Inexpensive Chinese Lithium battery worth trying or stick with Battleborn?

[Isaac-1]

I am familiar with the JBD BMS, my 200 AH Rebel batteries have the 100A version of it with the Bluetooth module. I can understand the roll your own approach, though I opted to buy pre-built drop in batteries, mainly for 2 reasons, I have enough projects that keep getting put on the back burner, and I feel they have a cleaner more professional appearance. My pair of batteries, which total 420AH came to just under $1,500 delivered, but they do have a 5 year warranty, and ReBel battery is based in Lake Jackson, TX so if it comes down to it, I can drive over there in about 4 hours and beat on their door if there is a warranty issue. Something that is harder to do when buying bare cells from a vendor in China.


Ike


p.s. be aware some versions of the JBD app has mistakes like showing the wrong units on certain line items, ie showing amps when reading in tenths of amps, ...

[HarryStone]

Originally Posted by CJBROWN

Which one did you get Harry?




Yeah, leaning this way. If it's not battleborn then SOK, right???

Would be pretty easy to setup a low-temp on the SCC, but not so much for the converter/charger or DC to DC on startup.

Did you guys update your converter/charger? My IOTA IQ4 was state of the art when it was installed.

Mine were Shunbin, but they apparently not available, at least at this time.

[RoadTrip2084]

Originally Posted by Isaac-1

I am familiar with the JBD BMS, my 200 AH Rebel batteries have the 100A version of it with the Bluetooth module. I can understand the roll your own approach, though I opted to buy pre-built drop in batteries, mainly for 2 reasons, I have enough projects that keep getting put on the back burner, and I feel they have a cleaner more professional appearance. My pair of batteries, which total 420AH came to just under $1,500 delivered, but they do have a 5 year warranty, and ReBel battery is based in Lake Jackson, TX so if it comes down to it, I can drive over there in about 4 hours and beat on their door if there is a warranty issue. Something that is harder to do when buying bare cells from a vendor in China.


Ike


p.s. be aware some versions of the JBD app has mistakes like showing the wrong units on certain line items, ie showing amps when reading in tenths of amps, ...

Yeah, at that price unless I needed something special that wasn't readily available it quickly becomes diminishing returns for the DIY approach. I predict in another year or so feature-complete and price-competitive off-the-shelf 12v batteries will be so plentiful the DIY approach won't make much sense other than as a fun project.

This battery tech is amazing and only getting drastically less expensive every year.

[Marine359]

Originally Posted by Isaac-1

What each person has to decide is where do they choose to strike the balance between cost, build quality, warranty and support. Do you mind buying from a fly by night, no name brand with no contact information in the US for warranty claims, if they even have a warranty. How about the small shop, one man show selling customized batteries, do you prefer a bigger company like Renogy who has been active in the US selling solar panels and other solar accessories for about a decade, or maybe you prefer a dedicated LiFePo4 premium brand with premium level of support and very long warranty like Battleborn, that is somewhere between a one man shop, and a big company.

Buying a battery assembled in the US with a customer service department you can actually talk to on the phone, and a warranty that you’ll have no problem redeeming is comforting to me on something that costs as much as a LiFePo4. There are a few US companies that sell batteries at 30-50% less than Battleborn. I’d never buy a Chinese LiFePo4 online from a company that doesn’t have a customer service phone number. Just me being overly cautious I guess. I’m pleased as punch with my year-ago LiFePo4 purchase from Bigbattery. It’s got a BMS every bit as good as BB, and some features I use regularly that BB doesn’t even offer.

[Isaac-1]

That is part of why I bought mine from ReBel Batteries which sells made in China batteries assembled to their custom specs. If it comes down to it on warranty issues, I can drive to location and beat on the door as they are based in Lake Jackson, TX about a 4 hour drive from my house.

[CJBROWN]

Originally Posted by RoadTrip2084

Good points. For RV usage cold temp charging cutoff seems like a really good idea.

For reference, I'm in the process of building my own 280Ah RV battery. I'm using 4 x "Grade A" EVE LiFePO4 cells with a JBD Smart BMS (200A).

The BMS has Bluetooth + app and is highly configurable, features multiple temperature probes, and even has output to run heater pads automatically if temps drop below the configurable threshold (charge current is used to heat the pads instead of charge the battery until the "warm enough to charge" temp is met on all sensors).

The whole thing will fit inside a standard plastic Group 24 battery box, and is costing me a little under $700.

Of course, it's up to me to assemble, configure, and operate it safely/effectively. If any component fails, it is warrantied but collecting on that warranty is likely a complex and difficult proposition. Not for everyone.

I finally went this route as well. I couldn't find the level of quality assurances warranty and features I wanted for what I wanted to spend.
Will Prowe's DIY solar forum is a wealth of information and help. And they have vendors they've vetted and endorse, so I ordered four of the Eve 230Ah cells from a US warehouse, and a Overkill Solar bms, and I'll build up my own pack. I'll get all the whistles and bells for about 40% less than Battleborn. Plus this way I'll be able to troubleshoot it myself. Great when you can be your own warranty service.

BTW fellas, PowerMax has a new converter/charger unit just out, specifically designed for lifepo4, in 55A and 100A capacities. It's a 2-stage optional with user-set-able voltage levels for charge and float. Just what the doctor ordered for lithium packs. I got mine yesterday, to replace my IOTA with IQ4. It was a fantastic charger for FLA, just not so much for lithium.

With 600W of solar I'm going to see if the combination of that and shorepower/genset with the new charger will keep us in the green, sans updating charging for alternator. Seems Victron Orion is the way to go for this, they're just kind of spendy. No, you can't just connect your lithium pack to your isolator, you're likely to burn up your alternator.

I'm also switching my generator lead over to the chassis battery - it has it's own solar maintainer so it's always full. Worst case you can jump house to chassis.
Isolator/booster is going bye-bye.

Linky: https://powermaxconverters.com/produ...ithium-series/

Friends don't let friends buy Renogy. You ever try to call them for help????

PowerMax PM3-55LKL lithium 2-stage. Yes, the image has the old label/part number.

[augie1955]

I found the easiest and biggest bang for your buck is to build your own packs out of Lifepo4 cells. Then you have insight on how it works and can replace or repair your own batteries at a component level and not rely on a manufacturer in China to warranty your product. Although the raw cells are extremely reliable, I have built over a dozen packs and never saw one fail.



Pre-Built packs cut corners and you don't know what's inside. If you build yourself, you know exactly what you are getting and can size it exactly to your needs.



Here is a video that mentions this stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPIKWUa6CSY&t=2s

[CJBROWN]

Originally Posted by augie1955

I found the easiest and biggest bang for your buck is to build your own packs out of Lifepo4 cells. Then you have insight on how it works and can replace or repair your own batteries at a component level and not rely on a manufacturer in China to warranty your product. Although the raw cells are extremely reliable, I have built over a dozen packs and never saw one fail.



Pre-Built packs cut corners and you don't know what's inside. If you build yourself, you know exactly what you are getting and can size it exactly to your needs.



Here is a video that mentions this stuff.

Yeah, that's Will Prowse, he's gained quite the notoriety on all things solar energy. He started a very nice forum with a bunch of really talented members, and lots of noobies wanting to learn. His video series gets millions of views, and he does a ton of product reviews. Very reliable source of information on all things solar and lifepo energy storage.

I found the same thing buying verses building - shopped and researched till I dropped - finally decided to build my own battery pack. The cells arrived yesterday, 4 each of Eve LF230A 3.2V cells to make up in series. Verses my two GC2's I get twice the capacity and half the weight and size with lifepo4. The other big advantage is level voltage output throughout the discharge - no voltage sag like you get with FLA. And no self-discharge, so they don't go dead just sitting.

I did update all of my charge sources - a dc to dc charger from Victron for the alternator, updated the charge profile on my solar controllers, and replaced the 120 to 12V converter/charger as mentioned upthread.

I'll have about a grand in the update, maybe a bit more, but about half of what I initially thought it might cost based on off-the-shelf (OTS) LiFePo4 battery packs (like battleborn).

I would post some pics but this stupid forum still blocks photobucket images.

[Perryb67]

Originally Posted by CJBROWN

I would post some pics but this stupid forum still blocks photobucket images.

Are you using the paid version or the free version? My free pictures wouldn't work on forums, that's why it's free, but for personal use only and limited picture size.

Enjoy,

Perry

[CJBROWN]

Originally Posted by Perryb67

Are you using the paid version or the free version? My free pictures wouldn't work on forums, that's why it's free, but for personal use only and limited picture size.

Enjoy,

Perry

I've had a paid account for many years, from before they ended the free program and dumped everybody. Old news. This forum just never caught up.

[Isaac-1]

The reason forums block photobucket images is so the archive of message threads don't become useless in a year or two with hundreds of missing images.

[CJBROWN]

Originally Posted by Isaac-1

The reason forums block photobucket images is so the archive of message threads don't become useless in a year or two with hundreds of missing images.

Which is completely false. None of my images have ever been missing. The policy is bogus.

[Isaac-1]

Yours may not, but that is not true for the majority of older threads on most boards where allow photo bucket

[tap4154]

Originally Posted by CJBROWN

Which is completely false. None of my images have ever been missing. The policy is bogus.

I stopped using Photobucket years ago when they tried to extort us after allowing us free accounts for so many years. In fact I still get incessant emails from them trying to extort me into paying them or they're going to delete my account, but I don't care because I have all the pictures on other drives anyway.

This forum is great, because you can just directly upload your pictures from your phone or computer. Then next time Photobucket decides to extort its users again, the pictures won't disappear.