Community Forums

homeagaincda · 02-08-2021, 02:09 PM

We are in the market for a couples travel trailer ~25' and know we will need a new tow vehicle as well. I understand weighing at a CAT scale is the only real way to know what the trailer's loaded weight is, but without the trailer yet, there is nothing to load. So I'm trying to estimate what my future trailer might weigh when fully loaded - and am looking for input from others who have a similar size trailer and travel just as a couple.
Here is what I do know.

-The trailer we are interested in has an unloaded dry weight of just under 5000 lbs, and a GVWR of 7000 lbs.

- we currently have an 18' hybrid and expect that the newer trailer won't be used to carry more "stuff" just because there is room.

- we never carry fresh or grey/black water, and if we chose to carry a little fresh, I can calculate its weight.

- our current inside "stuff" includes groceries for ~5 days, linens/blankets for 2 beds, 2 or 3 sets of towels, dishes / glassware / cutlery for 6, cookware, outdoor grill, folding chairs, toiletries, and the typical few drawers of misc. stuff. Plus clothes / shoes for a week.

- Outside, I carry leveling blocks, water hose, 3 x 25' power cords, a small toolbox and two bicycles. Plus 2 20lb propane tanks and 1 battery. We don't carry a generator, power toys, etc. I anticipate that the new trailer will need the same bunch of stuff and that we won't add more.

Has anyone weighted their trailer dry and full to estimate how much stuff two adults bring? (similar items) .

On our first trip in the spring, I will weigh our current trailer to get this number, but would like an estimate now to help plan our purchase of a suitable tow vehicle.

Any info from others who have weighed with a similar mix of items would be great.
thanks in advance.

Martian · 02-08-2021, 02:43 PM

I have done exactly what you are asking. For the last three trailers. For trips shorter than three weeks, an average is about 600 pounds which includes everything from added hardware to paper towels. On longer trips it will sometimes approach 1000 pounds as there will be multi temperature clothing sets and two small Honda generators for the inevitable boondocking in those awesome locations. All of this includes less than 100 pounds of gear, food and bedding for two twenty pound dogs. On longer trips we tend to bring less food and shop locally or on the route for anything other than out favorite items that may not be available everywhere. Perishables are always gotten on the road near a destination.
The amount that stays in the camper, which is included in the above numbers, is about 300 pounds. That includes added stinky slinky tube, towels, sheets, some outerwear, dishes, toaster, water boiler, silverware, portable vacuum, shaver, hair dryer and electric heater. Probably a few more but that should give you an idea. We do travel with about twenty gallons of fresh water to flush and wash up with while on the road as sometimes a good spot to
stop at is on enough of a tilt that twenty gallons is needed to make sure the pump can pump well. We only carry gray/black water to the nearest dump station if not enjoying full hookups.
Hope this helps you.
P.S. add 110 pounds if we bring the bike rack and bikes.

homeagaincda · 02-08-2021, 03:01 PM

Thank You Martian! I recall the salesman saying to estimate 850 lbs of "stuff" but it was a very short discussion and nothing I would take to the bank. Your estimate of 710 lbs including the bikes is in the same ballpark. It looks like if I estimate 1000 lbs on the high side I should be safe.
My wife really does not like the thought of having to drive a pickup the rest of the year when we are not towing, so we are looking at a large SUV. The SUVs we are considering have tow capacity of 7900 - 8200 lbs and sufficient payload, so an estimated total weight of 5000 lbs dry + 1000 lbs "stuff" gives me a trailer GVWR of 6000 lbs. Although the trailer we are looking at has a GVWR of 7000, I couldn't see how I would ever need to carry 2000 lbs of cargo.

If anyone else wants to provide their estimated cargo weight in their trailer for a couple, that would be great confirmation.

chunker · 02-08-2021, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by homeagaincda

Thank You Martian! I recall the salesman saying to estimate 850 lbs of "stuff" but it was a very short discussion and nothing I would take to the bank. Your estimate of 710 lbs including the bikes is in the same ballpark. It looks like if I estimate 1000 lbs on the high side I should be safe.
My wife really does not like the thought of having to drive a pickup the rest of the year when we are not towing, so we are looking at a large SUV. The SUVs we are considering have tow capacity of 7900 - 8200 lbs and sufficient payload, so an estimated total weight of 5000 lbs dry + 1000 lbs "stuff" gives me a trailer GVWR of 6000 lbs. Although the trailer we are looking at has a GVWR of 7000, I couldn't see how I would ever need to carry 2000 lbs of cargo.

If anyone else wants to provide their estimated cargo weight in their trailer for a couple, that would be great confirmation.

Be careful about using the manufacturers tow rating. It's usually inflated and applies to specifically configured vehicles. As a general rule, an SUV is a good people mover but a poor tow vehicle. Suspensions are soft and those with a short wheel base make towing a challenge. Pickups aren't all that bad to drive regularly. My "car" is a Ram 1500, my truck is a Ram 3500. Toy is a Miata or HD.

homeagaincda · 02-08-2021, 03:45 PM

Thanks Chunker
I do wonder about the suitability of an SUV for a tow vehicle and how it will handle. I get that a 1500 pickup will likely be better, but my wife REALLY doesn't want a pickup.

I will say that on a test drive several months ago, the pickup did drive very nicely, but the turning radius was WAY bigger than the SUV - explaining why in shopping centers I see pickups driving in the wrong side of the parking lot "lanes" so they can try to turn into parking spots.

Overall, she would be much happier with a full size SUV than a pickup.
But we have to be safe.

Re towing ratings and particular configurations, I will be sure to get whatever options and drive train choices that provide sufficient tow capacity, and what seems to be the limiting factor, cargo capacity. Your input regarding the softer suspension and shorter wheelbase will need to be factored into our decision as I suspect that is harder to "calculate" until the towing actually happens - too late to make a change then.

Martian · 02-08-2021, 04:35 PM

I don't understand your wife not wanting to drive a pickup but being ok with driving an SUV. Most pickups, except the most basic fleet levels, rival most SUV interiors and if you do not look back to the bed you would not know the difference. A crew cab offers the same seating and may be a bit wider. Another bonus is that if you get a good weathertight cover you have a trunk any SUV owner would kill for. Example: my wife would never drive my old 2004 Dodge Dakota and had to drive her Rav4. Fast forward to my 2018 Ram Crew Cab and she always wants the driver seat and has a hissy fit if it is suggested she drive the Rav4. Now it mostly just sits in the carport unless we need to go two different places.
On edit, that longer wheel base will make the pickup a safer tow vehicle.

chunker · 02-09-2021, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by homeagaincda

Thanks Chunker
I do wonder about the suitability of an SUV for a tow vehicle and how it will handle. I get that a 1500 pickup will likely be better, but my wife REALLY doesn't want a pickup.

I will say that on a test drive several months ago, the pickup did drive very nicely, but the turning radius was WAY bigger than the SUV - explaining why in shopping centers I see pickups driving in the wrong side of the parking lot "lanes" so they can try to turn into parking spots.

Overall, she would be much happier with a full size SUV than a pickup.
But we have to be safe.

Re towing ratings and particular configurations, I will be sure to get whatever options and drive train choices that provide sufficient tow capacity, and what seems to be the limiting factor, cargo capacity. Your input regarding the softer suspension and shorter wheelbase will need to be factored into our decision as I suspect that is harder to "calculate" until the towing actually happens - too late to make a change then.

I'm not saying an SUV can't be a good tow vehicle but there will be significant limitations. For any conventional trailer 25' and SUV with body on frame, not unibody and properly selected may work. I'm not an SUV person as they are really just re-named station wagons. Half-ton pickups are not created equal and the towing capabilities vary widely. Don't expect correct guidance from an RV dealer since they want to sell an RV and many/most know little about actual towing. Don't expect much better at car dealers either. Turnover of sales staff is huge typically and most sales persons have little time to know their product much less what an RV weighs or requires for towing.

Not saying we are "experts" here but many posters have good knowledge to pass on. Most of us have bought the RV only to find we don't have enough tow vehicle and have to upgrade it to be safe and within limits. Rarely does someone find that they have too much truck. Whatever RV you have this year is unlikely to be the last and earlier in the RV experience the tendency is to go bigger. You see where this is going. If a pop-up or 15' Scotty is your final trailer then a smaller tow vehicle will work.

Dave Pelletier · 02-09-2021, 09:16 AM

IMO the real answer is that you should buy a tow vehicle that can handle the trailer's GVWR of 7,000 lbs.

Sure there are SUV's that can handle that trailer; but they are all half ton truck based! The smaller, shorter wheelbase, unibody ones won't be adequate. Whether you buy a Tahoe, Suburban or Expedition (for eg.) or an F150 or 1500 Chev pickup, all are likely fine, a RAV4 or Jeep Wrangler is not.

As always, check the tow vehicles capacities, etc. etc. ......but really, really think before buying too light a tow vehicle and making the same mistake that costs so many people thousands of dollars upgrading as soon as the deficiency becomes obvious.

Oh and FWIW, I carried 600 - 800 lbs in my truck camper.

2 cents,
Dave

jeff0210 · 02-09-2021, 09:28 AM

Not a straight up answer to your question. Might want to calculate for an upscaled trailer size. Many people find out after the first year or so they want a little more room, or that they are going to be camping a little more often. Upgrading to a larger trailer is one thing. To a trailer and truck at the same time is another. Good luck on all your journeys.

scrapperjohn · 02-09-2021, 09:34 AM

Totally ignore the dry weight numbers.
Look at the GVWR of trailer.
By the time you load up, water, gear...
Most of us are approaching the GVWR...

chaps2018 · 02-09-2021, 11:06 AM

We carry all the things you mentioned along with 2 weeks of clothes. (Covering 4 seasons). Our 40’ 5’er weighed cargo is 1200#. For an additional datapoint, our 35’ TT weighed cargo was 1000#.

kdauto · 02-09-2021, 12:17 PM

Well, I thought I had explained all this in your other post on SUV as a tow vehicle?

Did you check the sticky thread on tow vehicle sizing at the top of this forum? There are calculators and formulas as well as lots of advice already printed on this stuff. It sure sounds like you're trying to justify an inferior tow vehicle, like many have before.

I have pulled 4000 lbs with a 2700 lb VW Jetta before. Was it wise? NO. Did I drive fast? NO. Would I try to have fun doing this, no!

You can slice this any way you want to, but I would suspect with a full freshwater tank, normal, average person loading of gear,clothes and food and you will be near the GVWR and possibly over. If you really,really think you'll be driving with empty tanks all the time you can figure how much to deduct from GVWR of trailer, but don't forget, you never totally 100% epty fresh, grey or black tanks and it's highly unlikely you drive with empty tanks once you enjoy the freedom of using a trailer as it should be used, a mobile self-contained housing unit.

homeagaincda · 02-09-2021, 01:54 PM

Thanks Chunker, and all, for the advice.
FYI the SUV that we are considering is the 2021 Tahoe, which I'm told use the same frame as the Silverado 1/2 ton. (but has a shorter wheelbase).
This trailer would be our "last" trailer, having moved from a pop-up to a hybrid over the past 25+ years. While we hope to use it more as we approach retirement, we won't be going larger to the 30' plus sizes.

The info all of you have given re the weight of what we should expect to carry is helpful.

kdauto · 02-09-2021, 04:39 PM

Specs on the Tahoe are kinda shady regarding trailering and especially payload. If you really want to go that route, a Suburban has an extra 12+" of wheelbase and I'm almost sure actual payload will be higher for the same trim and configuration.

I would definitely check the yellow sticker in the driver door jamb before pulling the trigger. 7600lb or 8100lb towing capacity can actually mean a 6000lb maximum trailer once actual payload and rear axle weight/tongue weight are factored in.