Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > TRAVEL TRAILER, 5th WHEEL & TRUCK CAMPER FORUMS > Trailer Towing and Tow Vehicles Discussion
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-19-2016, 11:48 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
jbenoit28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 291
To Dually or not to Dually?

I've read several threads on this subject and I think I have my answer but I wanted to get confirmation. My wife and I are considering a fifth wheel in a few years. We would like to get our truck first so that it will be easier towing our current TT until we are ready for the 5th wheel. We went to the Tampa RV show and saw several bunkhouse models. Using one of those for a model I have the following specs: Avalanche 391TG - GVWR 16,000 lbs, Max pin (figure 20%) 3,200 lbs, length is 39'5". Our target truck would likely be a 2012 or newer Ford 350/450 Crewcab 4X4 DRW. I'm excluding the F350 SRW due to the pin weight being over the 2,900 lbs cargo capacity and the GVWR of the trailer exceeding the 15,700 lbs max fifth wheel towing capacity. Did I read the towing guide for 2012 correctly?

If so, would it make much of a difference between a short bed/long bed version of those trucks aside from the need for a sliding hitch on the short bed?

Thanks in advance for helping me check my homework.

Joe
__________________
2005 Ford Excursion Diesel 4X4 with Roadmaster Active Suspension, F350 1 3/16" rear sway bar, Bilstein shocks & steering damper.
2012 Sprinter 311BHS
jbenoit28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 01-19-2016, 03:33 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 773
I think your math is correct.
The choice between LB and SB also influences the cost of the hitch. SB will require a sliding hitch = more $, other things being equal.
__________________
2012 Dodge C3500 DRW 4x4 Long Box, WeatherGuard 90 Gal transfer tank, B&W Companion Hitch
2012 Keystone Montana 3100RL, 520W Solar, 460AH batteries, Morningstar MPPT 45 CC, Bogart 2030RV monitor.
drdarrin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2016, 03:50 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 515
If you want a SRW, look at a newer truck. The GVWR has gone up enough to handle the pin weight. A DRW is a better choice when towing, but whether its worth it the rest of the time depends on how frequently you will be towing and where you park when you go shopping. You also don't necessarily need a sliding hitch with SB due to the design of the front of most modern mid-weight 5th wheels.
cwsqbm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2016, 04:46 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Roam America's Avatar
 
Texas Boomers Club
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Somewhere in the lower 48
Posts: 2,308
I've been driving a dually for over 10 years now. I've never had a problem in parking lots, drive thru lanes, or general driving around town. And I do not park at the far end of the parking lot. In fact since going full time, it is our only vehicle so it is our daily driver. My better half drives it too without problems.The ONLY thing I have not been able to do with my dually is go thru a car wash; but then that may be a God send.

Our last 2 trucks have been F-450's. I can honestly say it pulls my 5er so nicely that at times I forget it is there.
__________________
John, Joyce and Zoie (our 17# Guard Dog)
2018 Ford F-450 KR / 2019 Mobile Suites 40KSSB4
Fulltiming since 2008 and loving it
Roam America is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2016, 04:53 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,442
Dually if you are planning ahead. Not many complain about too much truck. But there are hours of reading of people who bought too little truck and are either looking to somehow beef too little truck up or replace too little truck. Some even will argue that too little truck can do the job despite published tow ratings by the manufacturer, math and common sense. Dually.
__________________
2014 Raptor 300MP, 2014 Cowboy Cadillac - Ram 3500 Crew Cab Long Bed Longhorn 6.7 Cummins Turbo Diesel DRW 4.10 Rear End, 5588 Payload, Firestone Airbags, Curt Q20, TST507
raineman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2016, 05:03 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 982
Go dually. We loved ours for 7 years. Just like Kstar never had an issue as our daily driver. Liked the long bed as well. However we did not have 4WD and never ever missed it.
__________________
Ron & Linda
2000 Dynasty 38PBS
Full time since 2007
Nana25K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2016, 05:58 PM   #7
Moderator Emeritus
 
SmokeyWren's Avatar


 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: HillBilly country, Smokey Mtns
Posts: 4,171
You need a Dooley

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbenoit28 View Post
I'm excluding the F350 SRW due to the pin weight being over the 2,900 lbs cargo capacity and the GVWR of the trailer exceeding the 15,700 lbs max fifth wheel towing capacity. Did I read the towing guide for 2012 correctly?
I read it a little differently.

2012 F-350 4x4 SRW CrewCab shorty diesel
GCWR 23.500
Tow rating 14,900 (means the truck weighs 8600 pounds)
GVWR 11,500
3,086 max weight of a truck camper or hitch weight of a trailer (means the truck with all passengers weighs 8,414)

I would estimate the weight of the wet and loaded F-350 XLT SRW CrewCab 4x4 PSD at 9,000 pounds, resulting in a max "real world" tow rating at about 14,500. (23,500 minus 9,000 = 14,500). That includes Mom and Pop and two kids and at least one big dog, along with a toolbox full of tools and maybe the first night's campfire wood.

With trailer GVWR of 16k, you'd have to pay attention to keep the gross weight of the trailer down to 14,500 or less.

However, exceeding the GCWR is not a show stopper unless you plan to spend most of your towing in hills and mountains. GCWR tells you the most combined weight your drivetrain can pull over the hills and passes without overheating anything in the drivetrain, and without being the slowpoke holding up traffic. If you stay out of hills and mountains, then GCWR is not a big concern.


But the show stopper is you'll be exceeding the GVWR (and payload capacity) of the SRW. 11,500 minus 9,000 = 2,500 pounds available for hitch weight. Your hitch weight will be closer to 3,000 pounds. So for me the SRW is a non-starter for dragging that trailer. You need a Dooley (yeah, spelling borrowed from Tom Dooley).
__________________
Grumpy ole man with over 60 years towing experience. Now my heaviest trailer is a 7'x16' 5,000-pound flatbed utility trailer, my tow vehicle is a 2019 F-150 Lariat 3.5L EcoBoost SuperCab with Max Tow (1,904 pounds payload capacity).
SmokeyWren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2016, 06:04 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
450Donn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dallas,OR
Posts: 4,584
If I had thought ahead back in 2004 I would have bought a dually then and saved thousands in mistakes. If your going large fiver a dually is really the only smart choice. Needing a 4500 series? Naw! My current fiver has a scaled pin of 3500 pounds and I do just fine with a 3500 dually without exceeding any of the numbers
__________________
Don and Lorri
Resident Dummy.
450Donn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2016, 08:11 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
jbenoit28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 291
Thanks for all of the good info! We'll look for a Dually 350/450 for our next TV. Gotta start saving my pennies now. I'd expect the Dually should make it much easier for my wife to drive the rig from a stability standpoint.

Joe
__________________
2005 Ford Excursion Diesel 4X4 with Roadmaster Active Suspension, F350 1 3/16" rear sway bar, Bilstein shocks & steering damper.
2012 Sprinter 311BHS
jbenoit28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2016, 08:14 AM   #10
Member
 
SrFox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 98
Smart choice going with the dually! We love ours!
__________________
Mobile Suites - F350
2015 Dropbox Photo logs at https://goo.gl/2tNP1v
2016 Dropbox Photo log at https://goo.gl/RN0FKO
SrFox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2016, 09:52 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
tuffr2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Palm Coast Florida
Posts: 12,995
I have the 8' bed and love it. It allows me to back into spots worry free plus will carry lots of other stuff from firewood to kayaks.
tuffr2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2016, 11:33 AM   #12
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,346
"Max pin (figure 20%) 3,200 lbs" sorry but if using a 5er for full time use the pin can hit 25% no problem. So that 3,200# pin can easily be 4,000#. Best to plan on the higher number.
Cummins12V98 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2016, 02:09 PM   #13
Moderator Emeritus
 
SmokeyWren's Avatar


 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: HillBilly country, Smokey Mtns
Posts: 4,171
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbenoit28 View Post
We'll look for a Dually 350/450 for our next TV.
Understand that the F-450 pickup comes only as a CrewCab diesel with 4.30 limited slip axle and the 8' bed. If you want a shorter F-450, or a gasser, then you have to find an F-450 ChassisCab and add a bed of some sort that will accept a 5er hitch, or at least a gooseneck hitch. The F-450 chassis cab comes with any of the three cabs, but the shortest cab-to-axle length is a couple of inches longer than a longbed pickup.

The F-350 DRW has a lot more choice in configuration - regular cab, SuperCab or CrewCab, gas or diesel engine, and your choice of open or optional LS axle.

Just for grins, I built a 2016 F-450 chassis cab SuperCab gasser on Ford.com. If I wanted a SuperCab gasser, this is it:

Model
o $42,820 base MSRP for 2016 Ford F-450 Chassis Cab XLT SuperCab, 162” Wheelbase, 6.8L 3-Valve SOHC EFI V10 Engine, TorqShift® 5-Speed SelectShift Automatic® Transmission - O/D, 4x2, 4.88 Limited-Slip Axle Ratio, DRW

$42,820 Base MSRP
$3,180 Total of Options
$1,195 Destination Charges
$47,195 Total MSRP ($42,476 cash price, minus any Ford rebate, plus bed and TT&L)

Options added:
Equipment Groups
o $795 XLT Interior Package
Exterior
o $405 rear backlight Power Sliding w/Privacy Glass and Defrost
o $350 Spare Tire & Wheel (no, a spare is not standard on a Chassis Cab)
o $165 PowerScope® Trailer Tow Mirrors (power glass, fold and telescope) Std tow mirrors are not power fold/telescope.
o $370 6" Angular Black Molded-in-Color Running Board
o $1,095 19.5" Forged Polished Aluminum Wheels with Bright Hub Covers
o $0 225/70Rx19.5G BSW A/S (6) Tires std
Interior
o $0 Steering Wheel Audio Controls
o $0 Cloth 40/20/40 Split-Bench Seats
Standard Features
Interior Features
• Air Conditioning – Manual Temperature Control
• AM/FM Stereo with Single CD, digital clock and four speakers
• SYNC® Communications and Entertainment System
• Power Equipment - door locks and windows with one-touch up and down driver and passenger window, power glass in tow mirrors
• Cruise control
• Steering Wheel Audio Controls
• Tilt/Telescoping steering wheel
• Upfitter switches located on instrument panel (4)
• Windshield wipers – interval control
Exterior Features
• Window - flip-open rear quarter (SuperCab)
Power and Handling
• Engine - 6.8L 3-valve SOHC EFI V10 engine
• TorqShift® Heavy-Duty 5-speed SelectShift™ Automatic Transmission
• Alternator - 175 amp Heavy-Duty (6.8L gas engine only)
• Axle - Mono-beam front axle with coil spring suspension – ( F-450 )
• Brakes – 4-wheel power disc brakes with Anti-lock Brake System (ABS); Hydro-boost (DRW)
• Engine-Only Traction Control (EOTC) (DRW)
• 40 Gallon aft-axle (F-450)
• Stabilizer bar – front
• Steering – power
• Steering damper
• Integrated Trailer Brake Controller
• 225/70Rx19.5G BSW A/S (6) + optional spare
__________________
Grumpy ole man with over 60 years towing experience. Now my heaviest trailer is a 7'x16' 5,000-pound flatbed utility trailer, my tow vehicle is a 2019 F-150 Lariat 3.5L EcoBoost SuperCab with Max Tow (1,904 pounds payload capacity).
SmokeyWren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 11:20 AM   #14
Senior Member
 
jbenoit28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 291
When we move to the truck, we will need the CrewCab and 4X4 anyway so the F450 will be fine. I never thought I'd need 4 wheel drive until last March. I would have been in a serious pickle without it. Very tight and steep ascending turn on gravel road...back tires gave up even at a very low speed. Glad for that switch on my dash

This is a little off topic, but I noticed several of the Bunkhouse 5th wheels we liked had twin axles rated at 7K each. The trailer had a GVWR of 16K. So they don't give you any extra on this? Doing the math, the trailer depends on the truck carrying the extra weight. That seems like a bad situation if you find a few compression dips in the road that will overstress the axles for an instant. I have a feeling someone is going to reply with "that's how they build them to save money" or similar. Bummer.

Joe
__________________
2005 Ford Excursion Diesel 4X4 with Roadmaster Active Suspension, F350 1 3/16" rear sway bar, Bilstein shocks & steering damper.
2012 Sprinter 311BHS
jbenoit28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Dually Valves Install - Tire Balance Required? StringFellow Class C Motorhome Discussions 3 07-18-2015 08:12 PM
Light camper on dually truck 8ftangler Truck Camper Discussion 1 07-18-2015 12:52 PM
Dually Truck / Car Wash Question tuffr2 Trailer Towing and Tow Vehicles Discussion 15 06-03-2015 05:12 PM
Towing a Dually (3500 lb rated truck - 6 wheels) ehuwebeltz Toads and Motorhome Related Towing 2 01-28-2015 01:44 PM
Dually Valve Stems RJEV MH-General Discussions & Problems 10 01-18-2014 05:35 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.