Community Forums

NeedToRetire · 01-08-2025, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Pelletier

Good advice so far but I'll be that guy and provide a bit of a counterpoint - though the GAWR and tire ratings are important, it's best to stay within ALL the manufacturer's ratings including GVWR/Payload.

The door sticker has these numbers listed:

Front GAWR = 5,990 LBS
Rear GAWR = 6,340 LBS

Dave Pelletier · 01-08-2025, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeedToRetire

The door sticker has these numbers listed:

Front GAWR = 5,990 LBS
Rear GAWR = 6,340 LBS

Yep. I'd recommend weighing the loaded truck to get the real numbers which will allow you to see what you have available for payload (GVWR minus loaded weight) and GAWR (loaded rear axle weight vs. GAWR).

On paper you have 2,564 lbs payload and probably just over 3,000 lbs worth of margin on the GAWR - rear. Remember that you need to allow for a hitch and the pin weight of the trailer and deduct that from whatever numbers you get - as I said before, 5th wheel pin weights are usually 20 - 22% so it's prudent to allow for at least 20% of the proposed 5th wheel's GVWR.

Congrats on the upcoming retirement.....I'm a few years away myself.

Cheers,
Dave

joerone · 01-09-2025, 08:28 PM

Sorry, didn't notice that

NeedToRetire · 01-09-2025, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joerone

Sorry, didn't notice that

No problem, thanks for helping.

NeedToRetire · 01-11-2025, 11:06 AM

So, we went to our third or 4th RV show yesterday, over the last 2-3 years. We think our favorite camper size, that fits our criteria for living in it for a couple month a year, is a Cougar Fifth wheel model 29RLS, that overall length is 33’ 8”

Here are the spec’s for camper:

Dry weight: 10,500
Cargo Max: 2,300
Total Gross: 12,800
Claimed Pin weight: 2,060

When I rerun my trucks capabilities using the VIN on the Ford towing Calculator, I get these results when I enter Passengers weight and shift all gear to the fifth wheel/no cargo except the pin weight.

Ford Says:
Max 5th Wheel Trailer weight: 14,200
Max Pin weight : 2130

The number on paper seem in line, but as mentioned here by others, if the true pin weight is 20% which would be 2,560 LBS for the camper I listed, putting me over the recommended pin by 430lbs. Is being over the max cargo potentially by 400lbs going to be that adverse to the trucks overall well being? I would love to be able to connect to it and take to the scales, but that is not an option.

Since we are not currently ready to hit the buy button, its right now in the figuring stage and I figure my truck would probably handle it ok, barring overloading the camper with too much weight and being mindful of the maxing out the truck, weight wise. Like I mentioned previously, the 6.7 PS with the 10 speed has the power to move mountains, so not concerned there.

Just rereading this makes me think I need to shop a lesser GVW 5er, maybe shop another 1,000 LBS less. The camper listed above seems perfect for us. I will have to keep looking before pulling any triggers, I don't wont to be over the max if the pin weight is really going to be 20%.

Dave Pelletier · 01-13-2025, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeedToRetire

So, we went to our third or 4th RV show yesterday, over the last 2-3 years. We think our favorite camper size, that fits our criteria for living in it for a couple month a year, is a Cougar Fifth wheel model 29RLS, that overall length is 33’ 8”

Here are the spec’s for camper:

Dry weight: 10,500
Cargo Max: 2,300
Total Gross: 12,800
Claimed Pin weight: 2,060

When I rerun my trucks capabilities using the VIN on the Ford towing Calculator, I get these results when I enter Passengers weight and shift all gear to the fifth wheel/no cargo except the pin weight.

Ford Says:
Max 5th Wheel Trailer weight: 14,200
Max Pin weight : 2130

The number on paper seem in line, but as mentioned here by others, if the true pin weight is 20% which would be 2,560 LBS for the camper I listed, putting me over the recommended pin by 430lbs. Is being over the max cargo potentially by 400lbs going to be that adverse to the trucks overall well being? I would love to be able to connect to it and take to the scales, but that is not an option.

Since we are not currently ready to hit the buy button, its right now in the figuring stage and I figure my truck would probably handle it ok, barring overloading the camper with too much weight and being mindful of the maxing out the truck, weight wise. Like I mentioned previously, the 6.7 PS with the 10 speed has the power to move mountains, so not concerned there.

Just rereading this makes me think I need to shop a lesser GVW 5er, maybe shop another 1,000 LBS less. The camper listed above seems perfect for us. I will have to keep looking before pulling any triggers, I don't wont to be over the max if the pin weight is really going to be 20%.

Hooking it up and going over the scales wouldn't help you either if it was still empty.

Bottom line is that you should allow for 20% of GVWR (note that the dry pin weight is 20% of the dry trailer weight and the bulk of the storage is at the front so not much chance the loaded pin weight is going to be less than 20% and could easily be more) which is going to be 2,560 or almost exactly equal to your rated payload......of course that doesn't allow for passengers or gear in the truck, the 5th wheel hitch, etc. The GAWR is going to be close but you're probably going to be over your truck's GVWR by 500 lbs minimum. ....maybe a bit more, maybe a bit less.

Can your truck do it? Absolutely; there are thousands of people running over GVWR towing fifth wheels. It certainly isn't going to disintegrate upon hooking that 5er up and, in reality, there aren't that many physical differences between a well equipped F250 and an F350 SRW. Many will say you'll be just fine with nothing to worry about and that may be true. You will also get many opinions that the payload/GVWR of the truck doesn't matter only the GAWR and tire ratings..... keep in mind you are potentially going to be very close to the GAWR with that 12,800 lb 5er.....tires can be upgraded if necessary. Should you do it? That's up to you; as I said before, I'd personally be looking for a 5th wheel with a GVWR closer to 10-11k or so.

Cheers,
Dave

NeedToRetire · 01-13-2025, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Pelletier

I'd personally be looking for a 5th wheel with a GVWR closer to 10-11k or so.

That is ultimately what we will do Dave. I spent some time this weekend combing through different manufacturers on the net and found a decent amount of fifth-wheels made under 10,000lbs that have the layout we prefer. If we get to the point of making a move on one, I will make sure the weight is below my truck's capabilities and not at or over the max.

I incorrectly assumed for years camping seeing 3/4 ton trucks towing massive fifth-wheels that it wouldn't be an issue, but I'm guessing, it must mean a lot of people are towing over their trucks max. I also bought my truck with the Fifth wheel prep package, I guess Ford should named it the "Light" Fifth wheel package. LOL.. My bad for not boning up on camper weights better before buying my truck, but then again I didn't want a semi as my daily driver.

4x4ord · 01-13-2025, 12:47 PM

Had you come on the forum with questions prior to purchasing a truck for a 12000 lb fifth wheel you would have been steered toward a F350 SRW. Because you’ve already bought the truck I would encourage you to look into exactly what components are different on your truck vs the F350 before committing to a lighter trailer. Your truck might actually be identical other than badging and stickers or it might be missing the overload springs? Brakes and axles are identical. If I was in your shoes I’d check the weight rating of my tires, add air bags if necessary and call my truck an F350. (My 2023 F350 has 3750 lb tire rating. My guess is yours are the same.)

NeedToRetire · 01-13-2025, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4ord

Had you come on the forum with questions prior to purchasing a truck for a 12000 lb fifth wheel you would have been steered toward a F350 SRW. Because you’ve already bought the truck I would encourage you to look into exactly what components are different on your truck vs the F350 before committing to a lighter trailer. Your truck might actually be identical other than badging and stickers or it might be missing the overload springs? Brakes and axles are identical. If I was in your shoes I’d check the weight rating of my tires, add air bags if necessary and call my truck an F350. (My 2023 F350 has 3750 lb tire rating. My guess is yours are the same.)

Yes, the tires I have are Michelin Load Rating E at 3,750 LBS at 80PSI each.
I am happy with the truck I have, its pulls my current TT with ease and using it to plow snow and commute to work makes it the right rig for me. I am certain if we decide to upgrade to a 5er, that one in the 10,000 lb range will not be a issue.

Dave Pelletier · 01-13-2025, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4ord

Because you’ve already bought the truck I would encourage you to look into exactly what components are different on your truck vs the F350 before committing to a lighter trailer. Your truck might actually be identical other than badging and stickers or it might be missing the overload springs? Brakes and axles are identical.

I'm not so sure the F250 and F350 SRW have identical axles in all cases; in 2022, the F250 got the Sterling 10.5 unless you ordered a diesel, heavy duty tow package or a Tremor which gave you the Dana M275.

My understanding for 2023+ is that there is now a Sterling 11.6 taking the place of the M275 but that the standard 10,000 GVWR F250 axle is still the 10.5"?

On edit; in the OP's case with the 6.7 PSD, I think his F250 will have the 11.6" Sterling. More info here: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...ll-2023-a.html

Cheers,
Dave