Electrical Upgrades / Solar

[Blue74]

Setting here trying to work out items I want to add/upgrade on my trailer once I get to travel full time.

Wanting to replace the black box 12V charger (MagneTek 900 Series) but not sure which one I need/should use. Everything I have read it should be a Progressive Dynamics unit with Inteli-Power leaning towards the 9200 Series (because of the remote status pendant) but not sure which amperage I need? A guess is that amperage rating is for the charger portion of the converter. If I do all the upgrades to the trailer it will have 6 6V batteries and 7 solar panels. So to keep the charge up on the batteries would I need the 80 Amp. model? If the rating is for the amount of power to run all the 12V items in the trailer only then I guess I would need to figure each up for the total since I believe the "charger"� now on the trailer only chargers the batteries will not run the 12V circuits with out batteries installed.

Question 2.
I now have 3 solar panels (Siemens) on the roof with the controller (Solar Electric Specialties Company) and I believe that the controller cannot handle more panels; I no longer have the install manuals. So to install more panels (4) I would need to
(1) Change the controller to handle the extra panels, can you mix and match different panels from different manufactures, ratings, age?
(2) Add a second controller to handle the new panels making 2 separate solar systems.
(3) Can I ties the batteries together in to one grid (all 6 6V batteries) to be charged by option 1 or if I have to go with option 2 and basically have 2 solar systems do/should their output be separate?

Question/statement (3).
Planning on installing a Marquis Gold 5500 Watt LP Generator (5.5 HGJAB-1119) to run the larger appliances (washer/dryer, microwave, A/C) and when needed I plan to use smaller inverts (200W to 1250W) to power computers/entertainment equipment. Also I plan to install a Progressive Ind. Energy Management System (Surge Protection) and an Inteli-Power 5100 Series [50Amp/120VAC Transfer Switch to upgrade the electrical system in the trailer. Also plan on looking into changing the LP tanks to 40# from 30# to go from 15 Gal. to 20 Gal. on board.


Thoughts/Ideas.

Thanks Paul

[Blue74]

Setting here trying to work out items I want to add/upgrade on my trailer once I get to travel full time.

Wanting to replace the black box 12V charger (MagneTek 900 Series) but not sure which one I need/should use. Everything I have read it should be a Progressive Dynamics unit with Inteli-Power leaning towards the 9200 Series (because of the remote status pendant) but not sure which amperage I need? A guess is that amperage rating is for the charger portion of the converter. If I do all the upgrades to the trailer it will have 6 6V batteries and 7 solar panels. So to keep the charge up on the batteries would I need the 80 Amp. model? If the rating is for the amount of power to run all the 12V items in the trailer only then I guess I would need to figure each up for the total since I believe the "charger"� now on the trailer only chargers the batteries will not run the 12V circuits with out batteries installed.

Question 2.
I now have 3 solar panels (Siemens) on the roof with the controller (Solar Electric Specialties Company) and I believe that the controller cannot handle more panels; I no longer have the install manuals. So to install more panels (4) I would need to
(1) Change the controller to handle the extra panels, can you mix and match different panels from different manufactures, ratings, age?
(2) Add a second controller to handle the new panels making 2 separate solar systems.
(3) Can I ties the batteries together in to one grid (all 6 6V batteries) to be charged by option 1 or if I have to go with option 2 and basically have 2 solar systems do/should their output be separate?

Question/statement (3).
Planning on installing a Marquis Gold 5500 Watt LP Generator (5.5 HGJAB-1119) to run the larger appliances (washer/dryer, microwave, A/C) and when needed I plan to use smaller inverts (200W to 1250W) to power computers/entertainment equipment. Also I plan to install a Progressive Ind. Energy Management System (Surge Protection) and an Inteli-Power 5100 Series [50Amp/120VAC Transfer Switch to upgrade the electrical system in the trailer. Also plan on looking into changing the LP tanks to 40# from 30# to go from 15 Gal. to 20 Gal. on board.


Thoughts/Ideas.

Thanks Paul

[RustyJC]

1. The 91XX series converter uses the remote Charge Wizard. The 92XX has the function built into the converter.

2. I'll link your thread down into the RV Systems and Appliances area where it will get more visibility.

Rusty

[RV Wizard]

If your upgrades include a larger inverter, you should consider a model with a built in three stage charger. If no inverter is in the plans then the size of the charger will be first determined by the battery cable size. If you are going to install new cable, then you will want to determine how fast you will want/need to recharge the battery bank.
You can mix and math solar panels to a charge regulator capable to handlethe toatl amperage at peak performance.
You will not want o mix old and new batteries. If all are new they can be all tied together as one bank or designed to be multiple banks but the system is more difficult and costly.
Let us know what your upgrades are and what you are hoping to accomplish so we can better recommend a design.

[Blue74]

I had thought of using a larger inverter but since I have a, 200W, 300W, 800W and 1250W inverts already they can be used for the 120VAC items I would run while dry camping. The MagnaTex in the trailer now is wired in using Romex like the rest of the wiring in the trailer. It is mounted up front under the bedroom with its own 120VAC socket. It might be possible to move the new converter closer to the batteries but space is tight so I would have to run larger wire depending on the length of run. I would like the shortest recharge time when having to run the generator.

The batteries would all be new and the same age. I want to change out the 2 group 24's to 6V and add 4 more 6V batteries. They will be mounted off the frame on two different sides of the trailer.

What I am planning is to be able to dry camp for extended periods of time in area what my not have the solar panels working peak rates (Alaska and the Pacific Northwest) so the reason to go over kill on the number of panels and batteries. The generator would be the back up when I need to run items that would put too large of draw on an inverter (washer/dryer) or not run at all (A/C) or when the sun does not shine. So the larger converter would keep down the run time on the generator since I would have a limited amount of LP to run it.

Paul

[RV Wizard]

OK Paul. I would wire all the batteries as one bank. Add the solar panels and be sure to use a cable of sufficient size to hand and not prvide voltage drop to the battery bank. You may want to build a small battery charger from a small engine and an automotive altenator to recharge the battery bank rather than use the onboard converter. This is not to say the onboard converter/charger would not work, it is just slower and using the LP generator will use a lot of LP to fully recharge this size battery bank when it gets low.

[John Hilley]

I like multiple battery banks connected with a Perko battery switch. By using a Trimetric meter on each bank, charge level can be determined and use can be switched to the fully charged bank when one gets to near 50%. When charging from the generator, the switch can be set to both. Another advantage is that a bank with a bad battery can be isolated. The switch might also make the wiring easier when using banks on both sides of the trailer. I haven't decided yet whether it is better to use the solar to charge the bank in reserve or to assist the bank being used.

[Tincup]

With regards to the solar panels, you can mix manufaturers and use different wattage panels. However, do not mix panels with different voltage outputs. If your existing panels put out 19V make sure any panels you add are rated at 19V.

As mentioned on an earlier post, wire all of your batteries as one unit (series/paralles) and put all 6 as close together as possible like next to each other if at all possible.

If I were doing it, I'd replace the converter and all of your inverters with one pure sine wave inverter/charger something like the Magnum MS series. They have a three stage charger built in and when you're on shore or genny power it will automatically charge your batteries. There are several manufactures that build a like unit. This kind of installation, in my opinion, is easier to install, if problems crop up it's easier to troubleshoot. But that's just my opinion.


Paul

[Blue74]

Some usefull ideas for sure now I will have to rethink some of my plans and where and how to find room to install some of the items.

[Jeff_in_The_Dalles]

Regarding inverter/chargers, they are sized by their maximum output, so charging is reduced by whatever the load is from the 12v appliances being used.

The rule of thumb used to be that you took the amp hour capacity of your battery bank on the 20 hour scale and divide by 8 to get the maximum recommended charge rate. These electronically controlled converters regulate charging voltage at various stages, so I don't think it will push a charge faster than the batteries will handle.

You will likely need to run heavier 12v cable if you get the 80 (there's a thread on the toy hauler forum).

Stepping up and going with a inverter/charger might be worth considering, depending on how much 110v you plan on using.

Lastly, I've run into several campers who had big built in generators but still carry an EU2000 because it would run the battery charger for a long period of time on much less fuel.

[Blue74]

OK so here is where I am now.

I plan on adding four solar panels to give me a total of seven panels and around 450 watts of power and to install a new controller for the panels (thinking I would need one around 45 amps.).

Batteries will be limited by making a new location to mount more than the 2 (Group 24 for now) that are now on the trailer. There is a space on the opposite side of the trailer with enough room to mount 4 T-105 Trojan batteries but an access door and a roll out tray along with mountings would have to be made. This would add 248 pounds plus the weight of the tray. I would use welding cable to make the runs between the two battery packs.

It is still a toss up if I go with a new converter/charger or an inverter/charger. I have a 1500W/3000W peak inverter installed to run the entertainment center items (27"� TV-VCR-DVD-Satellite receiver-desktop computer-printer). For the TV in the bedroom I have a 200W or a 300W inverter that will plug into a 12V socket. The only other item I would want to run on an inverter would be the microwave (1100W output / 1600W input). Items like the washer/dryer and A/C I would need to run off a generator.

There is no prebuilt location on the trailer for a generator so it would have to be made. There is an access door in the front of the basement under the overhang that could work. I would need to build a sub frame to support the generator and also make it removable for repair. An enclosure to seal the area and for noise would also have to be built. The reason for going with an LP generator is to keep from having to install and use a gas tank on the trailer. But with the trailer having two 30# tanks I feel the need to modify the present mount and use two 40# tanks to increase capacity.

This would solve the problem of how to transport a portable generator since Alfa does not have a rear bumper or a receiver mount on back. On my last trailer (24' Kropf) I had added extra extended bike rack mounts and built a sealed and lockable box to mount a Yamaha 1000 that would take care of power but not the A/C. I have thought of adding two receivers off the frame and making a platform to mount a toolbox and installing the generator inside. This way I could still wire it in and yet remove it for repairs. I think I would still go with LP to keep from having to mount a gas tank someplace.

The dilemma I am having with a generator is the cost to use factor. It would be nice to be able to power everything (not at the same time) and to have back up when there is not much sunshine or battery usage goes up or the need to run the A/C. The cost between a Marquis 3600W and a 5500W is very small so weight (172 to 290) would be the biggest difference. The option would be to use a EU3000is or two but then the problem of where to carry them and setting them up for use. Also the cost of purchasing two 3000's plus the parallel kit and then a remote start system would be more than a single large generator but would offer the option of using only one when needed. I can see more time will be needed to make this decision. Of course they just introduced a new EU6500i but it look like you would need to use a 30A and 20A plug to be able to get the 45.8 A. You can get a remote start switch. The owner manual is not clear if this can be done.

The thinking goes on...

[Jeff_in_The_Dalles]

Wow, modifying the trailer for the generator, adding all this stuff, more mods for the battery box...

This could get to be a real pain. I'd also be very careful about making a generator compartment...

Battery wise, if you have height were they are installed and weight bearing capacity, you might think about the Trojan T125, or taller T145. They are 240 and 260 amp hour, respectively, compared to 225 for the T105. L16 series are very tall and heavy, but have a small footprint and are 420 amp hours.

Maybe you could install a fuel tank and generator in the truck?

Anyway, if you did have a generator big enough to run the washer/dryer, I'd presume you would just need the solar/battery capacity to last between laundry days...

[Blue74]

Well I got an idea and looked at a scale ticket from back in 04 when I put everything in the trailer and had gotten rid of everything else from storage. So everything I own is now in the trailer and truck. I look like I won't be adding extra batteries and a generator; at most I will update the converter/charger and putting in a surge protection for the whole trailer I may go so far as adding a switch over relay. If I go with a generator it will be a EU3000is and carry it in the truck. The change in plans? I have 11540 on the trailer axels and the sticker show 11780 GVWR! So to add over 1000 pounds to the trailer would just be looking for trouble.

Back to the drawing board.

[Jeff_in_The_Dalles]

Well, at least you could probably improve battery charging quite a bit with a better converter/charger...

Generator wise, if you are looking at the EU3000 you might consider two EU2000's and parallel kit if you will be getting the generator in and out of the truck (the EU3000 is pretty heavy).