I recently had my DirecTV system upgraded to an HS17 Genie 2 with C61W Wireless Genie Minis. This Genie uses a Digital Reverse Band LNB (3D2RBLNBR0-02) with 21 tuneable channels for UHD (4K) Programming.
I was using a couple of the Wireless Genie Minis in RV and decided to research what it would take to use the HS17 in the RV. The HS17 provides the power for the LNB and is only fully compatible LNB mentioned above.
I had a discussion with Winegard to see if they had any support for the Reverse Band LNB and they said no. Not even for the SK-SWM. They said Firmware in the Outside Control Unit (ODU) would need to be upgraded.
I wanted to eliminate the SWM8 Multiplexer, SWM Splitter and 29 volt Power supply that I had been using with an HR44.
After a bit of reading on converting an SK-3005 or SK-SWM from DirecTV to Dish by replacing the Parabolic Dish, LNB Arm and LNB and other materials, I determined it should be possible to use the Port C or the SK-3005 to talk SWM. First needed to check to make sure the ODU Software Version 1.04.18 or greater and the IDU Software Version was at 1.00.02 or greater which is required for the DirecTV to Dish Conversion.
The parts for the project were less than $100 with the most expensive part being a Winegard SWM3 Replacement Cable (RP-SK49). I was getting a Low LNB Voltage message on my Interior Control Unit (IDU) and figured it was probably the 4 coax cable from the Turret to the LNB causing the problem, so decided to get the SWM cable instead. Other parts included the LNB, 21 volt Power Injector, Water Tight F Type 75 Ohm Terminators and an AB Coax Switch.
The project started by manually commanding the IDU to raise the dish and then once dish was accessible disconnect power to IDU. All of the Coax cables were disconnected from the base of the SK-3005. Tested all cables entering the RV using a butt connector and terminator screwed in to each cable. Best cable was marked outside and inside and attached to Port C. Water tight 75 Ohm terminators were attached to Ports A, B and D on the base of the SK-3005. The LNB Landing Bracket was loosened an slid down the LNB arm. The LNB was removed, then the 4 Coax cable was disconnected from cable clamp and top of SK-3005 Turret then pulled up inside of arm and discarded with the LNB. The RP-SK49 was attached to the new LNB and slid down the inside of the arm. The cable was reattached with the cable clamp and attached to Port C on top of the SK-3005 Turret. Water tight 75 Ohm terminators were attached to Ports A, B and D on the top of the SK-3005 turret.
Back inside the 21 volt Power inserter was connected to the marked interior coax cable. IDU was connected to power, Power Button pushed which started automatic operation. Began connecting to antennae and did not fail with the Low LNB Power message. Multi-Sat was displayed and began searching for satellites. The new LNB only supports 99, 101 and 103 and the IDU was only able to find 101. The searching for satellites went through three iterations with only the 101 satellite being found each time. The final display showed *101 110 119. The whole process took 15 minutes. Having the IDU Manually acquire 101 may be a faster process.
Once the 101 satellite was acquired the IDU was disconnected from power and the 21 volt Power Injector was disconnected from interior coax. HS-17 was connected to interior coax and its power supply plugged in. Once the HS-17 was fully up a C61W was powered on and used to view satellite settings and signal strength. The setting were identical to those noted on the in the house connected to a DirecTV installed dish. The signal strength in the RV were actually slightly better on transponders with less than 100%.
Everything works as expected!!!
There is still an issue which I have seen raised in some forums. A DVR or Genie is powered on when the Winegard is attempting to find satellites. The IDU appears to get into a loop and never finds any satellites.
I found a document that talks to using the dish on the RV and a portable dish when the RV Dish can't get a signal. An AB Switch having the same specs as a SWM Splitter and with at least 25db of isolation between the coax connections is recommended. First problem is to find one, I have searched and searched and finally opted for a device with good isolation. Prior to using I did a number of tests the 75 Ohm terminators and power with no issues.
The AB Switch has 21 volt Power inserter on Port A, HS17 on Port B and Coax to SK-3005 to middle port. All power cords are attached to a single UPS. AB Switch is placed in A position. UPS is powered up which powers on all equipment. IDU is powered up and starts auto search. Once satellite is acquired AB Switch is changed to B and HS-17 finishes connecting to satellite.
For those of you with and HR54 the process would be the same as with the HS-17. Any other DVRs or Genies would still need to isolate themselves during the satellite acquisition by having an empty Port A with terminator but would use a SWM Splitter to pass the power to the LNB and once the satellite is acquired switch the AB Switch to B.
I am thinking about adding inline switches on the IDU and 21 volt power supplies so they can be switched off without having to unplug since they are no longer needed once the satellite is acquired.
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The HS17 has built in SWM Power Injector, Wireless Video Bridge, 4K Support, 2 TB Harddrive and can record 7 programs at once but only supports Wired and/or Wireless Genie Minis, no other DVRs or Receivers are allowed on the network.
The HS17 has built in SWM Power Injector, Wireless Video Bridge, 4K Support, 2 TB Harddrive and can record 7 programs at once but only supports Wired and/or Wireless Genie Minis, no other DVRs or Receivers are allowed on the network.
When you upgrade to the HS-17 it appears you have to get another mini genie, which, I believe, is another $7.00 per month. To me, it is nice that the HS-17 combines some devices, but not sure it would be worth the extra $7.00 per month.
I have the SK-3005 with the SWM-8 switch, and have been thinking of upgrading to the HR-54 to get 4K TV, but with the HR_54 having the 21 volt built in SWM power inserter, it may not work with the current configuration of my SK-3005.
Do you know if the SK-3005 with the SWM-8 switch can be converted to use the 21 volt power inserter in the HR-54, as you were able to do with the HS-17?
Thanks
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Paul J Stough Iowa
2005 Winnebago Voyage 38J
You are correct the HS17 doesn't have HDMI output and you have to have at least a single Genie Mini. The HS17 is not considered to be your Primary TV, so the Genie Mini counts as the Primary TV which is free.
You are correct about the HR54 having a built in 21 volt Power Inserter and it will not work with the SWM8 Kit. You could use a setup like was laid out in my initial post (SK-3005 with Reverse Band SWM LNB) to support the HR54 with 4K support.
Using a SWM Splitter on the SK-3005 with Reverse Band SWM LNB setup will allow the HR54 to support Wired Genie Mini/s (have to use C61K for 4K), DVR/s and other receiver/s on the MOCA network. If you would like to attach Wireless Genie Mini/s a Wireless Video Bridge would be required at a cost of $99. Please Note that the IDU cannot find satellites when a Genie or DVR is interrogating the satellite thus the need for a separate 21 volt Power Inserter to be connected during satellite acquisition.
My RV is wired with the old RG59 coax for OTA and Cable. I used a Wired Genie Mini (C41) with an HR44 and AM21 OTA Receiver for a while. For the most part it worked over the RG59 but from time to time there was pixelation and disconnects on the C41. I don't think the C61K would work over RG59 coax.
The HDMI output of the HR54 does not support 4K, only HD. The HR54 does count as the Primary TV which is free but all other devices are $7 per month.
My wife has an account that is used at home with an HR54 and C61K Wired Genie Minis (4K). My account is used strictly in the RV and consists of an HS17 and C61W Wireless Genie Mini's (HD). I am not using 4K at this time even though the TVs in the RV are 4K. The RV is parked to the side of the house and some of the Wireless Genie Mini's are used within the house.
If your Coach is wired with RG6 you should be able to pump 4K throughout using the C61K Wired Genie Mini.
The parts for the project were less than $100 with the most expensive part being a Winegard SWM3 Replacement Cable (RP-SK49).
Other than being a thinner cable, what is the reason you couldn't use an RG6 cable made up to 55 inches? I'm guessing that thin RP-SK49 cable has a tech designation like RG6 does.
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Bob & Leah, USN Retired
2016 Itasca Suncruiser 38Q/SOLD
2014 Chevy Equinox LTZ/Blue Ox Tow Bar
@papamiket - thank you for taking the time to post such tremendous detail. Very helpful! Question for you - my SK-3005 with the new 4K LNB keeps finding 101W but then continues searching and it found it a few times. But the process took much longer than 15 minutes. I have ordered the AB switch but in the meantime I turned off the Genie 2 and restarted the dish. Do you have any suggestions for how we get it to stop searching and find the satellites? We really need 99 and 103 since those are what is needed for HD channels showing the NFL Sunday ticket.
@Floridakamper - I called Winegard early this morning and the cable is just a single shielded wire with the same sheath that the default 4-wire LNB uses. The benefit of it is that it's the correct length. They did tell me a regular coax RG-6 cable will work but unless you cut and re-terminate the end you will have loose cable moving around the dish when its acquiring satellites. I suppose you could use duct tape to fasten it to minimize movement. The "custom" cable costs $30 plus shipping from Winegard.
First, hate to be the bearer of bad news - we do not officially support any SWM LNB (reverse band or non-RB) on the SK-3005. The electronics are not designed to operate with the SWM LNB and while operation may be possible in certain circumstances, it is not recommended as normal operation may be adversely affected.
Second, despite what our call center may have stated, we do not recommend using RG6 grade coax on the turret top/feed arm connection of the TRAV'LER. The cable is not designed for the movement the TRAV'LER makes and flexibility and tension may cause issues, which can lead to motor error messages to be incorrectly displayed.
@winegard - thanks for the update. I have a couple questions:
1) Has Winegard considered offering an upgrade path to keep SK-3005 dishes current with the latest in DIRECTV technology? Genies and 4K will soon become mainstream so it would be nice to be in a "supported" configuration with Winegard. We, as consumers, don't want to fiddle with the SK-3005 but it's hard to justify spending another $1500-$1800 for a new RV dish when mine gets so little use.
2) Does Winegard have a published roadmap for when the Genie 2 will be officially supported by the Trav'ler line?
Also, I agree with your note about the RG6 cable and was merely sharing what I was told by Winegard support. However, I did receive and install the new SWM cable from Winegard today.
Don't know how I missed this thread earlier. I am going thru thru the pains with the HS-17 and 3005.
And many thanks to papamiket for the info.
When the installer changed the LNB at the house did not change the reflector or arm. He just cut 3 of the 4 wires. The RB LNB fits on the SK 3005 and I read somewhere that the newer swm dish is slightly smaller it is not necessary to change it...smaller because the 99 and 103 are closer together and the 110 and 119 are no longer used.
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Frank & Nancy, Nashua, NH
2014 Phaeton QTH, Genesis GV 80 on trailer, Good Sam Life
@papamiket - Many thanks to you and your awesome write-up as we were having these same issues and after finding his write-up we were able to successfully get our SK-3005 and Genie 2 (HS-17) working together.
@EVandRV and I have successfully tested getting the Genie 2 & Wireless Genie Mini's working after upgrading to the SWM LNB (3D2LNB) and installing RP-SK49 replacement cable. We were previously running into similar issues that others have seen, including "Error Code 775" (resolved by LNB 3D2LNB upgrade) and then "No LNB Voltage" which we got past after ensuring the 21v power inserter was connected to the "C" port on the SK-3005. We also kept seeing the SK-3005 continue to search for additional satellites even after manually setting the IDU to only search for 101W, this was resolved by installed the A/B switch and pulling the IDU power right as 101W was acquired and identified.
We ended up getting all of the parts (or similar) used by @papamiket and as we went through testing scenarios we documented and created a diagram with the connectivity and process that worked for us.
WARNING NOTICE: Please know that Winegard does not recommend or support this modified configuration, so only attempt this at your own risk.
Hopefully this diagram & procedure will assist others that are trying to replicate the the setup created by @papamiket. I've attached both a PDF & PNG of this setup.
First, hate to be the bearer of bad news - we do not officially support any SWM LNB (reverse band or non-RB) on the SK-3005.
From my research, let me simplify your statement...We don't support SWM lnbs on any legacy equipment...period.
We are going through a significant transition with DirecTV. A lot of the existing installations are at risk of becoming boat anchors...that is unless we decide to move to Dish. They may be a lower tech supplier, but unlike DirecTV, they keep their customers informed of their long term changes and how it might affect them.
I am convinced that Winegard knows exactly what is up with DirecTV, they just won't say anything, including a path forward for their legacy customers, like a simple SWM lnb for their 18" dish. Easy to source, easy to change...
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Scott Brownstein
Palm Island, Florida
2015 Georgetown 335DS
I want to say thanks to @Papamiket and @AZRedBirds for the informative posts. I worked on my setup all weekend and still couldn't get it to work. I have 2 things that are different on my setup and if anyone know if this is the reason let me know.
1. I have an older Trav'ler. I have the LG-2112 not the SK-3005. Everything seems the same, but maybe the control unit has an older firmware.
2. I upgraded my LNB to the same one they put on my house, the 5D2RBLNBRO-01 SWM5.
When I followed the instructions from @AZRedBirds my dish never finds the 101 sat. Even when Peeking, it shows it's finding 119, but not 101. Could this be related to the LNB? I'm thinking I'll order the one @Papamiket said to get. I really want to get my RV to work with the HS-17.
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