Why all the 1/2T negativity?

[RangeMaggotBob]

Why all the negativity? It's because if you don't drive a 3/4 or 1 ton truck, you don't drive a real man's truck! What's the matter with you? Seriously- you do your homework, check all your calcs and numbers for the RV you want, and sometimes a 1/2 ton fits the ticket. What works for some doesn't always work for others, and some people don't get that. They drive a big truck, and you should too.

[Norcolmille]

Thank you for ALL of the advice. Most of the posters here are experienced, beneficial and unbiased. I would love a new(er) F150 BUT the wife wants a fifth wheel. I have towed in the past and the safety and advantages of a spacious fifth wheel requires ( for us ) a f250 class truck.

I know the differences between a 350 and 250 class and I will not go as big to require a dual wheel rear. So a suitable 250 class is my choice.

I may add air bags ( if necessary ) and continue to read and learn here.
I am planning a 4-6 month snow bird role until we Full Time.

And WHY would anyone mount a 5th wheel hitch in a 150 class truck? And when we looked and inspected and read about the ultra light fifth wheel trailers we require more robust construction and features.


Thanks again for all of your inputs to the less experienced of the readers

[09 harley]

Originally Posted by drittal

Half-Ton Towing: Fact or Fiction?

Am I to assume that you posted this to tell us that if you want to tow a 5th wheel you need to go light and cheap if your using a 1/2 ton?
The lighter the RV is the lower the quality. You can"t have both light weight and long term durability. Just my opinion based on years of experience.

[09 harley]

Originally Posted by Cumminsfan

I think we are getting off the point here. Where this thread has slipped is when you lump all 1/2 tons into one package. Yes there are 1/2 tons with more CCC than 3/4 ton diesels. But I think what's happening is everyone is going in different directions when the topic of 1/2 tons and 5th wheels comes up. Almost all the time the topic comes up the OP already has a 1/2 ton truck and it's usually one of the lower CCC rated 1/2 tons. The thread starts morphing into you need a 3/4 ton truck and then it morphs into the F150 HD option.
No ones disputing that an HD F150 has the CCC to haul some of the 1/2 ton towable 5th wheels. Probably all of them. But what's normally the topic is the guy that has the Ram, Ford or GM 1/2 ton with 1400-1800lbs of CCC and wants to tow a 8000lb dry 5th wheel because his 1/2 ton can tow 11,000lbs he thinks he's fine.
Then the conversation turns into a payload rating discussion and then into you need a 3/4 ton truck and then into Fords HD 1/2 ton tows it, so why all the 1/2 ton negativity when you can tow it with the HD.
It's only 1/2 ton negativity when an OP doesn't have the proper 1/2 ton.

One of the best posts I've read. Well thought out and well written. My hat is off to you!

[09 harley]

Originally Posted by MarkyB

Towed my trailer with f-150 and then upgraded to f-250. My wife, who has no idea about weights, ratings, or any of that, says she feels much better in the 250, not nearly as nervous as when riding in the 150.

Happy wife happy life, nuff said...

Your wife knows that size matters, when choosing a truck.

[09 harley]

Originally Posted by Twilson

Hello, new to the site and have a question about the whole 1/2 ton thing.

I think I've got a pretty good handle on towing capacities, I guess my question is about gearing. We have a 2014 dodge ram 1500 quad cab 4x4 5.7l gas with 3:21 gears and the 8 speed tranny. Manufacturer puts towing with these gears at approx 8500lbs. Looking at getting a Creekside 20FQ which is advertised at 4400lbs dry, GVWR of approx 6k. The truck should pull this rig just fine, but should I be concerned with this gear ratio?

Thanks in advance.

Toby

The 3.21 ratio is for mileage not towing. Always better to spec tow vehicle to weight being towed. Remember that the F450 comes only with the 4.30 ratio. Ford knows that these are used for towing so they build accordingly. My 2017 F250 Super Duty CCLB has 4.30 as an option. Mileage in town is better and also better when towing. The penalty comes during freeway unloaded driving.
This is not to say that 3.21 won't work only that it is certainly not the best option. When time to upgrade go with a ratio that will perform better and don't depend on the dealer to give you good advice.

[09 harley]

Originally Posted by Norcolmille

Thank you for ALL of the advice. Most of the posters here are experienced, beneficial and unbiased. I would love a new(er) F150 BUT the wife wants a fifth wheel. I have towed in the past and the safety and advantages of a spacious fifth wheel requires ( for us ) a f250 class truck.

I know the differences between a 350 and 250 class and I will not go as big to require a dual wheel rear. So a suitable 250 class is my choice.

I may add air bags ( if necessary ) and continue to read and learn here.
I am planning a 4-6 month snow bird role until we Full Time.

And WHY would anyone mount a 5th wheel hitch in a 150 class truck? And when we looked and inspected and read about the ultra light fifth wheel trailers we require more robust construction and features.


Thanks again for all of your inputs to the less experienced of the readers

You may not go to a dually but you should consider the 350 for two reasons. It has a substantial increase in capacity and it only costs about $1200 more. No real reason not to. If you were looking at a trailer then the 250 would be great but when someone talks 5th wheels then the 350 is the choice. Just my opinion.

[drittal]

Originally Posted by 09 harley

Am I to assume that you posted this to tell us that if you want to tow a 5th wheel you need to go light and cheap if your using a 1/2 ton?

The lighter the RV is the lower the quality. You can"t have both light weight and long term durability. Just my opinion based on years of experience.

No, my whole point is many here have this idea that no 1/2 can tow anything besides a pop up without being outside ratings. While this may have been true 10 years ago, it is simply a false blanket statement today. Technology in both tow vehicles and towables has lowered weights and increased capacities. I'm not saying every 150 can tow a 5er or a 30' TT. What I am saying is things aren't what they were and if you actually crunch numbers it is possible.

[Cumminsfan]

Originally Posted by drittal

No, my whole point is many here have this idea that no 1/2 can tow anything besides a pop up without being outside ratings. While this may have been true 10 years ago, it is simply a false blanket statement today. Technology in both tow vehicles and towables has lowered weights and increased capacities. I'm not saying every 150 can tow a 5er or a 30' TT. What I am saying is things aren't what they were and if you actually crunch numbers it is possible.

To take this in another direction might be easier. I think there are many on RV forums that don't keep up with technology. If they don't read the latest news about RV and autos they fall behind. I think what you're seeing is two fold. Lots of misinformed readers. Too much categorizing.
1st being that yes the new trucks are quite capable but not all are capable.
2nd is many that are 1/2 ton negative don't know about the new trucks.
Those in the know, know.

[lonfu]

Here is my 2 cents worth on this. Yes, braking on a 1/2 ton is not the same as on a 3/4ton. Brakes are bigger and heavier and sometimes 4 wheel disc depending on the weight rating. But.... you can compensate for that with the trailer brakes and an adjustable brake controller.

Weight, you can buy an over load spring set for a 1/2 ton to make it a 3/4 ton, but you still have the brake size issue. So, if you are going to tow a heavy trailer, say 8k pounds, you need to add overload springs, weight distributing hitch and a high dollar electric brake controller. I've done it and it works fine.....

But!!!! don't expect to drive up the hills like a turbo charged one ton truck at the speed limit. You have to use your gears a lot more and the power range of your particular engine. Normally in the 2500 rpm range, so this means 35mph on a 8% grade. On a 10% grade you will be doing 25mph. Now for some folks to see other cars and RV's pass them just irks the bejesus out of them so they are willing to spend spend spend to make sure they do not get passed up by grandpa in his huge DP towing a 30 foot box trailer.

Other folks don't think working ones behind off to go fast up a hill is worth it. Can't tell you how many times I follow big trucks up a hill at 35mph because they "drive their vehicle" rather than try to race up a hill to satisfy their need for speed.....

[Cumminsfan]

1/2 ton brakes are designed to stop the truck and rated loads. Same for a 3/4 to and up. 1/2 tons actually stop quicker than 3/4 ton empty. So why would they not be able to stop a rated load?

[Ottawasteve]

Originally Posted by Cumminsfan

1/2 ton brakes are designed to stop the truck and rated loads. Same for a 3/4 to and up. 1/2 tons actually stop quicker than 3/4 ton empty. So why would they not be able to stop a rated load?

Because physics, and other logical arguments, do not apply in the 3/4 ton vs. 1/2 ton debate where everybody just knows and those with the least knowledge insist on sharing. The pounds used for measuring payload capacity in a 150/1500 are much lighter than the pounds used for measuring payload in a 250/350/2500/3500. The 470 ft/lbs of torque of the Gen2 Ecoboost in the F150 would only be 230 ft/lbs if it was in a F250 because otherwise it would mean that an F150 is more powerful than an F250 from 20 years ago, and that is impossible because everybody knows a 250/2500 will tow a trailer up a hill much faster than a 150/1500. It is the same flawed logic that allows every 150/1500 to tow the maximum trailer weight listed in the brochures.

[JIMNLIN]

Why all the 1/2T negativity?

JMO ....ignorance about 1/2 ton trucks in general.

Lets look at Ford Body service specs as their the most complete and easy for anyone to find and comprehend.
Ford give's their 1/2 ton truck 18 different GVWR from 6100 up to 8200 lbs
Ford gives their 1/2 ton trucks 5 different RAWR from 3300 up to 4800 RAWR.
The 7850-8200 GVWR truck with 4800 Rawr can easily carry 2300-2500 lbs in the bed and can pull a proper sized 5th wheel trailer.

Lots of '00-'06 1500HD GM trucks out here pulling 5th wheel trailers. These trucks are the old C6P chassis trucks with a 8600 GVWR and 6000 RAWR with up to 3k payloads 6.0 gasser 4L80 tranny with up to 10-11k lb tow ratings.
GM new 1500 with the NHT has a 7600 GVWR and 4600 RAWR 6.2 gasser 3.73 gears at 420 hp and 460 torque 6-8 speed tranny and 10k tow rating. These truck can carry up to the 2000-2200 lb range and easily out pull up the hill any diesel at their spec'd tow rating for the truck.

Dodge 1500 Mega cab sat on a full 2500 frame with a 8510 GVWR and 6000 RAWR 5.7 hemi. These truck were heavy but could carry up to 2800 lbs or so and 10k 5th wheel trailers.

Sure these trucks won't pull a 12k-18k 5th wheel trailers but will have no problems with smaller 5th wheel trailers we have out here.

Be informed and read the specs on all the 1/2 ton trucks.

[Skip426]

Originally Posted by 1361

I think it's based on educating people. There is so much conflicting and misinformation. It is dangerous to pull overloaded.

I'll admit up front that I haven't read all the posts in this thread. So this may be covered already.

Why is it that RV manufacturers are allowed to make a blanket statement " Half Ton Towable " and not have to qualify the statement by ads with a statement .
" Towable with a PROPERLY equipped Half Ton " , 3/4 or one ton .

Seems to me there is room for the " Truth in Advertising Laws " to be applied to RV, manufacturers.

BTW. As a qualifier , I towed my first 3 , 5ers with a 1993 V-8 Dodge Dakota, with an 1850 lb, payload package , all three 5ers, had pin weights that kept the RAWR & GVWR, within spec's , the third 5th put me over GCWR and caused overheating when the A/C was used.
Lesson learned at school of hard knocks.