Community Forums

RV Roadie · 11-08-2002, 06:53 AM

I see the advantages a gooseneck would provide in having the truck bed instantly available on unhitching the rig. It is also a given that the extra length DOES increase stresses to the point trailer frames/pins/pin boxes have been damaged. I just saw some pics of a fiver and truck that had a head on collision with a semi, and thank goodness, they survived. But when I look at that hitch, that held the rig, and think about what would have happened had they had a gooseneck conversion on that rig, well, I honestly don't think it could have held.

Many of us spend a lot of money making upgrades to increase strength and durability, like suspension and axle upgrades, bigger brakes, performance improvements etc. I would hesitate to add an item that is "iffy" at best, and actually degrades strength and durability of our very expensive rigs, at worst.

What makes the difference in the stock trailers with goosenecks is that they are built specifically for the load geometry and stresses.

If I really wanted to go gooseneck, I'd consider ordering the trailer from a custom manufacturer with the frame built specifically for an OEM gooseneck that is built for that rig.

I know that some manufacturers are building gooseneck fivers with living quarters and a place for the horses or other animals behind the living quarters.

The industry frame manufacturers I have spoken to have advised that the only way to be sure would be to have it built before manufacture to the frame.

In checking with a few manufacturers of fivers and fiver frames, they consistently advise that you not use a gooseneck adapter with a stock fiver front frame because of the tremendous increase in torque forces from the added leverage. If you try to pick up a wood chair by the end of one leg with one hand, it is very difficult. But as you move closer to the center it becomes very easy. Same principle at work with the extended gooseneck adapter.

I talked with Bob today up at the Arctic Fox Factory, who make one of the most robust and durable trailers on the market about the possibility of using a gooseneck adapter on one of their rigs, and he advised against it. However he did say that they have manufactured several of their fivers for use with a gooseneck adapter. It involves a lot of reinforcement from what I understand, but he did say that if given notice well before production of the trailer begins they can modify the front frame to safely withstand the greatly added torque of aftermarket gooseneck adapters. It is important to note that Arctic Fox fivers are noted for some of the highest payloads to empty weight ratios, biggest brakes, and heaviest duty suspensions/frames for their size and class. Because of that they have a designation as an "RV Trekker" (RT)classification in the RV Consumer Group Rating book. They are the only brand in that class! "RT" means the strength to handle rougher roads and terrain than other types of trailers. And even they do not recommend using a gooseneck adapter without extensive reinforcement during production.

IMHO those are the only alternatives to get the obvious advantages of the gooseneck, and have the frame and hitch certified to be equal to the task, with a guaranteed margin of safety.

RV

[This message was edited by RV Roadie on November 08, 2002 at 04:51 PM.]

RV Roadie · 11-08-2002, 12:58 PM

I talked today to the engineers and/or factory reps of the top manufacturers of fivers to get a good feel for their feelings on this issue. I asked them each two questions. The first question was "do you recommend, or do not recommend using a gooseneck adapter on one of your fifth wheel trailers?" The second question was "do you make a fifth wheel trailer with a gooseneck as a special order, or have any provisions for adding a gooseneck adapter?"

Here is what the top manufacturers (in my opinion) had to say.

I talked to Bob at Travel Supreme, and he said that they do not recommend using a gooseneck converter with their trailers as built for a fiver hitch.

I talked to Ken at New Horizons, and they do not recommend using an aftermarket gooseneck converter with one of their trailers that are designed for the 5th wheel hitch. However, he did also add that if you want a gooseneck, New Horizons has made them, and will be happy to make your trailer with a gooseneck hitch that will meet all of their safety and quality criteria on special order.

I talked to Don at Automate, and they do not recommend that an aftermarket adapter be used with one of their trailers designed for 5th wheel hitches, but that they will build one with a gooseneck if desired.

From Marion Johnson at Teton: They do not recommend using a gooseneck adapter with one of their trailers designed as a 5th wheel because of the added torque that must be resisted.

The folks at Excel will answer on Monday, as their folks were gone at 5 PM on a Friday! Duh?

I can say that Brian at Excel does not recommend the bolt on converters with their trailers. We are just waiting for their possible workaround.

So for a fairly good survey of the experts and engineers, from what I consider to be the top manufacturers, that is the real skinny.

RV

[This message was edited by RV Roadie on November 08, 2002 at 07:18 PM.]

mjstef · 11-08-2002, 03:08 PM

The liability covers ANY damage from a failure of one of there products. My hitch can be seen at:
View 1
View 2
I only added 16 inces with this adapter and it is straight unlike some others that are offset. It is also remote control by cable so you don't have to climb in the bed to unhook it.

2000 F250 4x4 6spd PSD 3.73 Western Diesel Chip, Guages & Ram-Air.
My Truck 83,000 Miles. My Campground Southeast Diesel rally North Florida Dealer for Western Diesel Performance, Ultra Hitch goosneck adapters American fuel/tool tanks and Jordan Brake Controllers.

vaughn · 11-09-2002, 04:28 PM

I'd betcha that the hitch manufacturer would NOT consider your fiver breaking a "failure" on the part of their hitch.
When I told Cody about theirs breaking my fiver, I did not even get a reply.

Vaughn

scottc · 10-25-2005, 06:47 AM

i have the ranch hitch on my fifth wheel and after reading some of the post i started doing some homework of my own and have gotten an email back from gulfstream this is the type of fifth wheel i have and the said that any damage done to the trailer from the adaptor will not be covered i got this from a source that is at the top what what i understand the place where i got the trailer put the hitch on the trailer and never said anything about warrenty problems come to find out they did not know about the problems they said they will work with me to correct this i have a gulstream sedona 34frbw and it is an 06 so i guess it is back to the drawing board for another hitch thanks for your help and all the good info

JRMora · 10-25-2005, 05:34 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by gearman:
I have checked out a B&W hitch that doesn't have rails. The whole 5th wheel hitch drops into a gooseneck ball hole, but have heard from many that use this system that it flexes real bad.

Photos </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have a B&W and pull a 14k fifth wheel with it. I do some cabinet making and furniture making in my (limited) spare time. I needed a bed that had no rails and wouldn't go with a gooseneck adapter (for all thereasons above). Anyway, I have not experienced any flexing or moving of the hitch yet (we only have a few thousand mile on it). Once it is set in place and torqued down (we all check the torque on our hitch mounts, right?) it is quite stable. FWIW, I have a Line-X'd bed - maybe that helps?

I'd recommend it to anyone who needs a clean bed. Pull Rite is another one, but they are expensive.

Juan

TXiceman · 10-26-2005, 03:55 AM

Some time back, Rusty posted a sketch and formulas for the increased moment arm (torque) placed on the trailer frame by using a G/N adapter on a 5er. I have personally seen two high end 5ers that had the front frame (pin box) damaged and directly caused by the adapter.

If you wnat to use on irregardless of the trailer manufacturers recommendations, I'd ask the adapter manufacturer to give you a no-nonsense, plain English warranty on his letterhead and state that they are fully responsible for any frame damage in the pin box area, no ifs, and, buts or nors.

Ken

Steve Johnson · 10-26-2005, 05:52 PM

Actually, I do the opposite, haul stack's of Gooses and convert the GN to my 5er AirRyde Hitch. Gooses have their place, personally I question the wisedom of haulin a 5er very far off the beaten path. I've done it. . .but the bed and truck frame were a groanin at me.

Cheers,
OTR PU

scottc · 10-31-2005, 06:03 AM

took the adaptor off and put the companion and b&w hitch on looks great i should have spent the money the first time thanks for all the help

Steve & Linda · 12-02-2005, 06:53 PM

I have the B&W turnover ball hitch, and am very pleased with it. No rails on floor and easy to set in truck.

Stephen M · 01-19-2006, 05:10 AM

My wife and I have seen many Trailers involved in turnovers and accidents some, just completely totaled. We went with a 5th wheel because of the stability. One day while coming back from Bakersfield, CA traveling east bound on highway 58, we were traveling though an area where there are High gusty winds and they were particularly strong. We commented that day that we never seen a 5th wheel ever turned over, trying to comfort ourselves as we drove though those winds, when we saw our first 5th wheel turned over from the winds. Upon a closer look we realized that he had been using a Goose Neck Adapter. Of course that is just one mans observation.

Blaster · 01-19-2006, 02:56 PM

When I pulled 5er, had B&W goose neck hitch with 18000 lb 5th wheel that droped in the place of the goose neck ball. When removed hitch from truck, had flat bed on rail's.

allendp · 01-24-2006, 06:05 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by gearman:
Perk, ...... I have checked out a B&W hitch that doesn't have rails. The whole 5th wheel hitch drops into a gooseneck ball hole, but have heard from many that use this system that it flexes real bad.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Used my B&W for 3 years to include a recent 5000 mile roundtrip to the Northwest.

It DOES NOT flex at all - It is a great hitch ! Has shock absorbers built in for side to side motion and rubber mounted upright posts for to and fro motion. Don't even know the trailer is back there.