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Old 02-18-2018, 07:39 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Cowpie1 View Post
I use about 20,000+ gallons of diesel a year commercially, and have for several decades. I can count on one hand the number of months since 2000 that diesel has averaged a lower price than gasoline. And not once has it even come close to the lower price of E85.
Same here only our's is red. I buy diesel 10,000 gallons at a time to fill the transfer tank in our yard. I try to buy low and wait out the peaks, but sometimes it doesn't work out that way. I don't remember diesel being higher than gas until ULSD was forced down our throats. They blamed it on a shortage of refineries that could produce it and it was going to cost $billions to retro. Somehow they got the refineries up to speed, but the price never came back down.

I only brought up the RAM Ecodiesel because the OP was referring to the new GM 1500 diesel.
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Old 02-18-2018, 04:22 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Desert Flyer View Post
Huh?! Then what else as TV? What are you getting at?


SUVs. Minivans. Cars.

4-whl independent suspension, rack & pinion steering and low center of gravity.

Almost always better braking & handling. Better power to weight ratio.

A pickup is a bad compromise. Suitable where IRS rules apply, but not acceptable for high rollover risk. Against some trailers it’s MORE likely to be the source of a loss of control accident.

Back to my previous post: TT first, TV second. Spec the former well, and the range of better TVs grows.

Solo duty predominates. THATS the spec that matters most.
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Old 02-18-2018, 05:41 PM   #31
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New 2019 Silverado 1500 with Duramax 3.0 Inline Six Diesel Option

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Originally Posted by Cowpie1 View Post
Granted, fuel pricing is regional. And I was primarily talking about E85, not regular gasoline. But it is what it is. I can get E85 for between $1.60 and $1.70 in my area. It is one thing to get 22-25 mpg from a Ram 1500 and the Ecodiesel, it is quite another to make that claim regarding a 2500 with a CTD, which is more in line with the 3/4 ton Chevy I have.

I average about 11-12 mpg with E85. That equates to roughly 15 cents a mile. At current pricing of $3.10 for diesel in my area, the same cost per mile would require 22 mpg average from a CTD in a 2500.

Now, my previous Chevy 1500, when using E85 averaged about 13-14 mpg using it. For a Ram 1500 Ecodiesel to match that, it would have to average 25 mpg. So fuel cost on a per mile basis is a wash.

I use about 20,000+ gallons of diesel a year commercially, and have for several decades. I can count on one hand the number of months since 2000 that diesel has averaged a lower price than gasoline. And not once has it even come close to the lower price of E85.


Plenty of us live where E85 isn’t found without trouble or at all. And pure gas returns better mpg, so that has to be factored.

Fuel MUST be priced by BTU to make accurate comparisons.

My annual average the past ten years with a 2004 305HP/555TQ 2500 CTD is 21-mpg. I specd the truck for best FE as part of, “longest life at lowest cost with greatest reliability and ability to work”. 215k miles and $500 in repairs. One set of brakes and tires thus far.

For towing my 35’ TT (specd same way; I’m 45-Years into this as third generation) fuel burn is 17-cpm at today’s price.

Best equipment is one thing. Having a plan formulated to make best use of it quite another. Requires changes in habits.

Given responses I get, that last seems to be Un-American. The miracle motor means continuing to drive like a teenager to most. Won’t work out as a savings.

Quite some years ago I was able to compare my truck to a man with a truly identical truck but with the Hemi, right down to manual transmission. The other comps past vehicle spec of climate, terrain and motivation were the same.

It pencilled our this way. So long as fuel was priced per energetic content, the advantage for diesel was a higher work rating and potentially longer life.

And not until at 200k would this be apparent and only then with the gas motor wearing past viability (actual work, not just tooling around).

If the pump price of diesel became 50-cents higher per gallon, then it was then down sheerly to greater work capacity.

I can easily get 27-mpg highway with this stock truck. Up to 1000-lbs in the bed. It has for years now run around at 7,940-lbs, 1100-1200 above published ship weight. The solo “any load, any weather, any major metro” highway average is 24. That’s the conservative planning number.

My itty bitty 35’ TT isn’t heavy enough to justify a CTD. The other end of the equation was my then occupation where the empty trailers weighed 9k. And a crane would then drop another 13k on top of that.

Which, to end discussion on my part, is the only value of MPG: planning. Projecting the annual fuel budget based on known averages.

Since the latest 400HP gasoline GM half ton can get 25-mpg at the same speed I travel, why buy a diesel? I wouldn’t. Not for a TT.

The lower initial expense, lower operating expense and likely same service life make diesel half tons barely viable in comparison to the real miracle motors (that 6.2L plus 10-auto).
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Old 02-20-2018, 08:01 PM   #32
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And that most likely will be the "RUB"........payload capacity. It may well be rated to tow 11,400 lbs, but my guess is you'll run out of payload before you get close to tow rating
agreed. I am very sceptical, having been burned prior by Ford. Everything points to the diesel mounted to existing chassis, no mods, especially no upgrades to brakes. Ford consistently over-rates its capacities. The truck might be able to pull 11k# at 10mph for 5 miles, but highway speeds for 100 miles? No way I would attempt such. From experience, on highways, the very most I would tow with a F150 is 5k#. The diesel should get higher mpg than the ecoboost, under loads, but this can be the only advantage. The costs may be significantly higher than a gasser, but let's see.
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Old 02-20-2018, 08:06 PM   #33
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Personally I would much rather have seen a little larger engine capable of towing in the 27-28' bunkhouse range. So many myself included, want or need a 28' size TT and many own half tons already and don't want 3/4 tons for picking up milk, 99% of its purpose. I thought the Titan might fill this niche, but they dumbed down the payload.

The torque will probably be better than the 5.3 gasser but the horsepower will be to low.

There are probably tens of thousands of folks looking at TTs that own a half ton, I see this at the RV shows all the time. RV manufacturers know this is a lucrative market, that's why they are trying to build 27-28' trailers which seems to be the sweet spot, out of eggshells.

I see this on this forum all the time, people don't want a huge trailer 30'+, but want couch and dinette and maybe even bunks for kiddos. This is why you see so many Murphy beds.

I don't want to stray off topic to much, this truck might make sense for me if I were to get a Lance. It's torque should be great and HP fine for a smaller lighter trailers.

I think there's a sizable market for a 4-5L diesel with payload similar to Ford's nice f150 with tow package. I would have thought Chevy had the small end diesel covered with the Colorado, the large end with the big Duramax, this could have set right in the middle. Hopefully Nissan will figure this niche out, they are the closest.
from your comments, I would say the Titan XD Diesel would meet your needs entirely.
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Old 02-25-2018, 01:11 PM   #34
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Ok, unless I missed it,, I'll throw this in... First,, very true gas engines are leaps and bounds ahead of engines from me growing up... BUT,,, for a very few,,, when you get to higher elevations,, as in mountains, that diesel will be a blessing... If you like power to go uphill, or in the case of an exhaust brake, going down hill... That gas motor will be like me trying to walk up the hill... (not good) Thats why they make both... Different strokes, different folks... Get what makes you happy. For me, I'll keep my Duramax, it makes me happy... Warms up faster than gas motors when its cold, pulls our "little" 5vr like a dream... Happy Camper !!!
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Old 02-26-2018, 02:03 AM   #35
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Your Dmax warms up faster? Not sure I buy that one. I hardly ever run my 6.0 gasser for more than 30 seconds after starting it up, even during winter weather. By the time I am at the hard surface road about 2 miles away, the engine is at operating temperature. None of my diesels are at full operating temp in that stretch. Now, yours might also reach full operating temp in that distance, but I highly doubt it will be at full operating temp before that as you assert with the same 30 second idle after starting up.

You did know, didn't you, that the Ike Gauntlet test that was done by TFL (2015 I am referring to that I saw all the details on) that showed the results of the 6.0L gasser Chevy 2500 and the 6.6L Dmax Chevy 2500, both loaded to GCWR, the 6.0L only took a tad less than 1.5 minutes longer to climb the grade from a dead stop on I-70 from Silverthorn to the Eisenhower Tunnel? The 6.0L gasser was pulling 13,500 lb of trailer and had a GCWR of 20,500 lb.

Look, I see the benefit in the right application for diesel. But some have a inordinate idea of the benefit ratio of diesel over gas. They each bring something special to the game, and they each have particular weakness and strengths. I run both, daily, and I am quite familiar with those differences. They each have issues the make them a PITA and I have cursed out both gas and diesel engines over the last 50 years of using them. And with the new emissions laden diesels, the cursing has elevated a little.
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Old 02-26-2018, 04:55 AM   #36
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...when you get to higher elevations,, as in mountains, that diesel will be a blessing...
Its not the fact that it's a diesel as much as the fact it's a supercharged engine vs a normally aspirated engine that makes the difference at the altitude.

On a normally aspirated engine you'll have about a 3% loss for every 1,000 ft increase in elevation.

A supercharged gas motor would overcome that loss just the same as a supercharged diesel would.
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Old 02-27-2018, 04:40 AM   #37
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Interesting that the Big 3 are now becoming fully invested in diesels in the 1/2 ton market while our bretern across the pond are taking big steps to outlaw diesel powered vehicles. And where it concerns European enviro's, the fruits and nuts that make up CARB and the EPA are not far behind. They've already had success in shutting down sales of 2017 Ram Ecodisels which took FCA darn near a year to satisfy these over reaching regulators that the engine did indeed meet pollution standards all the while stockpiles of brand new trucks sat rusting away in large storage yards awaiting the government's final blessings. I certainly don't see CARB easing up or backing down anytime soon.
Add to that the significant higher cost of a diesel over gas truck at initial purchase, higher maintenance costs, and significantly higher per gallon diesel fuel over gas; these diesel 1/2 tons are a solution in search of a problem.
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Old 02-28-2018, 09:34 AM   #38
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Interesting comparing HDT market to LDT market. HDT are producing larger, higher torque engines and turning them lower rpm getting great mpg. LDT market smaller, higher rpm.
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Old 02-28-2018, 10:39 AM   #39
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i've been listening to pickup truck debates for 50 years now. Still sounds the same to me.
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