.be/FCexImKlnyo


Tesla is years ahead of any other EV company but we have clowns that get their cookies saying other EV companies do it better. Humor me , what EV companies ?

[propchef]

Originally Posted by Joe Ogiba

Tesla is years ahead of any other EV company but we have clowns that get their cookies saying other EV companies do it better. Humor me , what EV companies ?

He answered that quite clearly: GM. He also gave several reasons why.


Rather than posting drag racing videos, if you disagree then stick to the points.

Why is using the older style windings preferred?

Why is using cylindrical batteries a better choice?

Why is using aluminum preferable to other alloys?

Other than random clips from the interwebs, can you explain what makes Tesla so much better than every other maker?

[theoldwizard]

There has been some cost analysis done on this rig. It only makes sense over many years and many, MANY miles.

[BillJinOR]

This tech is compatible with the package delivery company I worked for. In fact I’m sure they are in the process of planning. Out and back 400-500 mile max semis with trailers that are full of packages that rarely fully load the trailers weight capacity The tractor returns to the main hub every morning For refueling , recharging. Also the mandatory lunch hour at the destination/ turnaround center could also be a top off location since the distribution centers already have large power available. It’s all about the infrastructure.
We kept our tractors for at least a million miles. Certainly time for a payout. How that moves to large rv’s I’m not sure but it’s not a huge leap.

[Joe Ogiba]

Originally Posted by propchef

He answered that quite clearly: GM. He also gave several reasons why.


Rather than posting drag racing videos, if you disagree then stick to the points.

Why is using the older style windings preferred?

Why is using cylindrical batteries a better choice?

Why is using aluminum preferable to other alloys?

Other than random clips from the interwebs, can you explain what makes Tesla so much better than every other maker?

GM ? Really ?

https://www.thedrive.com/news/genera...il-2025-report

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYFyiiEwOFI

https://youtu.be/4lGVimLK58g

[kdauto]

It took Tesla 17 years to turn a profit when it announced that 2020 was the first full year of profitability in the company's history. While the company generates substantial revenue from automotive sales and regulatory credits, it took some time to profit due to production costs and supply chain issues.

They will very soon face stiff competition from all makes entering the EV market. They had it pretty much to themselves for many years now. It will be hard for them to compete with big automakers pushing out sub 40k$ BEVs. To add nsult to injury, Tesla is having serious quality control issues in assembly, and many are falling apart after minor usage.

They make a good vehicle, but they scaled up way too fast to keep quality in check, and also too fast to be able to service them in a timely manner.

[radar]

Originally Posted by kdauto

It took Tesla 17 years to turn a profit when it announced that 2020 was the first full year of profitability in the company's history. While the company generates substantial revenue from automotive sales and regulatory credits, it took some time to profit due to production costs and supply chain issues.

They will very soon face stiff competition from all makes entering the EV market. They had it pretty much to themselves for many years now. It will be hard for them to compete with big automakers pushing out sub 40k$ BEVs. To add nsult to injury, Tesla is having serious quality control issues in assembly, and many are falling apart after minor usage.

They make a good vehicle, but they scaled up way too fast to keep quality in check, and also too fast to be able to service them in a timely manner.

Hard to say. We have had two Teslas and both have been flawless both at delivery and almost three years later for the one. Other than tire rotations and washer fluid there has been zero maintenance. We recently sold it as we no longer need two vehicles.

Last march we bought a model Y as we needed the towing package for our new little travel trailer. Of the almost 20,000 kilometers we have put on it about 15200 kilometres have been towing our trailer. Not a glitch and not a rattle and we hit lots of gravelly forestry type roads with it. It is serving us very well.

All anecdotal of course, but that is our experience.

[kdauto]

It wasn't a dig on Tesla as much as commenting that they are far from perfect. I have seen many instances of poor fit and finish. There are several videos on how the steering wheel material degrades prematurely (this was on rental vehicles). We have dozens of cases in small claims for paint on model 3. It tends to flake off on the lower part of the car due to poor design and rock chips. Not great with salted and abrasive covered roads here.

They pushed other OEMs to advance EV technology and production, but I'm not sure they will be able to withstand the competition in the long term. Time will tell.

I think things would be better if the evil leader stuck to a few endeavours at a time and not spread the company so thin. 2-3 decent passenger vehicle models, maybe 1 truck, and that's enough for now.